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Log from 2006-06-03:
--- Day changed Sat Jun 03 2006
00:14 -!- joda_bot [n=anonymou@dslb-084-061-053-222.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit ["on the run"]
00:37 <Lucifer_arma> "These two questions are inherently related and apparently not answered here. This is likely due to the fact that it's asked so much that we're busy answering it for someone else right this minute. Hopefully we'll get to a good treatment of it here sometime soon."  <--- I think I'm so witty
00:58 -!- [Xpert]DarkStar [n=pso@84-74-43-82.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #armagetron
01:01 <[Xpert]DarkStar> good morning everyone
01:03 <Lucifer_arma> #morning
01:03 -!- GodTodd [n=GodTodd@67-42-207-93.albq.qwest.net] has quit ["User pushed the X - because it's Xtra, baby"]
01:03 <armabot> Good Morning Lucifer_arma! Random Fortune:  BOFH Excuse #301: || appears to be a Slow/Narrow SCSI-0 Interface problem
01:03 <Lucifer_arma> er, morning :)
01:04 <[Xpert]DarkStar> #morning
01:04 <armabot> Good Morning [Xpert]DarkStar! Random Fortune:  The Celts invented two things, Whiskey and self-destruction.
01:04 <[Xpert]DarkStar> hmm isn't that one and the same thing?
01:06  * Lucifer_arma wonders if the Celts invented self-destruction
01:07 <[Xpert]DarkStar> hrhr
01:08 <Lucifer_arma> finally got back my colored directory listings and made a pretty prompt :)
01:09 <[Xpert]DarkStar> hehe
01:55 <spidey> tuesday is 6/6/06
01:57 <[Xpert]DarkStar> yup
02:02 <Lucifer_arma> wooo satan
02:06 <spidey> lol
02:21 -!- philippeqc [n=ph@c83-250-130-90.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #armagetron
02:22 <philippeqc> morning
02:22  * philippeqc is sitting at his gf's computer, far from his code.
02:22 <guru3> haha
02:23 <philippeqc> well, I'll make good use of this time, and study more C++
02:25 <philippeqc> anyone knows what lacking fundamentals Louven is talking about?
02:26 <guru3> i'm not quite there yet on the forums
02:30 <guru3> and nope i don't know
02:47 <Lucifer_arma> tab completion?  shuffling rank?
02:48 <Lucifer_arma> music?  configurable hud?
02:48 <guru3> hrhr
02:48 <Lucifer_arma> camera work in general?
02:48 <Lucifer_arma> or does he want the magic "no lag" code that's a physical impossibility?  And he's going to hold it against us personally?
02:48 <guru3> i dunno :/
02:49 <Lucifer_arma> don't know how important it is, even tightening up the game has required a certain amount of rewriting, and doing more of the same requires more of the same
02:49 <Lucifer_arma> coincidentally, so do all the new features and game modes
02:49 <guru3> i like the rabbit hunter idea tho
02:50 <Lucifer_arma> ack.  Sorry, I kept my irritation on the forums, I'm just dumping it here.
02:50 <Lucifer_arma> Yes, I like the rabbit hunter idea too.  I'll bet we can reach it with current code, too.
02:50 <guru3> two seperate teams really
02:50 <Lucifer_arma> it is also a variation on a grid game we play on swampland, actually
02:50 <guru3> and then team switching
02:51 <philippeqc> I've had one pm exchange with Louven, hopefully more will come
02:52 <Lucifer_arma> you kknow he's oscilloscope, right?
02:52 <Lucifer_arma> it only says so over his avatar :)
02:52 <philippeqc> but I started thinging bout something he said about rubber, basically (my interpretation) that it was the wrong answer
02:52 <philippeqc> yes I kno
02:52 <philippeqc> just showing respect to his new nick
02:53 <philippeqc> so anyway, I was thinking, what was rubber trying to fix beside network latencies. 
02:53 <philippeqc> and its cycle width.
02:53 <Lucifer_arma> how so?
02:54 <philippeqc> (using the "its done like that in the movie arguement") Recall the scene where 2 good guys "grind" each other, and the bad guy smashes into their trace, as the space for it to pass is too small
02:55 <Lucifer_arma> ok, recalled
02:55 <philippeqc> our solution is that one of the 2 good guys have to do a good grind, and the bad guy trys to beat it/ gets surprised and crash
02:55  * Lucifer_arma isn't convinced :)
02:56 <philippeqc> the movie solution was taht the 2 good guys try to close it below the width of the following cycle, and then bad guy cant follow
02:56 <Lucifer_arma> recall also that neither of them cross his path
02:57 <philippeqc> yes, he dies because his cycle width is more than the space available for him (ok, he is also off center, so half his cycle with > space between his trajectory and the nearest trace)
02:57 <Lucifer_arma> and in our game he'd be accelerating between the two walls
02:57 <philippeqc> if he has space to be there, yes.
02:58 <Lucifer_arma> I don't know that it's a correction for cycle width, it doesn't seem terribly difficult to add cycle width, after all
02:58 <Lucifer_arma> I could be wrong
02:59 <Lucifer_arma> but there's another thing it does allow for that the game requires, and I think we need to take another look at default local game settings :)
02:59 <Lucifer_arma> without rubber, it's nearly impossible to get close enough to a wall to be accelerated by it
02:59 <Lucifer_arma> but if you can't get close to a wall, you can't accelerate
03:00 <philippeqc> humm, ok, rubber isnt a fix for cycle width, it just that it offered a mecanism where cycle width was AS required.
03:01 <Lucifer_arma> global and static variables are created before main() starts being executed, right?  (dumb question, I suppose0
03:01 <philippeqc> but it created the mentality of trying to outgrind the one in front of you. 
03:01 <philippeqc> (yes I'd say they are)
03:01 <Lucifer_arma> I think that mentality would have been there, but it'll be harder when there is cycle width
03:01  * Lucifer_arma thinks we need cycle width anyway
03:01 <philippeqc> me too
03:02 <Lucifer_arma> configurable, of course, maybe ultimately defined by a cycle profile that includes model and some physical characteristics
03:02 <Lucifer_arma> what we have now though is "Can I beat that grind?".  A better question is "Can I fit in there after I beat that grind?"
03:03  * spidey has beat just about every grind atleast once xD
03:03 <spidey> lucis multiple times :p
03:04  * Lucifer_arma isn't a grinder :)
03:04  * philippeqc think your splitting hair now. But it has created a mentality about grinding better than your opponent, where cycle widht would be "too small to pass, dangerous to attempt or thanks for the opening"
03:04  * Lucifer_arma prefers to use tactical superiority and quick wits rather than good finger-twitching
03:04 <spidey> lol
03:05 <Lucifer_arma> you're probably right, philippeqc  :)
03:05 <spidey> if there's a opening i'll take it :p
03:06 <Lucifer_arma> I'll tell you wht I am getting tired of, even though it hasn't happened lately.
03:06 <Lucifer_arma> I'm getting tired of being told that some kill was luck or lag
03:06 <spidey> ?
03:06 <philippeqc> the difference with grinding is that a more skilled player will probably overgrind what ever you can throw at him, and with cycle width, you can effectivly lock him out. The first case become a race to produce better grinder
03:06 <spidey> yea
03:06 <spidey> everytime a sp member dies,you can bet 70% of the time it's lag :p
03:06 <Lucifer_arma> right, and 29.9% of it is luck
03:06 <spidey> yea
03:07 <philippeqc> humm, yes there is a whining mentality floating around.
03:07 <spidey> .1% it's wd
03:07 <spidey> atleast i give credit where it's due
03:07 <spidey> i mean almost all of them have below a 90 ping
03:07 <Lucifer_arma> I see your point philippeqc, and I'm gonna have to say I can't argue it.  Better to bring in cycle width and see how it goes, I think.
03:08 <Lucifer_arma> the thing that irritates me about luck/lag is that it seems like the victim either couldn't believe he died, or couldn't believe you did what you did on purpose
03:08 <philippeqc> I'm just trying to explore what Louven is saying.
03:08 <Lucifer_arma> and for that I'd rather wait for an explanatio of what he means by fundamentals.  :)
03:09 <spidey> yea luci
03:09 <Lucifer_arma> I can't say we've neglected any, and I can't see how it's an effective use of developer resources to devote all development to that sort of thing
03:09 <Lucifer_arma> if there were only 2 or 3 developers, sure, I could agree with him without needing an explanation.  There are a lot of things I'd class fundamental that need to be done.
03:10 <philippeqc> I'm just exploring what he is (might be) saying. Sometimes your biggest opponent turn out to be the one that can help you the most.
03:10 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: I get that shit in real life, too.  :)  I hit and killed a bee in the air with a drumstick once upon a time, and the friends that saw it said it was luck.
03:10 <spidey> lmfao
03:10 <spidey> wanna play cvs?
03:10 <Lucifer_arma> I agreed I may not be able to repeat it, it was hard!
03:11 <Lucifer_arma> nah, I'm working on the sound engine.  :)
03:11 <spidey> lol,k
03:11 <Lucifer_arma> trying to get it to a state where I can really fool with it.  It's in pretty piss-poor condition right now.
03:11 <spidey> where'd cvs go?
03:11 <spidey> i can't find it on the list
03:11 <Lucifer_arma> renamed to something
03:11 <philippeqc> bugfarm
03:12 <spidey> ah
03:12 <spidey> i see it
03:12 <philippeqc> z-man was looking for alternative names, possibly including test in it... Ever since, mine has been stuck with "test-icules" as a proposal... Nothing I could post on the forum ;)
03:12 <spidey> lol
03:13 <Lucifer_arma> The Test-icle Vestible?
03:14 <Lucifer_arma> spidey makes people say gay things, does that make him a ventriloqueer?  <--- worst joke I've ever told
03:14 <spidey> heh
03:14 <spidey> i don't make them!
03:15 <spidey> it's volunterly
03:16 <spidey> yea
03:16 <spidey> lag/slide/luck
03:16 <philippeqc> gay ventriloquuer, that bring a new meaning to "having a hand down the back of the puppet"
03:16 <spidey> those 3
03:16 <philippeqc> ok, back to studying.
03:16 <Lucifer_arma> I'm inclined to take slides at face value, I die often enough because of slides
03:17 <Lucifer_arma> and I'll tell someone it was luck when I killed them while sliding crazily
03:17 <spidey> yea here lately i get slides every now and then
03:17 <spidey> but really.....
03:18 <spidey> after hearing them say it everytime :/
03:18 <Lucifer_arma> but if you're watching, you can tell that I'm telling the truth anyway.  :)  How often do I die just driving long straight lines and then hit a wall?
03:18 <spidey> lol
03:18 <Lucifer_arma> hell, how often do I drive long straight lines to begin with?  ;)
03:18  * spidey pleads the 5th
03:18 <Lucifer_arma> no, when I kill myself doing something stupid, I'll usually say so :)
03:19 <Lucifer_arma> especially if I just killed myself doing the same stupid things the last round, heh
03:19 <spidey> lol
03:28 -!- z-man-home [n=manuel@p5087199B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #armagetron
03:28 <spidey> sp brag to much too :/
03:58 -!- philippeqc [n=ph@c83-250-130-90.bredband.comhem.se] has quit ["Leaving"]
04:11 <Lucifer_arma> if I multiple a float by an int, the resulting data type is int, right?
04:11  * Lucifer_arma feels like asking dumb questions tonight, apparently
04:12 <Lucifer_arma> also, if I dynamic_cast something with virtual methods, and then call the virtual method, the implementation in the subclass still gets called, right?
04:12 <Lucifer_arma> none of that "oooooh, let's call the base class instead" garbage, right?
04:21 -!- philippeqc [n=philippe@c83-250-130-90.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #armagetron
04:23 <philippeqc> back
04:28 <philippeqc> lucifer: trying to compile svn trunk got me the following:
04:28 <philippeqc> In file included from ../../src/engine/eSoundMixer.h:48,
04:28 <philippeqc>                  from ../../src/tron/gArmagetron.cpp:38:
04:28 <philippeqc> ../../src/engine/sound/sdl_mixer/eChannelSDLMixer.h:39:27: error: base/eChannel.h: No such file or directory
04:31 <Lucifer_arma> ah oh
04:32 <philippeqc> src/engine/sound/base is an empty directory here
04:32 <Lucifer_arma> can you take file uploads?  I can't commit what I've got, it's totally destablize the trunk
04:32 <Lucifer_arma> but that file is untouched
04:32 <Lucifer_arma> hmm, wait, can I commit one file by itself?
04:32  * Lucifer_arma seems to think so
04:33 <Lucifer_arma> ok, update and try again
04:33 <Lucifer_arma> it should download that file now
04:34 <philippeqc> got the file
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04:51 <philippeqc> brb
04:51 -!- philippeqc [n=philippe@c83-250-130-90.bredband.comhem.se] has quit ["Leaving"]
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04:55 <philippeqc> back
05:02 <Lucifer_arma> did it build?
05:04 <philippeqc> yes
05:04 <philippeqc> got so many sparks in my face
05:26 <Lucifer_arma> umm, default is still the old sparks :)
05:27 <Lucifer_arma> anybody know how to coerce m4 to let me put color codes in configure.ac?
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06:43 <philippeqc_> test
06:49 <Luke-Jr> wtf? the game icon isn't a resource, nor required to do anything w/ the game
07:42 <wrtlprnft>      Binaries will be installed in      : ${prefix}/bin
07:42 <wrtlprnft>      Static data will be installed in   : ${prefix}/share/games/armagetronad-dedicated
07:42 <wrtlprnft>      Configuration will be installed in : ${prefix}/etc/games/armagetronad-dedicated
07:42 <wrtlprnft>      Documentation will be installed in : ${datadir}/doc/games/armagetronad-dedicated
07:42 <wrtlprnft> i bet that's not intended
07:44 <wrtlprnft> it used to replace ${prefix} with the actual prefix
07:48 <Luke-Jr> it shouldn't
07:48 <Luke-Jr> make is supposed to do that
07:49 <Luke-Jr> since prefix can change before then
07:49 <wrtlprnft> hmm, ok
07:53 -!- z-man-home [n=manuel@p5087199B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]
08:30  * Luke-Jr throws MCP attack into private/
08:31 <wrtlprnft> o_O
08:32 -!- z-man-home [n=manuel@p5087199B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #armagetron
08:32 <wrtlprnft> looks like gtk_engines_qt has a memory leak :(
08:33 <wrtlprnft> s/_/-/g
08:43 <Luke-Jr> that would explain where my memory goes...
08:43 <Luke-Jr> oh crap
08:43  * Luke-Jr needs to be back awake for work in 5 hrs
08:43 <Luke-Jr> <.<
08:43 <Luke-Jr> g'night!
08:49 <wrtlprnft> night
09:03 <philippeqc_> wrtlprnft: I think  OutputIterator set_union( InputIterator1 first1, InputIterator1 last1,
09:03 <philippeqc_> InputIterator2 first2, InputIterator2 last2, OutputIterator result,
09:03 <philippeqc_> Compare comp);
09:03 <philippeqc_>   is acting up on me.
09:04 <wrtlprnft> what's wrong with it?
09:04 <wrtlprnft> the containers need to be sorted
09:04 <philippeqc_> it is calling my "comp" object, but it seem to disregard the result and do the comparaison itself
09:04 <philippeqc_> they are.
09:05 <philippeqc_> but if I want to do a union of [3] and [4 5 6], it gives me [4 5 6 3]
09:05 -!- MaZuffeR [n=MaZuffeR@darkmoor.sby.abo.fi] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
09:06 <wrtlprnft> sort again?
09:06 <philippeqc_> so I decided to fool it, and inverted the result of "comp", and it produce the same output
09:06 <philippeqc_> shouldn't union produce a sorted result????
09:06 <wrtlprnft> does it say that anywhere?
09:07  * philippeqc_ check the doc for that, but it would be crazy if it didnt , because a set is SUPPOSED to be sorted at any time
09:24 <philippeqc_> ok, now it even populates in the wrong order! 
09:25 <philippeqc_> starting to suspect that set doesnt like to hold shared_ptr<Base> objects
09:26 <philippeqc_> it say that "The set class implements a sorted collection of values. "
09:31 <wrtlprnft> uh, second
09:31 <wrtlprnft> what does operator < do?
09:31 <wrtlprnft> compare the pointers or compare the contents?
09:32 <wrtlprnft> can't you just derive something from shared_ptr that overloads the < operator?
09:32 <wrtlprnft> std::sets don't support anything else but operator<, i think
09:33 <philippeqc_> depends on the type presented.
09:33 <philippeqc_> but I'm using set_union(w,x,y,z,out,compare), and giving my own compare object
09:34 <philippeqc_> but I'm also thinking that  "<" is comparing pointers during creation. But that is a second prob
09:34 <wrtlprnft> that is your problem
09:34 <wrtlprnft> (emphasize "is")
09:34 <wrtlprnft> you're creating them one after another, right?
09:34 <wrtlprnft> so, first you have a set of 4,5,6
09:35 <wrtlprnft> so, first you have a set of 3
09:35 <wrtlprnft> then you create another one of 4,5,6
09:35 <wrtlprnft> no, other way...
09:35 <wrtlprnft> anyways, if std::set sorts by operator< it will basically sort by creation time
09:36 <philippeqc_> my prob is 
09:36 <philippeqc_> I create [4 5 6]
09:36 <philippeqc_> then I create [3]
09:36 <philippeqc_> then I do a set_union and get [4 5 6 3]
09:36 <philippeqc_> share_ptr overwride operator<
09:36 <philippeqc_> template<class T, class U>
09:36 <philippeqc_>   bool operator<(shared_ptr<T> const & a, shared_ptr<U> const & b); // never throws
09:36 <philippeqc_>     Returns: an unspecified value such that
09:36 <philippeqc_>         * operator< is a strict weak ordering as described in section 25.3 [lib.alg.sorting] of the C++ standard;
09:36 <philippeqc_>         * under the equivalence relation defined by operator<, !(a < b) && !(b < a), two shared_ptr instances are equivalent if and only if they share ownership or are both empty
09:37 <philippeqc_> http://www.boost.org/libs/smart_ptr/shared_ptr.htm
09:39 <wrtlprnft> yes, but shared_ptr::operator< is a different thing than your comp object
09:40 <wrtlprnft> therefore your set stuff will produce different results than expected
09:40 <philippeqc_> the following is my own object passed to set_union as a comparator. line "bool e = (c < d);" uses the operator< of Base (or the appropriate type)
09:40 <wrtlprnft> actually unpredictable results
09:40 <wrtlprnft> > The elements in the two ranges must have been sorted using the comp function object.
09:41 <wrtlprnft> (c++ annotations)
09:41 <wrtlprnft> and in your case, they weren't.
09:41 <wrtlprnft> they were sorted by something else
09:41 <philippeqc_> no, its unspecified value, so that the oprator< is a strict weak ordering.
09:41 <wrtlprnft> but it's a DIFFERENT ordering than what your set_union() uses
09:42 <philippeqc_> how can I sort them ?
09:42 -!- [NP]Tangent [n=hyperdev@64.243.162.36] has joined #armagetron
09:42 <wrtlprnft> you probably can't with sets
09:43 <wrtlprnft> that's why i seid, derive your own class from shared_ptr
09:43 <wrtlprnft> and override the < operator
09:44 <philippeqc_> hummm
09:44  * philippeqc_ wonders if he'll ever finish this bit of code. ;)
09:44 <philippeqc_> ok, will do that.
09:48 <wrtlprnft> g2g, cya
09:50 <philippeqc_> cya
10:13 -!- MaZuffeR [n=MaZuffeR@darkmoor.sby.abo.fi] has joined #armagetron
10:37 <z-man-home> 0.2.8 is available on aabeta! Get it while it's hot!
10:38 <z-man-home> err, 0.2.8.2, of course.
10:39  * MaZuffeR goes to get some ovengloves
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11:01 -!- Vanhayes [n=Vanhayes@156.34.176.252] has joined #armagetron
11:02 <MaZuffeR> hi Vanhayes
11:02 <Vanhayes> hwy Maz
11:02 <Vanhayes> Hey*
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11:19 <Joni> yo guys
11:19 <Joni> i need some help
11:20 <Joni> cud sum1 help me plz
11:20 <Vanhayes> with what?
11:20 <Joni> CENTER_MESSAGE
11:20 <Joni> i cnt get it to work
11:21 <Joni> i put this in my everytime.cfg...
11:21 <Joni> CENTER_MESSAGE http://thewingclan.bravehost.com
11:21 <Joni> but it didnt show up in the game
11:22 <Joni> How do i get it to work?
11:22 <guru3> give it some time
11:22 <Joni> wot do u mean?
11:22 <guru3> not everyone is on
11:23 <Joni> oh ok
11:23 <Joni> do u kno how to do it?
11:23 <nemostultae> you could set round_center_message
11:23 <Joni> ok ill try it
11:24 <Vanhayes> Um it works fine
11:24 <Vanhayes> just tried it out and it shows up
11:25 <Joni> what shows up?
11:25 <Joni> r u on my server?
11:26 <Vanhayes> that url
11:26 <Vanhayes> wings server?
11:26 <Joni> yes
11:26 <Joni> thts mine
11:26 <Vanhayes> ya
11:26 <Joni> does it show up?
11:26 <Vanhayes> ya
11:26 <Joni> oh
11:26 <Vanhayes> goes by pretty wuick but it shows up
11:26 <Vanhayes> quick*
11:27 <Joni> is there a way to slow it down
11:27 <Joni> i dobt ther is but..
11:27 <Joni> doubt*
11:27 <Vanhayes> probly, but i don't know how
11:27 <Joni> ok
11:28 <Joni> brb
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11:45 <Joni> yo guys
11:45 <Joni> its me
11:45 <Joni> im bk
11:47 <Joni> how do u use this command PASSWORD ?
11:49 <nemostultae> http://wiki.armagetronad.net/index.php/Remote_Moderation
11:50 <Joni> thnx m8
11:51 <nemostultae> you can use any command available on the server with /admin
11:51 <Joni> but i dont get what PASSWORD does
11:52 <nemostultae> ADMIN_PASSWORD sets the password for /login
11:52 <nemostultae> ADMIN_PASS*
11:53 <nemostultae> PASSWORD is for something else
11:53 <Joni> wot is password 4 thn?
11:53 <Joni> i kno about admin_pass
11:54 <nemostultae> it is a disabled feature, it doesn't do anything useful currently
11:54 <Joni> ok thnx
11:56 <Vanhayes> what does BIG_BROTHER do? anything?
11:57 <Joni> im not sure lol
11:57 <nemostultae> it sends your OS info, OpenGL info, and if you are running in windowed or fullscreen to the master server
11:57 <Joni> nemo
11:58 <Joni> could i ask u a question
11:58 <Joni> at the start of each round i want a message to be desplayed
11:58 <Joni> how could i do tht?
11:59 <nemostultae> put in everytime.cfg -- say blah blah
11:59 <Joni> no
12:00 <Joni> tht wud make it admin: blah blah
12:00 <Joni> i just want
12:00 <nemostultae> round_console_message
12:00 <Joni> blah blah
12:00 <Joni> round_console_message
12:00 <Joni> could i have 3 messages after another with 
12:00 <Joni> round_console_message
12:00 <Joni> ?
12:01 <nemostultae> yes, you can use newlines: round_console_message one line\nanother line
12:01 <nemostultae> the \n creates a newline
12:03 <Joni> would this work?
12:03 <Joni> ROUND_CONSOLE_MESSAGE 0x0000FF------------------------------------------------ /n 0x00FF00http://thewingclan.bravehost.com /n 0x0000FF------------------------------------------------
12:03 <Joni> ????
12:03 <nemostultae> \n, not /n
12:03 <Joni> ok
12:04 <Joni> do i need spaces around '\n' or doesnt it matter
12:04 <nemostultae> no, you don't
12:04 <Joni> ok
12:04 <Joni> thnx
12:04 <Joni> ill try tht out
12:06 <Joni> thnx
12:06 <Joni> works perfect
12:06 <Joni> g2g for tea
12:06 <Joni> ill be bk in abit
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12:52 <wrtlprnft> weird guy...
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13:26 <kommerck> hi
13:27 <kommerck> I've got a problem compiling 0.2.8.1 on suse 10.1
13:27 <kommerck> it doesn't run autoreconf, and if I straightly run ./configure and make it complains
13:35 <z-man> It shouldn run autoreconf at all if you don't change configure.ac
13:36 <z-man> Can you paste the first error message you get?
13:36 <kommerck> well I run autoreconf manually, but I have configure.ac
13:36 <z-man> why?
13:36 <kommerck> hold on I try without the autoreconf and paste the error messages
13:38 <kommerck> make: *** No rule to make target `acinclude.m4', needed by `Makefile.in'.  Stop.
13:38 <kommerck> that's w/o autoreconf
13:39 <z-man> Hmm, acinclude.m4 should be included, I'll check.
13:43 <z-man> yes, acinclude.m4 is included in the tarball. And there is no make rule to recreate it, because it's all human edited. Did you accidentally delete it?
13:43 <kommerck> actually no
13:44 <kommerck> every time I recompile I clean the builddir
13:44 <kommerck> actually rpm does that for me
13:44 <kommerck> I'm trying to build a package
13:44 <kommerck> oups
13:44 <kommerck> it gets deleted indeed
13:45 <z-man> Perhaps it's not the canonical approach to have it with human edited content? We're all not really autoconf/make/stuff experts here.
13:45 <kommerck> I'm using the suse spec from 0.2.7.1 and the writes decided to remove this file :D
13:45 <z-man> Ah.
13:45 <kommerck> writers*
13:46 <z-man> I can't remember what we did back then with that file.
13:46 <kommerck> and they decided to run autoreconf too
13:47 <kommerck> anyway removing those two lines and make's on the way
13:47 <kommerck> many thanks
13:47 <z-man> Probably because they want all SuSE packages to have configure generated by the same version of autoconf
13:47 <z-man> np ;)
13:47 <kommerck> yeah, and it fails
13:47 <kommerck> because of missing defines
13:48 <z-man> You mean that's a problem now or was a problem back then?
13:48 <kommerck> it's a problem now
13:48 <z-man> Oh.
13:48 <z-man> Which defines are missing?
13:48 <kommerck> I extracted that specfile from the 0.2.7.1 file
13:48 <kommerck> hold on
13:49 <kommerck> AM_BINRELOC and AC_SINCLUDE
13:50 <z-man> Our build system has become much more standard since 0.2.7.1. Probalby a better approach is to take the specs from some different projects?
13:50 <z-man> Both of them are defines in aclocal
13:50 <z-man> err, acinclude
13:51 <z-man> sorry, bbl. Dinner is ready.
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14:26 <philippeqc> hi, is there a changelog for 0.2.8.2?
14:41 <z-man> posted it in the beta testing thread.
14:45 <philippeqc> ok thanks
14:47  * philippeqc feels he should be more carefull of announcements
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16:02 <z-man> philippeqc: ah, no, the post came after your request here :)
16:04 <joda_bot> hi
16:05 <joda_bot> z-man: You talked about moving the common resources (icons, makedist.bat, nsis) into winlibs ... should this be done ?
16:05 <z-man> yes.
16:05 <z-man> I see you updated the code::blocks makedist.bat, so you're probalby best suited for this.
16:09 <joda_bot> z-man: yeah, I already found some minor errors I'm trying to correct
16:09 <joda_bot> z-man: can you update the VC6 project ?
16:09 <joda_bot> z-man: once I've moved the files for codeblocks ?
16:09 <joda_bot> I won't modify the VC6 project yet
16:10 <z-man> I won't get it to work in VC6 :)
16:10 <z-man> But I'm about to port it fully to vc8.
16:10 <z-man> So yes, whatever you do, ignore build_visualc, that'll be my job.
16:10 <joda_bot> fine
16:11 <joda_bot> z-man: did you try to use svn/cvs plugins with the CodeBlocks nightly ?
16:11 <z-man> No, I haven't messed with the plugins and the nightly yet.
16:11 <joda_bot> because I stumbled about the note on the wiki that rc2 does crash with those
16:11 <z-man> Ah, that was with rc2.
16:12  * joda_bot is going to test it, if he finds the plugins ;)
16:12 <z-man> They came with rc2, that's why the note is there :)
16:13 <joda_bot> When will 0.2.8.2 be on sf ?
16:13  * joda_bot has to update www.armagetron.nixda.net's download button then ;)
16:14 <z-man> AABeta will redirect its users to SF once that happens.
16:14 <z-man> It will be sometime tomorrow. Nemo has the mac build ready.
16:14 <joda_bot> does it redirect ?
16:15 <z-man> But I'm waiting for reports that people install 0.2.8.2 and find an aligator in their toilet.
16:15 <z-man> yes, it redirects once you tell it to do so.
16:15  * joda_bot obediantly downloads 
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17:17 <wrtlprnft> Uh, why do we link ftgl statically by default?
17:18 <wrtlprnft> what about an option at configure time, the default would be dynamic linking
17:18 <wrtlprnft> for compiling you need the lib anyways, and for distribution you could enable that option
17:21 <wrtlprnft> nvm, i read your post
17:21 <z-man> Ah, no, we do link dynamically by default.
17:21 <z-man> It's just the autopackage.
17:21 <wrtlprnft> ok, i just read the CIA logs
17:21 <z-man> :)
17:22 <wrtlprnft> which reminds me, I'll remove that HUD menu
17:22 <z-man> good.
17:22 <wrtlprnft> any way to force the cockpit to be linked without that stupid function?
17:22 <z-man> Oh, what does the thing on top of the screen in the middle do?
17:23 <wrtlprnft> framerate. It's only supposed to be there in incam
17:23 <z-man> The cockpit is in tron/, right?
17:23 <wrtlprnft> it's in tron/cockpit
17:23 <wrtlprnft> currently in gHud.cpp:
17:23 <wrtlprnft> void stupid_unnnecessary_function_that_makes_the_linker_happy() {
17:23 <wrtlprnft>     cCockpit::GetCockpit()->ProcessCockpit();
17:23 <wrtlprnft> }
17:24 <wrtlprnft> where cCockpit is defined in tron/cockpit/cCockpit.cpp, and it includes everything else
17:24 -!- Joni [n=5443dd75@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has joined #armagetron
17:24 <Joni> hey guys
17:24 <z-man> move the .cpp file in the makefile from libtron_a_SOURCES to armagetronad_main_SOURCES
17:24 <wrtlprnft> and gHud is referenced from gMenus IIRC, but if i remove those links the cockpit disappears in a black hole
17:25 <z-man> Yeah, that's the curse of libraries.
17:25 <Joni> how do i make it so the rubber on my server doesnt deplete as fast?
17:25 <Joni> how do i make it so the rubber on my server doesnt deplete as fast?
17:26 <z-man> You already asked the opposite question on the forum, or one of your clanamtes did.
17:26 <z-man> and please don't spam, we're not blind.
17:26 <Joni> soz
17:26 <Joni> i dint mean to do it twice
17:26 <wrtlprnft> z-man: now I'm interested too :P
17:27 <wrtlprnft> i don't see a setting for the depletion rate
17:27 <z-man> CYCLE_RUBBER_TIME :)
17:27 <z-man> it defaults to 10, making it lower makes the rubber deplete faster, higher makes it deplete slower.
17:27 <wrtlprnft> i meant the opposite
17:27 <Joni> ok
17:27 <Joni> ok thnx
17:27 <z-man> wrtlprnft: the opposite of what?
17:28 <z-man> Joni: np
17:28 <wrtlprnft> The rate it fills up when it's used
17:28 <Joni> ok
17:28 <z-man> ah that, no, that is fixed.
17:28 <wrtlprnft> i forgot rubber is the other way than the brakes
17:28 <wrtlprnft> ok, just curious ;)
17:28 <z-man> yeah, it's another curse :)
17:28 <Joni> cant u make it refill quiker thn?
17:28 <wrtlprnft> z-man: actually, thinking about it, you don't need to change it
17:29 <wrtlprnft> Joni: z-man just explained that
17:29 <z-man> joni: hng, reread what I said :)
17:29 <Joni> oh
17:29 <Joni> lol
17:29 <Joni> soz
17:29 <joda_bot> Joni: deutsch ?
17:29 <wrtlprnft> z-man: if you want the rubber to last longer you set cycle_rubber to something bigger :P
17:29 <z-man> correct :)
17:29 <wrtlprnft> it's not like brakes, where the maximum is fixed at 1
17:30 <wrtlprnft> the main source is gFloor.cpp?
17:30 <wrtlprnft> lol
17:30 <z-man> Yeah, had I forseen that the values would be displayed in a HUD sometime, I'd have made rubber go from 0 to 1 too, and start at 1.
17:31 <z-man> wrtlprnft: gFloor.cpp has the same problem as the HUD :) Nobody explicitly links to it.
17:31 <z-man> And the real main program doesn't have to be listed, because it contains main().
17:31 <wrtlprnft> oh, right
17:32 <Joni> o english
17:32 <wrtlprnft> gHud.* will be history then :P
17:32 <z-man> you're the boss there.
17:33  * z-man prepares for bedtime
17:33 <wrtlprnft> I should at least keep a subby_ comment somewhere...
17:34 <wrtlprnft> night z-man 
17:35 -!- Joni [n=5443dd75@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has quit ["CGI:IRC"]
17:35 <wrtlprnft> uh, do i need to get rid of the language strings, or is there a way to do that automatically?
17:37 <z-man> There is no way yet for that. We should write a scanner some time, but it's all right to leave the strings alive for now.
17:37 <z-man> At least, if you remove them in english_base.txt, they'll be marked as obsolete in the other files.
17:38 -!- Joni [n=5443dd75@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has joined #armagetron
17:38 <Joni> hi
17:39 <Joni> i have another question 4 u guys
17:39 <Joni> i have a file called everytime.cfg
17:39 <Joni> this is what is in it
17:39 <Joni> ROUND_CONSOLE_MESSAGE ---------------------------------\nhttp://thewingclan.bravehost.com\n---------------------------------
17:39 <Joni> SAY Swearing And Bots Are Disallowed Violaters Will Be Banned
17:40 <Joni> but the problem is...
17:40 <Joni> it doesnt turn out how i want it to
17:40 <wrtlprnft> no need to put ROUND_CONSOLE_MESSAGE into everytime.cvf
17:40 <wrtlprnft> *cfg
17:41 <wrtlprnft> how does it turn out then?
17:41 <Joni> chck out my server
17:41 <wrtlprnft> they might come in the wrong order at random
17:41 <Joni> ~]~
17:41 <Joni> oops
17:41 <Joni> ~[Wing]~
17:41 <Joni> yes
17:41 <Joni> they do
17:42 <Joni> i want the website to come before the admin writing
17:42 <Joni> how do i fix this problem?
17:42 <wrtlprnft> then fake the admin
17:42 <Joni> wot ya mean?
17:42 <nemostultae> change round_console_message to console
17:43 <Joni> yes but the site comes on as the game is sayin 3 2 1 go
17:43 <nemostultae> so it does a console message.
17:43 <Joni> etc
17:43 <wrtlprnft> ROUND_CONSOLE_MESSAGE <insertnormaltexthere>
17:43 <wrtlprnft> 0xff0000Admin0xffff88: <insertadmintexthere>
17:43 <wrtlprnft> ROUND_CONSOLE_MESSAGE <insertnormaltexthere>\\n0xff0000Admin0xffff88: <insertadmintexthere>
17:43 <wrtlprnft> grr
17:43 <nemostultae> console_message*
17:43 <wrtlprnft> second one, but with just one backslash
17:43 <wrtlprnft> and there's no need for it to be in everytime.cfg
17:44 <nemostultae> do a console_message, and then a say.
17:44 <wrtlprnft> it might still come in the wrong order
17:44 <wrtlprnft> i have that on my race server, it has 4 SAY commands and they come in an apparently random order
17:44 <Joni> i wont it to be on the lines of the xzl server
17:44 <Joni> that where i got my idea
17:45 <Joni> off start of xzl
17:45 <wrtlprnft> I just posted the command above...
17:45 <Joni> does any1 know who owns the xzl server?
17:46 <wrtlprnft> Self_Destructo might know, but he is leaving...
17:46 <Joni> leavin wher?
17:46 <wrtlprnft> http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?t=4011
17:47 <Joni> oh
17:47 <Joni> how cum hes on chat?
17:47 <wrtlprnft> he said he would leave tonight
17:48 <Joni> omg?
17:48 <Joni> lol
17:48 <Joni> i just missed
17:49 <wrtlprnft> that makes the SQUAT one member shorter
17:49 <Joni> SQUAT?
17:49 <Joni> wots tht?
17:49 <wrtlprnft> SQUAT: QUality Assurance Team
17:49 <wrtlprnft> recursive acronym
17:49 <Joni> oh
17:50 <Joni> u kno the ladder
17:50 <Joni> how do i access my servers ladder?
17:51 <wrtlprnft> somewhere in your var dir
17:51 <wrtlprnft> sar/ladder.txt
17:51 <wrtlprnft> s/sar/var
17:52 <Joni> im runnin XP
17:52 <joda_bot> Joni: you need a webserver on the same server to display it online (and then you can create symbolic link form a web directory to the ladder.txt)
17:53 <wrtlprnft> Joni: no idea where it might be, just search for a file named ladder.txt?
17:53  * wrtlprnft mumbles about windows XP not being a server OS
17:53 <Joni> lol
17:54 <joda_bot> Usually in the installation directory if you use a dedicated server
17:54 <joda_bot> c:\program files\armagetronad dedicated\var\
17:55 <joda_bot> for the usual client's "server":
17:55 <joda_bot> c:\program files\armagetronad\var\
17:55 <joda_bot> and you might also check:
17:55 <joda_bot> c:\document and settings\[username]\Application Data\Armagetron\var
17:57 <Joni> well it is a dedicated server
17:58 <Joni> c:\program files\armagetronad dedicated\var\
17:58 <Joni> but i cnt find it in 
17:58 <Joni> ^^
18:00 <wrtlprnft> uh, anyone an idea where you can define defaults for input keys?
18:00 <joda_bot> then check the document and settings folder
18:00 <Joni> aha found it
18:00 <joda_bot> wrtlprnft: no idea
18:01 <Joni> nop
18:01 <Joni> duno about much me lol
18:02 <wrtlprnft> ah, there we go
18:03 <wrtlprnft> config/default.cfg
18:03 <Joni> how do i host these on the internet?
18:04 <Joni> host do i host the ladder?
18:04 <joda_bot> Joni: you need a web server
18:05 <joda_bot> Joni: but that is beyond my guidance for tonight
18:05 -!- z-man [n=manuel@p5087199B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]
18:05 <Joni> ill show u this post i found
18:05 <Joni> http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?t=3254
18:06 <Joni> look at the top 1
18:06 <joda_bot> Joni: basically you have to find a way to either run a web server on your computer or just upload at regular times
18:06 <Joni> how do i do this?
18:06 <joda_bot> You have to install a lot of software
18:06 <joda_bot> and open ports in your firewall or redirect your routers port to your computer
18:07 <joda_bot> except if you have a windows pc at a server farm
18:07 <Joni> wrtlprnft: u posted on this topic
18:07 <joda_bot> or the university
18:07 <Joni> no
18:07 <joda_bot> Joni: you need php, and apache
18:07 <Joni> at home
18:07 <joda_bot> Joni: your server will suffer from bandwidth problems probably
18:07 <joda_bot> how much upstream do you have ?
18:07 <Joni> duno
18:08 <joda_bot> Joni: I adwise you to be happy to be able to host a small server for friends
18:09 <Joni> its 4 a clan
18:09 <Joni> is there any wer i can get my server hosted?
18:09 <joda_bot> but you a web server for a ladder does only make sense for a dedicated server which runs at a server farm
18:09 <wrtlprnft> joda_bot: yes?
18:09 <joda_bot> Joni: many sites, but they all cost money
18:10 <joda_bot> wrtlprnft: did not say anything to you (I guess)
18:10 <Joni> is ther any cheapish 1s?
18:10 <Joni> it was me
18:11 <wrtlprnft> oh, sorry
18:11 <Joni> wrtlprnft: i said u posted on this topic
18:11 <Joni>  http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?t=3254
18:11 <wrtlprnft> mixed you two up
18:11 <Joni> ok lol
18:11 <wrtlprnft> both start with jo
18:12 <wrtlprnft> yeah, but i am hosting a webserver
18:12 <wrtlprnft> maybe not on a great connection, but its running on a dedicated linux box
18:12 <Joni> i just wondered if i could get a stats thing workin on this PHPBB site i found
18:13 <Lucifer_arma> the xzl server, last I heard, was hosted by the same people hosting the mbc server
18:13 <Joni> who owns tht?
18:13 <wrtlprnft> Antix.
18:13 <Lucifer_arma> distortgaming ?
18:13 <Joni> ok
18:14 <Lucifer_arma> it might even physically be on the same machine as the mbc server, I think they've only got the one dedicated server
18:14 <wrtlprnft> but antix is not the admin of the arma servers
18:14 <Joni> http://www.forumer.com/
18:14 <wrtlprnft> it is on the same machine
18:14 <joda_bot> #message z-man* default keybinding for screenshots is broken on w2k (reassigned screenshot with "print screen" is labeld "sys_req")
18:14 <armabot> joda_bot: The operation succeeded.
18:14 <Joni> couldnt i host my stats on there
18:14 <Lucifer_arma> antix is one of the owners of distortgaming :)
18:14 <wrtlprnft> joda_bot: printscreen IS sysreq
18:14 <wrtlprnft> same key
18:14 <wrtlprnft> just on modern keyboards it's not labelled anymore
18:15 <joda_bot> well, then the default.cfg does not work
18:15 <Lucifer_arma> I'd like to see that default changed anyway
18:15 <wrtlprnft> why?
18:15 <Lucifer_arma> print screen is a pain to hit on my laptop, and there is no f13 on it either
18:15  * wrtlprnft has it bound to f2
18:15 <joda_bot> because screenshots are only taken once the print screen "entry" after reassigning "sys-req"
18:15 <wrtlprnft> and you can always change it
18:15 <Lucifer_arma> so whenever I want to screenshot some neato new code I've written, I have to rebind screenshot, heh
18:16 <Lucifer_arma> on my regular sysinstalled config I have it bound to f2, it's only when I run from my build directory that I have to deal with it :)
18:16 <joda_bot> I'd rather see "fullscreen toggle" moved away from f ;)
18:16 <wrtlprnft> yes, definitely
18:16 <Lucifer_arma> but I assume others are in similar situations with their print screen keys
18:16 <wrtlprnft> my printscreen key is fine
18:17 <wrtlprnft> binding it to f2 was more of an accident and i got used to it
18:17 <wrtlprnft> printscreen is a chat key now
18:17 <Joni> u kno my server stats hosting
18:17 <Lucifer_arma> my laptop differentiates print screen and sys req
18:18 <Joni> could this be any good?
18:18 <Joni> http://www.forumer.com/
18:18 <wrtlprnft> ...
18:18 <wrtlprnft> stop witing red
18:18 <Lucifer_arma> bold and red isn't any good
18:18 <Joni> soz lol
18:18 <Self_Destructo> heh, i didn't even know that was possible
18:18 <Joni> destructo!!!!!!
18:18 <Lucifer_arma> you should've been here when Cristi was here, heh
18:18 <Joni> who owns xzl clan server
18:19 <wrtlprnft> IT ANNOYS PEOPLE, AS WELL AS CAPS, TPYOS, AND EXCLAMATION MARKS!!!!!!!!!!
18:19 <Joni> ????
18:19 <Self_Destructo> well guys, this is my last goodbye
18:19 <Joni> bye
18:19 <wrtlprnft> cya :(
18:19 <wrtlprnft> have luck
18:19 <Self_Destructo> i hope so :)
18:20 -!- Self_Destructo [i=tribe@h237.172.40.162.ip.alltel.net] has quit ["Quit in 0,446516 second(s)"]
18:20 <Lucifer_arma> bye
18:20 <Lucifer_arma> damn, all I did was go get more tea
18:20  * wrtlprnft waves goodbye
18:20 <Joni> wrtlprnft: could that site provide me with a server for my server stats?
18:21 <wrtlprnft> I don't think so
18:21 <Joni> how come?
18:21 <wrtlprnft> that would require you to have code changes
18:22 <Joni> like what?
18:24 -!- nemostultae [n=nemostul@a1174.upc-a.chello.nl] has left #armagetron []
18:25 <wrtlprnft> like, adding the code to show the score table
18:25 <Joni> would that be hard?
18:27 <wrtlprnft> well, the code is already posted, contact whoever posted it
18:27 <wrtlprnft> but i don't think that site allows you to change the forum code
18:28 <Joni> ok
18:28 <wrtlprnft> ok, wave goodbye to gHud.* and the subby_ variables
18:29 <n54> *waves* :)
18:33  * Lucifer_arma waves gladly
18:33 <Lucifer_arma> although I'd like to retain a subby_something just for nostalgia :)
18:35 -!- Joni [n=5443dd75@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has quit ["CGI:IRC (EOF)"]
18:36 <n54> how about an official "hall of codemonkeys" page as a tounge-in-cheek but sincere list of everyone who has touched the code? or something else than codemonkeys if that sounds wrong, sinply "hall of coders"?
18:36 <wrtlprnft> isn't that the purpose of the AUTHORS file?
18:36 <n54> simply*
18:37 <n54> dunno, is the authors file historical?
18:37 -!- kommerck [n=Leon@dslb-088-072-131-197.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit ["Another attempt to get a real life."]
18:37 <wrtlprnft> http://pastebin.ca/61490
18:38 <n54> *clicks*
18:39 <n54> ah ok :)
18:40  * wrtlprnft wonders how many users actually read that
18:40 <MaZuffeR> i did :)
18:41 <n54> read one ages ago
18:42 <wrtlprnft> :)
18:42 <wrtlprnft> looks like i didn't read it enough, else i'd know yarrt was joda_bot 
18:46 <n54> :)
18:47 <MaZuffeR> i might actually have seen subby a couple months ago, someone named hqqns played fortress and it certainly wasn't a noob 
18:48 <n54> I haven't checked swiftparrot lately but that's _his_ hangout :)
18:48 <n54> so go there for subby goodness ^^
18:56 <joda_bot> hqqns is subby up sie down
18:56 <joda_bot> side
18:57 <Lucifer_arma> codemonkeys = past developers, code junkies = present developers :)
18:57 <MaZuffeR> it's in subbanese actually
18:57 <MaZuffeR> http://randypalmer.com/tron/#lang
18:57 <n54> hehe luci
18:58 <joda_bot> :)
19:02 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, hqqns is always subby, afaik, and he doesn't talk much
19:04 -!- Ringwraith` [n=gollum@tor/session/external/x-d4423663d237dbc2] has joined #armagetron
19:05 <Ringwraith`> moo.
19:09 <Lucifer_arma> would anybody like to meet my pet skeleton?
19:10 <Lucifer_arma> my neighbors think having an undead pet is weird, but my landlord says its ok as long as it's not a living pet, which the lease expressly forbids.
19:11 <n54> lol
19:12 <n54> sure, what is its name? :)
19:13 <Ringwraith`> aww how cute
19:13 <Ringwraith`> you have psychopaths living next door
19:15 -!- Vanhayes [n=Vanhayes@stjhnbsu84w-156034191023.nb.aliant.net] has joined #armagetron
19:15 <wrtlprnft> #canada
19:15 <armabot>  4 
19:15 <Vanhayes> #canada
19:15 <armabot>  4 
19:16 <Vanhayes> heh
19:19 <wrtlprnft> http://randypalmer.com/tron/#list
19:19 <wrtlprnft> lol
19:25 <wrtlprnft> uh, i guess the nasalization guy just gave us green ligt for the font resource thing
19:27 <n54> "   You can beat node easily 	" ^^
19:28 <n54> cool what did he say?
19:30 <n54> " you find yourself grinding your car against the curb in a vain attempt to gain speed." is my favourite :)
19:31 <wrtlprnft> mine too
19:32 <wrtlprnft> noone can beat n54 easily since he's never on the grid :(
19:32 <n54> that will change in the not too distant future :) you'll whop my ass
19:33 <wrtlprnft> we'll see
19:33 <wrtlprnft> but i hope it will change :)
19:33 <n54> :)
19:33 <n54> the idea of fortress intrigues me so I'll orbaly try to play that after getting some of the rust off
19:34 <wrtlprnft> :)
19:42 <joda_bot> wrtlprnft: Any idea where @progtitle@ is defined under linux ?
19:53 -!- MaZuffeR [n=MaZuffeR@darkmoor.sby.abo.fi] has quit ["-"]
20:00 <Lucifer_arma> joda_bot: it's determined in configure
20:05 -!- Vanhayes [n=Vanhayes@stjhnbsu84w-156034191023.nb.aliant.net] has quit ["Leaving"]
20:06 <joda_bot> Lucifer_arma: do you the spot it is applied ?
20:06 <joda_bot> Lucifer_arma: because when compiling with code blocks it somehow does not define @progtitle@
20:06 <joda_bot> and I'm not sure where or what I have to do to fix it
20:08  * wrtlprnft has no clue
20:10 <Ringwraith`> nasalization
20:10 <wrtlprnft> ?
20:10 <Ringwraith`> u have big nasals
20:11 <Ringwraith`> i rather
20:11 <wrtlprnft> it's a font i'm planning to make available for arma
20:11 <n54> that reminds me what was the guys reply wrtlprnft? you said it was a go-ahead?
20:11 <wrtlprnft> yeah, although it looks a bit like a template answer
20:15 <n54> ok
20:18 <joda_bot> Lucifer_arma: wrtlprnft: does configure replace the entry @progtitle@ in languages.txt ?
20:18  * wrtlprnft has no clue
20:18 <wrtlprnft> where are instant chat keys for irssi?
20:19 <joda_bot> irssi ?
20:19 <wrtlprnft> that /me has no clue would have to be one of them
20:19 <wrtlprnft> my irc client
20:19 <joda_bot> ah
20:19 <joda_bot> gaim has none AFAIK ;)
20:19 <joda_bot> makes my life easy
20:22 <wrtlprnft> does anyone know an easy way to convert utf-16 to utf-8 and vice versa?
20:24 -!- guru3 [n=guru3@2002:51e7:e65f:1:0:0:0:1] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)]
20:24 <Ringwraith`> humping a goat while doing complex multiplication
20:25 <wrtlprnft> operation timed out?
20:25 <wrtlprnft> weird error
20:26 -!- guru3 [n=guru3@2002:51e7:e65f:1:0:0:0:1] has joined #armagetron
20:32 <Lucifer_arma> joda_bot: yes
20:34 <joda_bot> Lucifer_arma: oh... really stupid, how am I to do that for windows
20:34 <joda_bot> guess I'll just comment out the lines loading it, and change the default from Armagetron to Armagetron Advanced
20:36  * joda_bot wonders why the app name can be customized ;)
20:43 <Lucifer_arma> joda_bot: it would be awfully nice if the autotools stuff can be used for windows too, but that's probably just a pipe dream of mine :)
20:44  * Lucifer_arma doesn't know why the app name can be customized, but wants it to remain so and get better so people can use it as an engine for other games.
20:44 <wrtlprnft> aren't the autotools just bash scripts?
20:44 <wrtlprnft> go cygwin!
20:50 <n54> actually not cygwin so much as mingw
20:50 <n54> want the result to be native after all ^^
20:54 <joda_bot> Lucifer_arma: might be that works ... but we should not use cygwin to build (at least not the compiler ... n54 got it right :-))
20:54  * wrtlprnft was kidding with cygwin
21:03 <Ringwraith`> socket to me
21:14 -!- deja_vu_ [n=deja_vu@p5090AD16.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #armagetron
21:19 -!- deja_vu [n=deja_vu@80.144.162.251] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)]
21:28 <Lucifer_arma> you can build with cygwin and get a native result
21:28 <Lucifer_arma> just don't link to libcygwin and you're fine.  :)
21:29 <Lucifer_arma> of course, that means use native windows calls instead.  Then you use the link libraries provided by mingw and link against them, use their headers, etc.
21:29 <Lucifer_arma> we should be able to pull it off, if we really wanted.
21:30 -!- Lucifer_arma is now known as LuciAteAPerson
21:30 -!- LuciAteAPerson is now known as Lucifer_arma
21:31 <wrtlprnft> ?
21:31 <Lucifer_arma> I didn't change my name for dinner, and wanted to say I ate dinner :)
21:32 <Lucifer_arma> anyway, to build with cygwin and not have to link to libcygwin, you just have to use the CYGWIN define that cygwin defines in your code
21:32 <Lucifer_arma> it's not terribly difficult, most places that have current win32 ifdefs just need cygwin added.
21:33 <Lucifer_arma> there will be a few places where some extra effort may be needed, like commandline processing, which is both unlike windows and unlike linux
21:33 <Lucifer_arma> and, umm, oh yeah, the binary you end up with is always native.  The only difference is does it use the posix layer provided by libcygwin or not.
21:34 <Lucifer_arma> the advantage to supporting cygwin is we can have windows automation using the same bash scripts we use for linux, if we had those.
21:35 <Lucifer_arma> otoh, supporting cygwin is probably as complicated as supporting cross-compiling from linux to build windows binaries, and we'd be better off doing that for automation,
21:35 <Ringwraith`> Qt
21:35 <Ringwraith`> Qt!
21:35 <Ringwraith`> ;p
21:35 <Lucifer_arma> because then we could automate all the linux builds at the same time
21:35 <Lucifer_arma> have the same machine do it, you know.
21:37 <wrtlprnft> what about that dotnet/mono stuff? you could have the same binary on windows and linux
21:37 <Lucifer_arma> we could just rewrite in java, too.
21:37 <n54> *shivers*
21:37 <Lucifer_arma> I didn't jump on the .NET bandwagon.  :)
21:37 <n54> me neither
21:37  * Lucifer_arma doesn't trust Microsoft to not go out of its way to make things hard for mono
21:37 <wrtlprnft> that was as much of a joke as cygwin#
21:38 <n54> we take you too seriously it seems ^^
21:38 <Lucifer_arma> heh, cygwin is a real possibility, though.  :)
21:38 <n54> (J/k) :)
21:38 <n54> I would like to try mingw actually but well
21:38 <Lucifer_arma> tell Luke-Jr to do cygwin :)
21:38  * n54 isn't too fond of cygwin, if you want *nix then install it I say
21:39  * Lucifer_arma can't live without cygwin when he's stuck in windows, which isn't very often
21:39 <n54> yeah I can see how it fits a purpose if one is forced to use windows against ones wishes and such
21:40  * wrtlprnft doesn't bother with cygwin
21:40 <wrtlprnft> ssh connection home is better
21:41 <Ringwraith`> i like having less rather than a damned scroll buffer in which you cant scroll back up
21:41 <wrtlprnft> ?
21:42 <Lucifer_arma> ssh connection home doesn't give me the tools to work directly on the machine that cygwin does
21:42 <wrtlprnft> well, why should i work on that machine if i can work on my machine at home?
21:42 <Lucifer_arma> cygwin is also really useful for porting posix programs to windows because it works very well.  Not perfectly, of course, but well enough.
21:43 <Lucifer_arma> wrtlprnft: depends what you're using the machine for.  When I got this laptop, it had windows on it, and linux didn't go on smoothly and I didn't have time to deal with it
21:43 <Lucifer_arma> so I ran windows
21:43 <Lucifer_arma> which meant I was working, writing papers, etc, all in windows
21:43 <Lucifer_arma> which also meant that I needed a commandline from time to time to do work-related stuff.
21:43 <Lucifer_arma> ssh into my other machine wouldn't give me that.  :)  cygwin would.
21:44 <Lucifer_arma> of course, when that semester ended, first thing I did was invest the time to get linux on here.  :)
21:44 <wrtlprnft> yeah, sure, if you're that desperate
21:44 <Lucifer_arma> it makes windows livable for a time, that's all.
21:44 <wrtlprnft> there's always linux in vmware or similar, though
21:45  * Lucifer_arma notes that vmware is quite expensive and expires if you don't give them money
21:45 <Lucifer_arma> and my email about student discounts was ignored even though their website tells you to ask for them.
21:46 <wrtlprnft> there's a vmware player
21:46 <wrtlprnft> wich means you can use premade configurations
21:47 <Lucifer_arma> hmmm, let's see.  Setup xampp in about 10 seconds, install mambo and friends in about 5 minutes, and start working.
21:48 <Lucifer_arma> or, take <some unknown amount of time> to setup a vmware configuration that's probably better
21:48 <Lucifer_arma> meanwhile, I have <this much time> already allocated for work, school, family, etc.  :)
21:48 <Ringwraith`> how do you install your friends?
21:48  * Lucifer_arma wishes he lived in a world where he didn't have to make decisions he didn't like, but sadly, he does not live in that world.
21:48 <Ringwraith`> thats a cool feature
21:48 <n54> hehe
21:48 <wrtlprnft> the vmware disk you can later copy on a real partition
21:49 <wrtlprnft> which means you can fix the driver stuff and continue where you left
21:51 <Lucifer_arma> anybody know how to get colors printed to the terminal with cat?
21:51 <Lucifer_arma> and in a way that m4 doesn't choke when it processes the file?
21:51 <wrtlprnft> you mean, remove them?
21:51 <Lucifer_arma> better yet, anybody know of an autoconf project that does it?
21:51 <Lucifer_arma> know, show colors.
21:52 <Lucifer_arma> I want to change our table to output red x's for stuff that's turned off and green O's for stuff that's turned on.  :)
21:52 <n54> won't cat show it if it's in the file?
21:52 <wrtlprnft> mathias@laptop $ ls --color > asdf                                            ~
21:52 <wrtlprnft> mathias@laptop $ cat asdf                                                     ~
21:52 <n54> otherwise.... script?
21:52 <wrtlprnft> that displays colors for me
21:53 <Lucifer_arma> the stuff you do to set colors int he prompt causes m4 to choke when it processes the file
21:53 <wrtlprnft> ah, now i get it
21:53  * wrtlprnft has no clue
21:54 <Lucifer_arma> \[\033[0;35m\]\u@\h\[\033[1;34m\]: \w\[\033[0m\]$   <--- causes m4 to choke when it processes configure.ac
21:54 <n54> the prompt colorisation stuff is in whatever shell you use so if that's just "in a file" I can see how that would make trouble yes
21:54 <wrtlprnft> more \\?
21:55 <Lucifer_arma> not enough escaping?
21:55 <wrtlprnft> just guessing
21:56 <Lucifer_arma> still chokes
21:57 <Lucifer_arma> green="\\[\\033[0;35m\\]"
21:57 <n54> too many \'s
21:57 <n54> but are you trying to do that in the file itself?
21:57 <n54> with the table you want cat to display?
21:57 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, because it's supposed to be able to fail gracefully in a shell that doesn't support it
21:58 <Lucifer_arma> well, you're supposed to use heredocs instead of big echo blocks, and I'll be converting our table to heredoc instead
21:58 <wrtlprnft> what does it have to do with the shell?
21:58 <wrtlprnft> *confused*
21:58 <Lucifer_arma> oh, ummm
21:58 <Lucifer_arma> can't use bash-style includes because they're not supported
21:59 <n54> I've tried to say that :)
21:59 <wrtlprnft> I thought colors were done by the terminal
21:59 <Lucifer_arma> so I couldn't just move the function into another file that m4 doesn't process
22:00 <Ringwraith`> no ansi codes usually
22:01 <Ringwraith`> just vi it and tell it to use the shell
22:02 <Ringwraith`> you could i think cat a .ans file from the old bbs days
22:02 <Ringwraith`> and it should be colorized in the term
22:05 -!- Ringwraith` [n=gollum@tor/session/external/x-d4423663d237dbc2] has quit ["Leaving"]
22:05 <Lucifer_arma> afaik, these are ansi codes.  That's not a problem, though.  The problem is that m4 thinks it's hitting EOF and chokes
22:07 <wrtlprnft> is there any way to get the shell to insert them?
22:09 <Lucifer_arma> umm, we could have our own script that handles the echo and therefore doesn't get processed by m4
22:10 <Lucifer_arma> call it as a command.  Then the question is how do I get configure to recognize the script?
22:10 <Lucifer_arma> hmmm, I have an idea actually.  :)
22:10 -!- fcukfcuk [n=mathias@194.105.96.176.static.cablesurf.de] has joined #armagetron
22:10 <fcukfcuk> fuck
22:10 <fcukfcuk> shit
22:10 <fcukfcuk> ass
22:10 -!- fcukfcuk [n=mathias@194.105.96.176.static.cablesurf.de] has quit [Client Quit]
22:10 <Lucifer_arma> make a table.in file that contains the table to print and then just have it processed with the output
22:11 -!- joda_bot [n=anonymou@dslb-084-061-040-199.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #armagetron []
22:11 <Lucifer_arma> n=mathias@194.105.96.176.static.cablesurf.de  <--- not fooled, heh
22:11 <n54> what was all this for btw?
22:11 <Lucifer_arma> arma's configure script
22:11 <n54> ok
22:13 <Lucifer_arma> I've got some other ideas to try, but I'd rather finish restructuring the sound stuff first
22:13  * Lucifer_arma just wanted to brighten up configure a bit, because it's such a boring script
22:14 <wrtlprnft> uh, that was for the irc stats
22:15 <n54> ?
22:15 <n54> teh fcukfcuk thing?
22:15 <n54> the*
22:16 <wrtlprnft> AfterDeath has quite a potty mouth. 51.2% words were foul language. 
22:16 <wrtlprnft> ThePinkF1oyd also makes sailors blush, 47.0% of the time.
22:16 <wrtlprnft> that should make 100%
22:16 <wrtlprnft> and i was testing the newly installed irssi on my server
22:17 <n54> ok
22:17 <wrtlprnft> btw you can't call yourself fuck on freenode
22:17 <wrtlprnft> it says erroneus nick
22:18 <wrtlprnft> or however you spell that
22:20 <spidey> c'mon luci :p
22:21 <Lucifer_arma> you try being wingman to a wuss that has to leave zigzags for you to grind
22:21 <Lucifer_arma> you try being wingman to a wuss that has to leave zigzags for you to grind <-- spidey
22:22 <spidey> lol
22:26 <spidey> luci!!!!!!!!!1
22:27 <wrtlprnft> doesn't arma have a build-in chat feature?
22:27 <spidey> no
22:30  * n54 slept 15 hours yesterday and is tired again :| (now, 6 hours later)
22:45 -!- SuPeRTaRD [i=blah@adsl-71-145-184-18.dsl.austtx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
22:56 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: do you get on-screen display that hurts your fps?
22:57 <Lucifer_arma> wrtlprnft: do you get on-screen display that hurts your fps?  :)
22:57 <wrtlprnft> uh, some gauges are expensive
22:57 <wrtlprnft> the time-to-impact gauge eats like 5fps for me, but it's f*** useful
22:57 <wrtlprnft> the map is expensive too, and large tables
22:57 <Lucifer_arma> there's a time-to-impact gauge?
22:57 <wrtlprnft> yes
22:58  * Lucifer_arma thinks he needs to look at the tutorial again
22:58 <Lucifer_arma> yes, map is expensive, but it can probably do with some optimization anyway
22:58 <wrtlprnft> http://wiki.armagetronad.net/index.php/Cockpit_Tutorial#Possible_contents_for_data_sources
22:59 <wrtlprnft> reload, just corrected a mistake
23:00 <Lucifer_arma> aha, I think I saw the mistake you just corrected :)
23:00 <Lucifer_arma> and there are some more callbacks, I see.
23:01  * Lucifer_arma really likes this callback thing, it was so easy to add the song title callback
23:01 <Lucifer_arma> whatever other gripes I may have, that is :)
23:02 <wrtlprnft> :)
23:02 <Lucifer_arma> I didn't see widget templates, I'm going to have to screw with that
23:02 <Lucifer_arma> I've become quite attached to the bar gauges I use
23:02 <wrtlprnft> the heck?
23:02 <wrtlprnft> why did the wiki stop interpreting &asdf; entities?
23:03 <Lucifer_arma> did it ever?
23:03 <wrtlprnft> yes it did when i wrote that
23:03 <Lucifer_arma> could be something to do with tank moving it to his server
23:03 <Lucifer_arma> when you wrote that it was still on my server, wasn't it?
23:03  * wrtlprnft groans and digs out something to copy and paste from
23:04 <wrtlprnft> oh, nvm, it was a typo
23:04 <wrtlprnft> &ldquoT; instead of &ldquo;
23:05 <wrtlprnft> but I'm still not finished with callbacks, it should be easier
23:05 <wrtlprnft> like, currently you have to add the thing in 3 places
23:10 <wrtlprnft> have a look at my cockpit for a working example :)
23:13 <wrtlprnft> #night
23:13 <armabot> Good night wrtlprnft!
23:20 <spidey> lucifer
23:20 <spidey> i don't get a onscreen display,i play games on the windows computer and everything else on the linux(this one)
23:20 <spidey> :p
23:22 <spidey> and pretty soon my fps are gonna go up alot , i'm getting a powercolor radeon 9250 256mb 128-bit gfx card for the windows box :)
23:22 <spidey> compared to the onboard 64mb gfx i got 
23:22 <spidey> which the onboard gives me 59fps
23:27 <Lucifer_arma> heh, ok.  I get onscreen display from konversation that really kills my fps
23:41 <spidey> hmm
23:41 <spidey> can't say the windows x-chat before i started using this box ever killed my fps from a pop-up when someone said my name

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DISCLAIMER: These logs of public chat may contain some content which may not be appropriate for all audiences. Use at your own risk.
Logs from 2006-2009 pulled from wrtlprnft
Format changes at: 2015-08-25, 2017-02-20, and 2020-03-23. Times (2015 and later) should be Eastern.


 
 
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