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Log from 2006-05-29:
--- Day changed Mon May 29 2006
00:19 <Lucifer_arma> #armaservers
00:19 <armabot> Lucifer_arma: Error: Couldn't get RSS feed.
00:21 <Luke-Jr> O.o
00:21 <Luke-Jr> #armaservers
00:33 -!- n54 [n=n54@138.80-203-102.nextgentel.com] has joined #armagetron
01:27 -!- flea [n=flea@user-0c8hpi2.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #armagetron
01:30 -!- z-man [n=manuel@p50873C04.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #armagetron
01:30 -!- z-man-home [n=manuel@p50873C04.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #armagetron
01:30 <z-man> #morning
01:30 <armabot> Good Morning z-man! Random Fortune:  Most legends have their basis in facts. || -- Kirk, "And The Children Shall Lead", stardate 5029.5
01:30 <z-man> waailt, who is z-man-home now?
01:30 <z-man> oh, me
01:31 -!- z-man-home [n=manuel@p50873C04.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
01:31 <z-man> GJ on the conversion, Luke-Jr.
01:35 <guru3> good morning
01:35 <Lucifer_arma> morning
01:35 <Lucifer_arma> what program should i use to rip a cd?
01:36 <Lucifer_arma> according to my menu, kaudiocreator  Hmm...
01:36 <guru3> like audio cd?
01:40 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, I've got it now
01:40 <Lucifer_arma> kaudiocreator seems to only start from a terminal !?
01:40 <Lucifer_arma> #armaservers
01:40 <armabot> Lucifer_arma: Norm's Place (8 players) || CVS Test Server: Fortress (7 players) || ~|DS|~DarkSyndicate's Arena {100MBit} (5 players) || ~"XzL.Accel Clan Server (4 players) || [armagetronad.de] sylvs tavern (2 players) || War spaet gestern... (acceleration, limited views) (0 players) || TAg.servegame.com (0 players) || zSrv Armagetron Server (0 players) || Crazy Tronners Sumo (0 (1 more message)
01:41  * Lucifer_arma doesn't rip many cd's since he doesn't buy new cds anymore
01:53 <n54> morning all :)
01:59 <guru3> i start working for my mom today :(
02:11 <n54> and it's bad?
02:11  * n54 wouldn't want to work for his mom (although I help out) ^^ 
02:11 <guru3> she wants me to work like 9-5 sort of hours :/
02:12 <n54> doing what? :)
02:12 <guru3> random computer related stuff it seems
02:12 <guru3> currently i've got two tasks
02:12 <guru3> a) write idiot's instructions to installing & using teamspeak
02:12 <guru3> b) write a specialized piece of online scehduling software
02:12  * n54 thinks that sounds cool
02:13 <guru3> i've not found a good way to store dates yet
02:13 <guru3> or really dates & times
02:13 <n54> if you can teach your mom then trust me you can teach anyone ^^ (teaching family is the most difficult task)
02:14 <guru3> hmm well
02:14 <guru3> it's not exactly that
02:14 <n54> hmm I don't know about programming in relation to storing dates specifically but I like to do YYYYMMDDHHSS
02:15 <guru3> yeah but because of certain features my mom wants
02:15 <guru3> that won't work so well
02:15 <n54> like?
02:15 <guru3> dunno if i'm allowed to say ><
02:15 <n54> like which weekday it is?
02:15 <n54> or week number?
02:15 <guru3> today's monday
02:16 <n54> yup
02:17 <n54> one could add WeekNumberWeekDay at the end of the one I wrote and then there shouldn't be much more one could wish for :)
02:17 <guru3> never mind ><
02:17 <n54> some calculation will be neccessary anyways for leap years, holiday calculation etc. :)
02:17 <n54> np :)
02:17 <Lucifer_arma> store unix timestamps
02:18 <guru3> ok last i'm gonna talk about stuff i have to do here unless i need help
02:18 <n54> ?
02:19 <guru3> not to be mean but i don't need the advice yet ><
02:25 <Lucifer_arma> yay, crashed arma
02:25 <Lucifer_arma> heh
02:25 <Lucifer_arma> <guru3> i've not found a good way to store dates yet
02:26 <guru3> didn't mean i was asking for a bunch of people to vounteer
02:28 -!- z-man [n=manuel@p50873C04.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]
02:29 <Lucifer_arma> If I were Dave Mustaine, I'd be ashamed of Cryptic Writings
03:05 <Luke-Jr> PHP doesn't have a date type?
03:22 <Lucifer_arma> no, it doesn't
03:22 <Luke-Jr> hm
03:23 <Luke-Jr> Lucifer_arma: BTW, in stage 4 (completed prior to SF), acme's trunk was moved into the pygame branch
03:23 <Luke-Jr> so you're good to go on importing the PyQt into a trunk
03:23 <Lucifer_arma> you were supposed to delete it or leave it alone
03:25 <Luke-Jr> oh?
03:25 <Luke-Jr> from within acme-pyqt's top-level directory: svn import https://svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/armagetronad/tools/acme/trunk
03:27 <Lucifer_arma> there is supposed to be one and only one acme
03:28 <Lucifer_arma> ack, you didn't listen to me before, why should I think you'll listen to me now?  I guess I'll just clean it up, since you obviously wanted to stick me with this crap anyway
03:29 <Luke-Jr> last I checked, the discussion ended with more or less "if i don't have to do anything special, I don't care too much"
03:29 <Luke-Jr> what's wrong with just leaving it alone?
03:30 <Lucifer_arma> that's what I wanted you to do, just leave it alonge
03:30 <Lucifer_arma> *alone
03:30 <Lucifer_arma> I seem to recall saying "no" to having a pygame and a pyqt directory
03:31 <Lucifer_arma> it ws either "leave it out entirely, or move it in exactly as it is"
03:31 <Lucifer_arma> NEVER was it "change it however the fuck you want"
03:31 <Luke-Jr> so you want it moved back to trunk?
03:31 <Lucifer_arma> not that it matters, it's getting renamed, so I'm just going to delete it from acme
03:32 <Lucifer_arma> I take back the nice thing I said about you earlier, you're still just as fucking dense as ever
03:32 <Lucifer_arma> scroll up, I'm not repeating myself
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03:33 <Luke-Jr> note that's no "a pygame and a pyqt directory"
03:33 <Lucifer_arma> <Luke-Jr> Lucifer_arma: BTW, in stage 4 (completed prior to SF), acme's trunk was moved into the pygame branch
03:34 <Luke-Jr> quite a different matter
03:34  * Lucifer_arma has better things to do than split hairs with Luke-Jr
03:34 <z-man> what's up, guys? Should I care?
03:34 <Luke-Jr> it's a historical branch, not an ongoing development trunk
03:34 <Luke-Jr> z-man: Lucifer is whining about irrelevant things
03:35  * Lucifer_arma is irritated that he was  more or less completely ignored on the acme thing
03:35 <Luke-Jr> Lucifer_arma: you said you didn't care so long as the PyQt version could be imported and used as if pygame never existed
03:35 <z-man> Lucifer_arma: you can just remove the thing from the repository now.
03:35 <Lucifer_arma> take it how you want, I'm about ready to just delete the thing off my hard drive and forget I ever tried to share it or any of that
03:36 <z-man> Lucifer_arma: yes, you basically said you don't care as long as you can just do a new clean import. Even I read it as that.
03:36 <Lucifer_arma> maybe host my own svn repo for it, heh
03:37 <Lucifer_arma> ?  ok, fine.
03:37  * Lucifer_arma left with the understanding it would either be deleted or left alone for me to deal with
03:38 <z-man> It was left alone for you to deal with.
03:38 <z-man> You can deal with it now. Just "svn delete" it.
03:38 <Luke-Jr> both, in a sense
03:38 <Lucifer_arma> <Lucifer_arma> <Luke-Jr> Lucifer_arma: BTW, in stage 4 (completed prior to SF), acme's trunk was moved into the pygame branch  <--- we disagree what "left alone" means, apparently
03:38 <z-man> Lucifer_arma: you're not the one anal about history here :)
03:38 <Luke-Jr> yuo can deal with it, but it's not in your way if you don't want to
03:39 <Luke-Jr> so in a sense it's both deleted (from trunk/relevance) and you can still deal with it
03:39 <Luke-Jr> so you can do whatever, or just pretend it doesn't exist
03:40 <Luke-Jr> if you choose not to deal with it, it's not in the way
03:40 <Lucifer_arma> ack, who needs it.  pyqt3 is broken on my machine for no apparent reason, and I've still got a ways to get into pyqt4, I'm not likely to even be touching it anytime soon, which means acme's probably dead anyway
03:40 <Lucifer_arma> why fight about it?
03:40  * Lucifer_arma shuts his mouth and does something else
03:41  * Luke-Jr would prefer it get into Svn at least for history, but it's not important
03:44 <z-man> But if it can be deleted after the import, I'll trust you to leave some
03:44 <z-man> easy instructions. I've been in the svn manual before, and it'll take
03:44 <z-man> some time to get into it. I can do all the same stuff with svn that I
03:44 <z-man> can with cvs, which I've demonstrated isn't much, and anything more
03:44 <z-man> complicated than "svn commit" will be awhile before I get to it."
03:44 <z-man> Lucifer_arma: just for reference, your last acme-related post, IIRC, was: "
03:44 <z-man> eek, the above.
03:44 <z-man> from http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?p=47545#47545
03:45 <z-man> the instructions follow now: do "svn delete acme" in the appropriate folder, then "svn commit".
03:45 <z-man> Sorry if I misinterpreted that.
03:45  * z-man goes off to so something productive, too.
03:46 <Luke-Jr> z-man: I think it was an IRC discussion in which he said that he didn't care so long as he could do a clean import
03:50 <Luke-Jr> Lucifer_arma: if you're just going to trash the PyQt3 version and start anew with PyQt4, I'd appreciate it if you did 'svn import https://svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/armagetronad/tools/acme/branches/pyqt3' (which can then be ignored or even deleted if you insist) just for historical purposes. Sorry for pissing you off about the pygame version, I thought (apparently incorrectly) we were in agreement over the plan with that.
03:50 <Luke-Jr> g'night
03:51  * Lucifer_arma isn't importing any pyqt version until it works a little bit
03:52  * Lucifer_arma might just be bleeding anger from the fish, too
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04:31 <spidey> meh
04:32 <z-man> bouncy?
04:34 <spidey> me?
04:35 <z-man> yes
04:35 <spidey> trying to configure mepis,a 800xwhatever view isn't doable :p
04:35  * spidey is used to 1280x1024
04:36 <spidey> mmm,lets try this
04:36 <spidey> brb
04:36 -!- spidey [n=spidey@68-112-89-155.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has quit ["Leaving"]
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04:56 <spidey> i give up,it isn't accepting my  horizontal and vertical inputs :(
05:35  * z-man wonders whether armabot could take over kteatimer's function
05:35 <z-man> #tea 3 min
05:35 <Lucifer_arma> 2 things, z-man :)
05:35 <n54> don't think there is any plugin like that yet
05:35 <Lucifer_arma> armabot is a supybot, you could see if there's a plugin for it
05:36 <Lucifer_arma> supybot is written in python, you could probably easily write a plugin for it.  The api looks pretty clear, and I'll be happy to install it for you.
05:36 <z-man> probablty too much work. And silly.
05:36 <Lucifer_arma> http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?p=50611#50611  <--- trying to keep ideas collected
05:37 <z-man> Take a simple appliance like a clock...
05:37  * Lucifer_arma is considering looking over kteatimer, actually.
05:37  * Lucifer_arma currently times his tea with a cigarrette
05:38 <z-man> It actually only serves to remind me I have a tea going. 20 minute cold black tea isn't really a pleasure to drink :)
05:38 <Lucifer_arma> sure it is, with sugar
05:39  * Lucifer_arma drinks iced tea all day long
05:39 <z-man> never liked that
05:39 <Lucifer_arma> 2 quarts, 3/4 cup sugar, 3 tea bags.
05:39  * Lucifer_arma notes it's a traditional southern drink in america :)
05:39 <z-man> never liked tea, actually. I think I'm switching back to coffee.
05:40 <Lucifer_arma> you know, if we actually talked about how we spend money (heh), people might be more inclined to donate
05:40  * n54 doesn't like tea or coffe ^^
05:40 <Lucifer_arma> because then they'd know we're doing Good Things with it
05:40 <z-man> Right.
05:40  * Lucifer_arma is starting a thread on that subject
05:40 <n54> open accounting :)
05:41  * z-man wonders whether people would donate to upgrade my bandwidth
05:41 <n54> might
05:42 <z-man> Of course, to run test servers on, not to download porn
05:43 <n54> ^^
05:43 <z-man> grrr, libneon can't be installed non-root, it seems. stupid libtool.
05:43 <z-man> (libneon is part of svn)
05:44  * n54 avoids saying something ...oh no! paradox ^-
05:45 <z-man> no paradox, you just failed :)
05:45 <n54> so harsh! ;_;
05:45 <n54> :)
05:50  * Lucifer_arma thinks a test server on a good coloc site would be a worthy expense
05:50 <Lucifer_arma> http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?p=50621#50621
05:54 <n54> hmm there's a real online bank in britain, I can dig up the name if you want me to (paypal is not a bank and has loads of complaints etc.), one can keep paypal for donations (as well as that bank) but transfer any "holdings" to the real bank where your money actually is safe
05:54 <Lucifer_arma> that's why I set a $1000 upper limit on holdings kept in paypal with the condition that it be distributed.  My sister was an unfortunate victim of a paypal crack while back.  :(
05:55 <Lucifer_arma> and since paypal's not a bank (for some weird reason), they're not required to insure the money they hold.
05:55 <z-man> Yeah, paypal is known to freeze and invalidate accounts at times.
05:55 <n54> $1000 just seems like a lot to loose or get frozen for six months to me
05:55 <Lucifer_arma> I have a savings account with a real online bank.
05:55  * Lucifer_arma is forgetting their name momentarily
05:55 <Lucifer_arma> it's an america bank
05:55 <Lucifer_arma> ING Direct, that's it
05:55  * n54 searches for that bank I'm thinking of as it was better than just about anything
05:56 <Lucifer_arma> they had killer interest rates when we signed up, but they've dropped, now my account with my credit union does better
05:56 <Lucifer_arma> ING's still better than most regular banks, though.  It's hard to compete with a credit union.  :)
05:57 <Lucifer_arma> we should use a Swiss bank :)
05:57 <Lucifer_arma> incorporate in some caribbean island, use a swiss bank account.  Then have yearly developer meetings at our headquarters in the caribbean...
05:57  * n54 is talking about a bank that accepts internet donations etc. just like paypal, not a "normal" internet-enabled personal bank account
05:58 <n54> just can't find that bookmark... (searching)
05:58 <z-man> Yeah, they managed the Nazi money, they can manage the Evil Triumvirate's money as well.
05:58 <Lucifer_arma> amazon has a program, anyway
05:58  * z-man apologizes to the Swiss for this stupid joke
05:59  * Lucifer_arma smiles
05:59 <Lucifer_arma> there was this really hot swiss girl in my history class last semester
06:04 <n54> meh I can't find it :S
06:04  * n54 thinks he's heard about that swiss girl before ^^
06:11 <Lucifer_arma> heh, probably.  She was one of those rare girls that's so beautiful you remember her for awhile
06:19  * Lucifer_arma hopes to encounter her again, actually.  Her voice + accent are perfect for the announcer and Lucifer_arma would like to record her for that.
06:20 <Lucifer_arma> otherwise I might stick you with my daughter's voice.  :)
06:20  * Lucifer_arma is having a hard time believing that with all these europeans around here, somebody can't find a girl with a good voice and rough accent to be our announcer
06:21  * Lucifer_arma thinks its more likely people don't want an announcer, or they have different ideas on what they want for said announcer.
06:22 <n54> don't have any recording equipment
06:22  * Lucifer_arma has writer's block
06:22 <Lucifer_arma> do you have a microphone for your computer?
06:23 <n54> nothing I would use for recording anything (or use at all actually)
06:23 <Lucifer_arma> hmmm....
06:23  * Lucifer_arma thinks a cheapo computer microphone is good enough for the job
06:23  * Lucifer_arma thinks a quiet room is more important
06:23 <n54> but wait what are we ralking about, I'm a hermit goddammit ^^
06:23 <Lucifer_arma> oh yeah, you don't know any girls.  :)
06:24 <n54> girls? people!
06:24 <n54> actually I know too many *deletes humanity*
06:24  * z-man hates people
06:24 <Lucifer_arma> I'll take a man's voice.  What's your voice like?  Is it a high-pitched whiny geek voice like mine?
06:24 <n54> <-- former drill sargeant
06:25 <Lucifer_arma> actually, the best announcer would be z-man--provided he has a good alto, preferably baritone, and a rough accent
06:25 <z-man> I mumble.
06:25 <n54> that sounds so.... heterosexual
06:25 <Lucifer_arma> but if his spoken english is as good as his written english, he'll need a really killer voice.  But being z-man is a prety good recommendation...
06:26 <z-man> And of course, you'd only get a "zree" from me :)
06:26  * n54 wants stephen hawkins to do the intro ..wonder if we can make an appointment ;)
06:26 <Lucifer_arma> no one or two?  ;)
06:26 <n54> hehe z-man :)
06:26 <z-man> well, those I could do, probably
06:26  * Lucifer_arma wonders if we could hit up Frank Oz for it
06:26 <z-man> as miss piggy?
06:27 <Lucifer_arma> as yoda :)
06:27 <Lucifer_arma> problem is, he'd probably count 1 2 3 instead
06:27 <n54> you forgot 0 :)
06:27  * Lucifer_arma sighs.  Dr. Teeth would be good.
06:27 <Lucifer_arma> right now 0 is a whistle
06:28 <Lucifer_arma> pretty annoying, actually.
06:28 <n54> oh yeah
06:28 <n54> *forgot*
06:28 <z-man> Dr. Teeth? Is he the one torturing tomatoes in the US?
06:28 <Lucifer_arma> <--- put the annoying whistle there
06:28 <Lucifer_arma> torturing tomatoes?  I don't recall Dr. Teeth being sadistic
06:28 <n54> who the hell is dr. teeth?
06:28 <Lucifer_arma> the lead singer for Electric Mayhem, of course
06:29 <n54> uh
06:29 <z-man> We have a "Dr. Best" demonstrating the shabby quality of toothbrushes by squishing tomatoes with them
06:29 <n54> hehe
06:29 <Lucifer_arma> is he a muppet?
06:29 <z-man> No, a model dressed up as a dentist
06:29 <z-man> male model
06:29 <n54> dang
06:29 <Lucifer_arma> ahhh.  Dr. Teeth is a muppet
06:29 <Lucifer_arma> voiced by Jim Henson :(
06:30 <Lucifer_arma> retired as a character when Him Henson died, now he only makes cameos
06:30 <z-man> Must have missed that episode
06:30 <Lucifer_arma> ?  He's in all three movies
06:30 <Lucifer_arma> *5  all five, but only does a cameo in the last two
06:30 <Lucifer_arma> green muppet, big teeth, one gold tooth, he's in the band...
06:31 <z-man> Ah, gold tooth. I remember him.
06:31 <n54> yeah I sort of remember that one
06:31 <Lucifer_arma> he sings "You can't take no for an answer" in the movie about the play
06:32 <Lucifer_arma> hmm, maybe we should figure out what else the announcer actually says.  I think we're only going to get one real shot at an announcer, then we have to live with it or risk having more than one voice
06:33  * Lucifer_arma wonders if tank or phillippe could get a swede to do it, and if it would sound like the swedish chef
06:34  * Lucifer_arma still has writer's block
06:35 <Lucifer_arma> starting an article is so hard, maybe I should start in the middle and write the beginning at the end
06:35 <z-man> Woooo! svn is finally working here!
06:35 <z-man> yes, starting in the middle is usually a good idea
06:37 <Lucifer_arma> I should have written it yesterday, I had most of it mapped in my head yesterday, but no.  I had to insist on trying to build a custom target first.
06:38 <Lucifer_arma> what's the command to checkout svn?  :)
06:38 <z-man> svn co https://svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/armagetronad/armagetronad/trunk/
06:39 <z-man> reminds me, I've got to phase out of here and seriously rate those tests.
06:40 -!- z-man is now known as z-man-work
06:40 <z-man-work> (not really away)
06:40 <n54> not really working either? ;)
06:43 <Lucifer_arma> deque::end() points to 1 after the last element, right?
06:45 <Lucifer_arma> yep, looks like someone clobbered my change that fixed the playlist bug, so it's not a new bug, it's an old fixed bug :(
06:48 <n54> ?
06:49 <Lucifer_arma> playlist bug: segfault when you try to go to the song after the last song on the list, or the song before the first song.  Failed bounds checking.
06:49 <n54> what program are you talking about?
06:49 <Lucifer_arma> I fixed it months ago, and then it reappeared.  I thought it was something different, but looking at the code now tells me it's the same old one.
06:49 <Lucifer_arma> armagetronad
06:49 <n54> oh it has a playlist... :O :D
06:50  * Lucifer_arma wants to push for a 0.3 release soon to start off the development series, but can't do so in good conscience with a known crash bug like that
06:50 <Lucifer_arma> you lose the cycle motor sound, though, and I didn't get to restarting the openAL branch during the break.  Maybe during the semester, no promises, but I'd like to get to it asap.
06:52 <z-man-work> It's a dev release, some regressions are tolerable. The motor sound isn't that important.
06:52 <z-man-work> (crashes are)
06:52 <Lucifer_arma> testing the fix right now
06:52 <Lucifer_arma> or soon, anyway
06:52 <Lucifer_arma> building :)
06:53 <Lucifer_arma> also, I want to keep the sdl_mixer stuff around, but have no intention of adding in the cycle motor.  But I want a configure option to build with it instead of the openAL stuff when it's available
06:53 <Lucifer_arma> so people that want music but might have trouble satisfying the openAL dependency can have it
06:54 -!- deja_vu [n=deja_vu@p50908BCB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #armagetron
06:58 <Lucifer_arma> how do I get distcc to work with arma?
07:00 <z-man-work> You just set CXX="distcc g++"
07:01 <Lucifer_arma> ahhh, CXX is the one I wanted
07:02 <Lucifer_arma> I set CC and it distributed .c files :)
07:02 <Lucifer_arma> I should add this to my bash profile, shouldn't I?
07:03 <z-man-work> If you want it to be permanent, yes.
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07:10 <Lucifer_arma> committed, can we release 0.3?
07:10 <Lucifer_arma> :)
07:11 <z-man-work> Heh, we need to adapt the release process to SVN first
07:12 <z-man-work> and decide whether we should do a tiny stabilization branch for possible further critical bugs that only happen on other peoples' systems
07:12  * Lucifer_arma posted to start the discussion :)
07:13 <guru3> can we just not care about bugs on people's systems? :)
07:13 <Lucifer_arma> since it's a development series, I'd suggest we *not* do a stabilization branch
07:13 <z-man-work> Well, you two can make it an admin decision then :)
07:13 <Lucifer_arma> just spend a couple of days on those bugs and hold off the release, or release with those bugs and state them :)
07:13 <z-man-work> I'd say we should do one, but don't care enough to figh.
07:13 <wrtlprnft> #morning
07:13 <armabot> Good Morning wrtlprnft! Random Fortune:  Old programmers never die, they just branch to a new address.
07:14 <Lucifer_arma> :)  I'm saying "do the stabilization work directly in the trunk", not ignore it
07:14 <wrtlprnft> Luke-Jr: yes, we *need* TTF support. That's it. Everything else is pointless since TTF is a pseudo- standard and most users can deal with it
07:14 <Lucifer_arma> maybe I'm on crack on it, you've been our release engineer anyway and know faarrrr more about it then I do
07:15 <Lucifer_arma> I see you slept well, wrtlprnft 
07:15 <z-man-work> You've got to tell everyone not to do weird stuff while we're stabilizing, that's the only problem I see.
07:15 <wrtlprnft> yeah
07:15 <z-man-work> Holding back dangerous commits shouldn't be too much to ask.
07:16 <z-man-work> Branching has the simple advantage that people who don't care about the release don't have to change their workflow.
07:16 <Lucifer_arma> wrtlprnft: can you cure my writer's block?  I've been fucking off hoping it would cure it
07:17 <wrtlprnft> Lucifer_arma: yes std::deque<>::end() points beyond the last element
07:17 <Lucifer_arma> for a long release process where stabilization is required in the release, I see how stablizing would seriously impact someone's workflow :)
07:17  * wrtlprnft has no idea how
07:17 <Lucifer_arma> I guess it depends on how long it takes us to do the kind of stabilization you're talking about  If we're talking a couple of weeks, then a branch is probably what we should do
07:17 <z-man-work> Point is, you don't know in advance how long stabilizing will take.
07:18 <Lucifer_arma> but if it's only a couple of days....
07:18 <z-man-work> Ugly bugs have the tendency to jump out exactly on the day of the planned final release :)
07:18 <Lucifer_arma> ahhh.  We could say "hold off dangerous commits, let's try to knock out these bugs".  Then a couple of days later, "Well, let's branch to stabilzie this one, it's taking longer than expected"
07:18 <z-man-work> Lucifer_arma: right, that's a possibility. gets my vote.
07:19 <Lucifer_arma> and if we find ourselves doing that too much, then we just make it standing operating procedure in the future and forget I ever wanted to not do it :)
07:22 <Lucifer_arma> wrtlprnft: thanks on the deque thing.  I just committed a fix that works, hopefully it doesn't leave out a song in the doing.
07:23 <wrtlprnft> haha
07:23  * Lucifer_arma hopes he's not laughing because he tested the fix and it doesn't work
07:25 <wrtlprnft> I'm having my speakers turned off at all times unless i really need sound
07:25 <Lucifer_arma> * Known issue: you have to start the player yourself if you want music ingame, and apparently you have to have a custom playlist because the bundled music isn't working for me.
07:25 <Lucifer_arma> so you could be getting that random crash and not having any idea why it's crashing?  ;)
07:26 <Lucifer_arma> I hate drinking tea leaves :(
07:27 <wrtlprnft> Lucifer_arma: well, it only crashes on exit for me
07:27 <Lucifer_arma> I don't think that's a playlist bug.  I could be wrong, but I don't get that crash
07:28 <z-man-work> Have you tried switching audio drivers?
07:28 <Lucifer_arma> I get occasional crashed when I leave a server that I dont' know why they're happening that could be playlist-related
07:28 <wrtlprnft> i just mean that i don't have a random crash bug, so i'm happy
07:28 <z-man-work> For me, arts has a tendency to deadlock with something on exit.
07:28 <Lucifer_arma> there's a reason people call it "farts"
07:28  * Lucifer_arma disables arts first thing on a new installation
07:29 <Lucifer_arma> it shouldn't even be necessary anymore, alsa can handle multiple sound sources now
07:29 <z-man-work> Is there a USE=-arts?
07:29 <wrtlprnft> yes there is
07:35 <z-man-work> Lucifer_arma: when you said "BUG: spongebob just went through my wall", was that referring to the previous round?
07:38 <Lucifer_arma> happened right before that, iirc.  Literally right before it.  I lost the round because I stopped to make the report
07:38 <Lucifer_arma> it was after breaking, I think.  We were both headed towards the wall, then I cut him off and he should've died, but went through my wall
07:38 <Lucifer_arma> looked like a lag hiccup and I expected to be dead, but then I wasn't and he took the zone
07:39 <Lucifer_arma> I think he was using the name bobsponge :)
07:40 <z-man-work> Hmm, sounds a bit like the last phasing incident
08:03 <z-man-work> Gaa, no, no grinding was involved. I hope this is an old bug so I have an excuse not to fix it for
08:18 <z-man-work> Heh, lesson: if you either want to kill A or B, you shouldn't do if (..) kill A; else if (...) kill B;
08:18 <z-man-work> You just had very good aim :) Old bug, won't fix. Phew.
08:19 <wrtlprnft> if (..) kill A; else if (...) kill B; else { kill A; kil B }
08:19 <wrtlprnft> :P
08:30 <Lucifer_arma> you should do if(player = Lucifer) kill TheOtherGuy
08:30 <Lucifer_arma> do it early and often :)
08:31 <wrtlprnft> player = Lucifer? We'll end up having all players named Lucifer in no time!
08:31 <wrtlprnft> try player == Lucifer ;)
08:31 <n54> :)
08:46 <Lucifer_arma> pseudocode doesn't need to be correct c++ syntax :)
08:59 -!- SD|bbmonday is now known as Self_Destructo
08:59 <Self_Destructo> good morning :)
09:00 <n54> morning :)
09:01 <Self_Destructo> ROFL spidey!
09:01 <Self_Destructo> i got a message from the leader of the ALEIN alliacne and they are planning to cook your goose, lol
09:17 <deja_vu> hey SD :)
09:27 <Self_Destructo> deja_vu: hey there
09:27 <Self_Destructo> 2.10507 deja_vu
09:27 <deja_vu> o.o
09:27 <Self_Destructo> that's what you are on the ladder on my server :)
09:28 <deja_vu> oh xD
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10:23 <flea> yoz
10:23 <flea> sd whassup
10:25 <guru3> Lucifer_arma: there is no cashflow.
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11:07 <philippeqc> hi
11:07 <wrtlprnft> hi philippeqc 
11:08 <philippeqc> yesterday z-man pointed to me that collections couldnt hold auto_ptr, but that boost::shared_ptr could be used instead.
11:08 <philippeqc> I'm not sure if he considered adding another dependency for the project.
11:09 <philippeqc> http://www.boost.org/libs/smart_ptr/smart_ptr.htm
11:15 <philippeqc> I wouldn't have any prob including one more dependency, seeing how this one is packed tight with high-octane material.
11:16 <philippeqc> (that and allows me to continue with my coding)
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11:18 <wrtlprnft> well, that wouldn't be a dependency i think
11:18 <z-man-work> philippeqc: another way would be to copy over the parts of boost we need into our source
11:18 <wrtlprnft> that would go into thirdparty/
11:18 <z-man-work> but seeing most of it is template stuff, we wouldn't get a RUNTIME dependency either way.
11:19 <z-man-work> (which is what most people worry about, especially for C++ libraries)
11:19 <wrtlprnft> most of it? all of it!
11:19 <z-man-work> Lucifer had to compile boost for his car computer thing, suggesting it also has regular library parts
11:19 <philippeqc> I just browsed throught the titles of the different items included there, and I wouldn't mind having it whole as a thirdparty.
11:21 <z-man-work> I'd prefer it as a regular, compile time, external dependency for now.
11:21 <z-man-work> We can move it into thirdparty if we include the non-template stuff and want to avoid the C++ linking hell.
11:22 <wrtlprnft> uh, what's the ebuild for that?
11:22 <z-man-work> boost?
11:22 <wrtlprnft> o, nvm
11:22  * philippeqc should be more carefull of the terms he uses. Please consider that I dont know bleep about the effect and impacts of every type of linkage and you wont be that far from truth, but consider my enthousiam into having access to the full thing.
11:23 <z-man-work> you have access to the whole thing :)
11:24 <philippeqc> ok, but wont it be a pain for every developers to having it on their machine?
11:24 <z-man-work> More pain than X, OpenGL, FTGL, SDL, g++? No.
11:24 <philippeqc> mandriva has it as a package, so I'd guess its quite accepted in most distros. 
11:24 <z-man-work> It's a regular library.
11:25 <philippeqc> ok
11:25  * z-man-work may be a bit pissed at having it to install manually at work, but that is his problem.
11:25 <philippeqc> then what would be the impact beside having a bigger exec due to use of even more templates?
11:26 <z-man-work> Having it as a compile time dependency. Everyone building from source needs to have it installed.
11:28 <philippeqc> here as it was installed in the right directories, I was able to compile without options to g++. But I assume the makefile/configure would need to be updated to point to it explicitly.
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11:30 <z-man-work> I'll see whether nondefault directories are a problem here. Everything goes to ~/usr/ for me :)
11:33 <Lucifer_arma> isn't there a runtime for boost?
11:33 <z-man-work> There is, but some parts don't use it.
11:33  * Lucifer_arma also thought boost was only for python bindings anyway
11:33 <Lucifer_arma> philippeqc: what are you wanting to use boost for right now?  I think I missed that...
11:34 <z-man-work> shared_ptr, currently
11:34 <philippeqc> shared_ptr
11:34 <Lucifer_arma> ahh, I see.  YOu want to put a fancy pointer class into a collection. don't we have a fancy pointer class already?
11:34 <philippeqc> in my case, I'd be able to have collections of smart pointers. auto_ptr cannot be used inside of a collection.
11:35 <Lucifer_arma> right, but we have a smart pointer class.  would it suit you?
11:35  * Lucifer_arma tries to remember what it's called
11:35 <z-man-work> Our smart pointers don't work with arbitrary objects.
11:35 <Lucifer_arma> only gameobjects?
11:35 <z-man-work> tJUST_CONTROLLED_PTR.....
11:35 <z-man-work> don't ask.
11:35 <Lucifer_arma> ok, nvm then
11:35 <z-man-work> it works with all tReferencables
11:35 <z-man-work> which includes all nNetObjects
11:36 <Lucifer_arma> I SAID NEVERMIND THEN!!!!  :)
11:36 <z-man-work> so all game objects, yes.
11:36 <z-man-work> The don't ask was just for the tJUST_CONTROLLED_PTR name :)
11:36 <Lucifer_arma> heh, ok.  ;)
11:36 <z-man-work> It's... historic.
11:36 <Lucifer_arma> what else is in boost that you want it for, philippeqc ?
11:36 <philippeqc> at the moment, only this.
11:37 <z-man-work> But it's full of useful crap.
11:37 <z-man-work> We can probably annoy Luke buy using it, too.
11:37 <z-man-work> *by using*
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11:40 <ghableska> hi
11:40 <Lucifer_arma> as much fun as it would be, I'm not sure that "annoying luke" should be a design goal :)
11:40 <Lucifer_arma> it does look to have a lot of useful crap
11:40 <wrtlprnft> annoy luke because he hates all c++ template magic
11:40 <Lucifer_arma> I'm thinking if we creep it in now, sooner or later we'll have it as a runtime library, so we should either marry it now or philippeqc should find another solution to his problem
11:41 <Lucifer_arma> *runtime dependency
11:41 <wrtlprnft> what else is using boost?
11:41 <z-man-work> We only get it as a runtime dependency if we explicitly link with it.
11:41 <z-man-work> it can't happen by accident.
11:41 <Lucifer_arma> I'm concerned about dependencies, but boost has a path to python.  I'd hate to throw away other scripting languages, but boost has a path to python...
11:41 <wrtlprnft> it wasn't installed on my system and i have a lot of crap on here
11:42 <z-man-work> It's a horrible path, they say.
11:42 <Lucifer_arma> true, but for quite a few of our linux users, having it as a compile-time dependency is synonymous with runtime dependency
11:42 <wrtlprnft> so it can't be very common :(
11:42 <Lucifer_arma> it's not common enough to be considered a system library, but it's common enough that we can expect packages to be readily available
11:42 <z-man-work> Probably everyone just picks the bits he's using out of it and adds them as third party sources.
11:43 <z-man-work> We could so that automagically on "make dist".
11:43 <Lucifer_arma> that's kinda what it looks like they intended for you to do, boost is a collection of libraries (looking at the website right now)
11:43 <Lucifer_arma> they got an svn repo?  :)
11:44 <z-man-work> Thinking about using externals?
11:44 <wrtlprnft> if it's small enough I'd say include it in thirdparty. or leave it to the project admins
11:44 <Lucifer_arma> no, they're in cvs
11:44 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, Luke-Jr and I actually agreed on something, which was to use externals to link our thirdparty libraries
11:45 <Lucifer_arma> I've got something, it'll be more work :)
11:45 <Lucifer_arma> include it in thirdparty, but have the configure option to use the system-installed one if available
11:45 <z-man-work> That isn't too much extra work.
11:45 <Lucifer_arma> and just take the bits we use.
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11:46 <Lucifer_arma> how about checking for a system-installed boost and if it's not there, then use the one included?  Not sure what use that is
11:46 <z-man-work> Lucifer_arma: you're not on this "five twenty minute naps distributed over the day" sleep mode?
11:47 <Lucifer_arma> ok, yeah, not really, but I need to go to bed.  You want I should cut out?  ;)
11:47 <z-man-work> Just wondering :)
11:47 <Lucifer_arma> (that's actualy waht I was about to do, mark myself away and close the lid)
11:48  * Lucifer_arma is away: sleeping
11:55 <philippeqc> excuse my lack of understanding about the problems of both type of dependency (compile vs runtime), but what the impacts. I guess for compile time it means a bigger executable, and for runtime, that the library must be on the target system, and for user of pre-compiled binaries, it would need to be part of the installer.
11:57 <wrtlprnft> what parts are a library anyways? Everything that's not inline would mean a pretty serious performance loss...
11:57 <z-man-work> You don't really have a choice with boost::shared_ptr, it's a template. It has to be a compile time dependency without run time dependency, blowing up the executable.
11:58 <wrtlprnft> but that's the same with std::auto_ptr
11:58 <philippeqc> but so is auto_ptr or any template that I happen to create in the code (ok, none at all, but I had a few in a previous version)
11:58 <z-man-work> Right.
11:59 <wrtlprnft> and it shouldn't be that serious anyways
11:59 <z-man-work> From the point of view of someone installing a binary build, there is no difference between these cases.
11:59 <z-man-work> Right again.
11:59 <wrtlprnft> just a few functions, no complex algorythms and stuff :)
12:00 <wrtlprnft> actually std::auto_ptr blows up your code everywhere you use it since it has a lot of inline functions
12:01 <wrtlprnft> but most of those functions are smaller than the machine code you would need to call them if they weren't inline
12:01 <philippeqc> yes. but I'm trying to figure out what would be the cost of having "access" to it all (vs a scaled down version)
12:02 <wrtlprnft> if it's all templates and they aren't used the blowup would be 0
12:03 <wrtlprnft> if it isn't an external library the linker should throw out everything that isn't used, right?
12:03 <philippeqc> anyone who want to compile it would need to install it on their system, and its seems its rarely installed based on our sampling of 3 developers that didnt have it.
12:03 <z-man-work> Right about the installation cost. We should include the bits we're using at least in the tarballs.
12:04 <wrtlprnft> 3? I thought we were 4
12:04 <z-man-work> (this thing takes ages to compile)
12:04 <wrtlprnft> arma or boost?
12:04 <z-man-work> boost
12:06 <wrtlprnft> ! boost is 11MB
12:06 <wrtlprnft> don't include i guess
12:07 <wrtlprnft> [ebuild  N    ] dev-libs/boost-1.33.1  -bcp -bjam -debug -doc -pyste -static -threads -threadsonly 11,237 kB
12:07 <philippeqc> in mandriva, the library package (of *.so.1) is 1.6 megs. The devel package (*.hpp *.ipp) is 35 megs (I'd say unpacked)
12:07 <wrtlprnft> that should be 11MB source packed
12:08 <wrtlprnft> g2g, cya
12:08 <philippeqc> yep
12:08 <philippeqc> cya
12:08 <z-man-work> bye
12:08 <z-man-work> Maybe we can add the bits we're actually using as "fake" externals?
12:09 <z-man-work> Add make rules that fetch the version we want from their CVS archive?
12:09 <philippeqc> ok, so for people interested to compile arma and on dial-up, it might feel quite a heavy download. 
12:10 <philippeqc> yes, that could be quite convenient, also if coupled with the "dont use external if it is already on the host system"
12:11 <z-man-work> Using a pre-installed version has the disadvantage that we don't know what version it will be; it may be incompatible. They warn about that in the FAQ.
12:12 <philippeqc> o ok
12:14 <philippeqc> so we end up with a "on demand" system, where we collect from cvs the relevant bits as thirdparty. Am I correct?
12:14 <z-man-work> I think we should try that, yes.
12:56 <philippeqc> Humm, my prototype is working ;)
12:57 <philippeqc> http://pastebin.com/745185
12:58 <philippeqc> Well, I guess I should now re-grow it to have all the capacity wrtlprnft's original version had.
13:13 <SuPeRTaRD> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6880888700625496919
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13:49 <wrtl_web_broken> philippeqc: 178: std::set<BasePtr> ColNode::GetCol(void) const { return m_col
13:50 <wrtl_web_broken> you want to change that to std::set<BasePtr> const &ColNode::GetCol(void) const { return m_col
13:50 <wrtl_web_broken> almost certainly, your current function will copy the set twice
13:53 <philippeqc> would changing the footpring of all GetCol to return std::set<BasePtr> const & fix this?
13:54 <spidey> heh sd
13:54 <spidey> they can try ;)
13:55 <philippeqc> uncomment line 495, and in line 497-505 you get the proper data
13:56 <philippeqc> the data is there only once
13:58 <wrtl_web_broken> ph: yes, it should
13:59 <wrtl_web_broken> man, i love chatting like this. *really* broken
14:00 <philippeqc> o
14:02 <wrtl_web_broken> i can't test anything from here :(
14:02 <wrtl_web_broken> i can't test anything from here :(
14:05 <philippeqc> well, it doesnt return any doubled data.
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14:06 <philippeqc> I'll be leaving now, I'm beaten. But I've noted the change and will insert it tomorrow.
14:08 <philippeqc> cya
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14:44 <spidey> Self_Destructo ?
14:52 <joda_bot> wrtl_web_broken: What's broken with the web chat ?
14:53 -!- nemostultae [n=nemostul@a1174.upc-a.chello.nl] has quit []
14:55 <joda_bot> wrtlprnft: The web chat is broken ?
14:56 -!- joda_web [n=543d2f4d@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has joined #armagetron
14:57 <joda_bot> test
14:59 -!- joda_web [n=543d2f4d@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has quit [Client Quit]
15:08 <joda_bot> #notes
15:08 <armabot> joda_bot: I currently have notes waiting for Luke-Jr, madmax, and phil.
15:15 <Luke-Jr> that's nice
15:15 <Luke-Jr> give me mine
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16:20 <z-man> joda_bot: What version of Code::Blocks are you using? Yours seems to support dependencies, mine doesn't.
16:27 <joda_bot> z-man: a nightly
16:27 <z-man> We should syncronize them :)
16:27 <joda_bot> z-man: CB_20060428_rev2395_win32_wx263.7z
16:27 <z-man> My version reverted all your changes
16:27 <z-man> eeek
16:28 <joda_bot> I had some major crashes on W2k with the rcs
16:28 <joda_bot> the nightly was way more stable
16:28 <z-man> Ok, I'm declaring you the master of the version of code::blocks to use on the trunk.
16:29 <z-man> I'll sync with yours.
16:29 <z-man> But keep away from with it, please :)
16:29 <joda_bot> Never intended to
16:30 <joda_bot> Just added it to head as the code is in dev there too
16:30 <joda_bot> So I thought it won't hurt that much to use a nightly / dependency enabled version
16:31 <z-man> yes, that's probably right. Now I also understand your commit message :)
16:32 <z-man> The CB version seemed very cryptic.
16:32 <z-man> Umm, I already deleted the .depend files and added them to the ignore file list. Is that a problem for your build?
16:32 <z-man> My v1.0 regererates them every time anyway.
16:34 <joda_bot> ah, did they release a v1.0 ?
16:36 <z-man> I think it's one of the RCs,actually.
16:36 <z-man> The title bar says v1.0.
16:36 <guru3> nn ya'll
16:36 <joda_bot> z-man: ok, I guess most later versions will probably be compatible but I'm not 100% sure
16:37 <joda_bot> hi guru3
16:37 <joda_bot> guru3: Should we add a chat with dev support on the website ?
16:37 <joda_bot> I guess it would really make it easier for ppl to report bugs without registering etc.
16:37 <z-man> later, yes, but mine seems older
16:39 <joda_bot> z-man: was a bleeding edge nightly at that time
16:39 <joda_bot> about 3-4 weeks ago
16:39 <z-man> yes, I grabbed it.
16:39 <z-man> How do you install it?
16:40 <z-man> I unpacked it, but the exe complains about missing libraries.
16:40 <z-man> Do I have some base files to install?
16:40 <joda_bot> I had to download a separate dll
16:40 <joda_bot> because it uses a newer wx263 dll or something
16:41 <joda_bot> wxmsw26u_gcc_cb_wx2.6.3.7z
16:41 <joda_bot> +CB_20060428_rev2395_win32_wx263.7z
16:41 <joda_bot> Is that still the latest build ?
16:43 <z-man> found the docs on it, I think I'll manage it on my own. But not today, it's bedtime.
16:43 <joda_bot> gn8 ;)
16:44 <z-man> night
16:44 <z-man> #night, armabot
17:00 <wrtlprnft> joda_bot: the web chat isn't broken
17:00 <wrtlprnft> but i tunnel it through a proxy php script to bypass the school filter
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17:01 <wrtlprnft> that breaks it, i can't see channel messages, just write them
17:01 <wrtlprnft> and it refuses to log me out...
17:02 <wrtlprnft> wrtl_web_broken: die!
17:02 -!- wrtl_web_broken [n=c26960b0@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has quit ["CGI:IRC (EOF)"]
17:03 <joda_bot> ;)
17:04 <joda_bot>  /quit might work then ?
17:04 -!- joda_bot [n=anonymou@dslb-084-061-047-077.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit ["on the run"]
17:04 <wrtlprnft> probably
17:04 <wrtlprnft> i just closed the browser tab
17:04 -!- joda_bot [n=anonymou@dslb-084-061-047-077.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #armagetron
17:05 <joda_bot> hehe gaim respects /quit commands
17:05 <wrtlprnft> and the PHP script on my server keeps the connection open, so the script on your server doesn't have a way to know I'm not there anymore
17:05 <joda_bot> only for the irc connection though
17:05 <wrtlprnft> 17:04 <wrtlprnft> probably
17:05 <wrtlprnft> 17:04 <wrtlprnft> i just closed the browser tab
17:05 -!- z-man [n=manuel@p50873C04.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]
17:06 <joda_bot> I can't come up with any way how to fix this, except by fixing your proxy ;)
17:06 <joda_bot> or manual work for me ... but I'm not tank :-P
17:06 <wrtlprnft> that proxy script is just one big hack ;)
17:06 <joda_bot> as most firewall by passes are ;)
17:07 <wrtlprnft> so no, not your fault. But it is broken
17:07 <joda_bot> huh ? 
17:07 <wrtlprnft> wrtl_web_broken is broken
17:07 <joda_bot> You want it to timeout if there is no data transmitted but the connection is established ?
17:07 <wrtlprnft> no, I don't care
17:07 <wrtlprnft> i can kill my web server once i get home and it logs me out
17:08 <joda_bot> uhm, it's already gone ;)
17:08 <joda_bot> just a few seconds after you asked it to go
17:08 <wrtlprnft> yeah, i know
17:08 <joda_bot> I did not do anything about it
17:08 <wrtlprnft> that's when i restarted apache
17:08 <joda_bot> oh
17:08 <wrtlprnft> my webserver that hosts the proxy
17:09 <joda_bot> So I'll investigate if there is another timeout value I can lower to make idle connection break faster
17:09 <joda_bot> perhaps 1h of idleness ?
17:09 <wrtlprnft> it doesn't matter i think...
17:09 <joda_bot> but it's probably difficult to tell if the client still reads the data
17:09 <wrtlprnft> from your server's point of view, the client IS still reading the data
17:09 <joda_bot> as the webserver will not pass the tcp acks a long where php or anything else can detect them
17:10 <joda_bot> hm
17:10 <joda_bot> I might add a talk idle timeout
17:10 <joda_bot> e.g. don't say something for 15min and you leave
17:11 <wrtlprnft> if that would be true for real clients as well everyone would get kicked twice a day
17:11 <joda_bot> ich gehe ins Bett ... good night .. .ach sch?ner Sprachsalat
17:12 <joda_bot> no I'm just thinking about doing that for the web clients
17:12 <joda_bot> otherwise the channel might die in proxy based chat bots ;)
17:12 <wrtlprnft> night joda_bot 
17:12 <joda_bot> would be interesting if a real proxy caches the data :-P
17:13 <wrtlprnft> my script doesn't
17:13 -!- joda_bot [n=anonymou@dslb-084-061-047-077.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #armagetron []
17:18 <wrtlprnft> take that Luke-Jr!
17:21 -!- nemostultae [n=nemostul@a1174.upc-a.chello.nl] has joined #armagetron
17:22 <wrtlprnft> now we have two people wanting a server for free?!
17:22  * wrtlprnft remembers christi
17:22 <wrtlprnft> well, and their site, apart from the fact that he can't spell url, is pretty well done as well.
17:23 <wrtlprnft> Unable to connect to database on 'localhost' with user 'xxxx'
17:23 <wrtlprnft> Dear user, our technicians are aware of this issue! Please bear with us as we fix this bug!
17:24 <wrtlprnft> who would call his db user xxxx?
--- Log closed Mon May 29 18:27:47 2006
--- Log opened Mon May 29 19:18:35 2006
19:18 -!- wrtlprnft [n=wrtlprnf@S0106000f6687e817.wp.shawcable.net] has joined #armagetron
19:18 -!- Irssi: #armagetron: Total of 15 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 15 normal]
19:18 -!- Irssi: Join to #armagetron was synced in 5 secs
19:18 <wrtlprnft> finally
19:18  * wrtlprnft kicks his provider
19:34  * spidey kicks wrtlprnft 
19:34 <wrtlprnft> no violence!
19:35 <spidey> you started it
19:35 <wrtlprnft> it's no fair anyways
19:35 <wrtlprnft> 8 legs vs 2
19:35 <wrtlprnft> you're my provider?
19:35 <spidey> ol
19:35 <spidey> lol
19:35 <spidey> and it's only unfair because you're human
19:35 <wrtlprnft> :P
19:35 <spidey> ;D
19:35 <spidey> i broke my desk kinfa
19:36 <spidey> kinda
19:36 <spidey> i made a keyboard holder
19:36 <wrtlprnft> o_O
19:36 <spidey> well,i got tired of switching board spots everytime i had to type on one of the computers
19:37 <spidey> now one's in the droor
19:37 <spidey> 'er
--- Log opened Mon May 29 19:43:30 2006
19:43 -!- wrtlprnft_ [n=wrtlprnf@S0106000f6687e817.wp.shawcable.net] has joined #armagetron
19:43 -!- Irssi: #armagetron: Total of 16 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 16 normal]
19:43 <spidey> ?
19:43 -!- Irssi: Join to #armagetron was synced in 11 secs
19:43 <spidey> wb i think?
19:43 -!- wrtlprnft [n=wrtlprnf@S0106000f6687e817.wp.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
19:43 <spidey> http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/6293/untitled8cd1.jpg   <<wrtl look at the download manager
19:44 <wrtlprnft_> yes wb
19:44 <wrtlprnft_> sec, just crashed with an empty battery
19:44 -!- You're now known as wrtlprnft
19:44 <Vanhayes> he is using the name Vangoe and is  sending out kick votes and lots of bots and changing each bots IP
19:45 <wrtlprnft> #last --nolimit
19:45 <armabot> wrtlprnft: [19:44:59] <Vanhayes> he is using the name Vangoe and is  sending out kick votes and lots of bots and changing each bots IP, [19:44:39] <wrtlprnft_> sec, just crashed with an empty battery, [19:44:28] <wrtlprnft_> yes wb, [19:43:56] <spidey> http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/6293/untitled8cd1.jpg   <<wrtl look at the download manager, [19:43:39] <spidey> wb i think?, [19:43:34] <spidey> (50 more messages)
19:45 <wrtlprnft> #more
19:45 <armabot> wrtlprnft: ?, [19:43:28] <spidey> wrtl look at that pic, [19:42:29] <Vanhayes> god I hate maccattack, [19:42:05] <spidey> http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/6293/untitled8cd1.jpg, [19:38:07] <spidey> 'er, [19:38:01] <spidey> now one's in the droor, [19:36:51] <spidey> well,i got tired of switching board spots everytime i had to type on one of the computers, [19:36:25] <wrtlprnft> o_O, [19:36:20] (49 more messages)
19:47  * wrtlprnft would never download a distro with more than one CD image (unless it's a life DVD)
19:47 <wrtlprnft> the programs on it are outdated before you even finish the download
19:47 <spidey> it's not what i'm downloading
19:47 <spidey> it's the speed i'm downloadin them at
19:47 <wrtlprnft> uh, well
19:48 <wrtlprnft> if you really download a lot... I'd have no use for it :P
19:48 <spidey> i borrowed a friends uncapped moterola
19:48 <spidey> that was yesterday
19:49 <wrtlprnft> o_O
19:49 <spidey> found a 1 gigbit server to download off of
19:49 <spidey> to see what speed i'd get
19:49 <wrtlprnft> how to waste other people's traffic :(
19:49 <spidey> lol
19:50 <spidey> i should have found a torrent with a shitload of peers
19:50 <wrtlprnft> yeah, do something useful and seed for a few minutes :P
19:50 <spidey> lol
20:01 <spidey> sd?
20:01 <wrtlprnft> http://wrtlprnft.ath.cx/fast.png
20:01 <wrtlprnft> that's fast :P
20:02 <spidey> lan transfer? :p
20:02 <wrtlprnft> nope
20:02 <wrtlprnft> transfer from :P
20:02 <spidey> lol!
20:02 <wrtlprnft> would be faster with two different HDs i guess
20:03 <wrtlprnft> i should have enabled gzip compression, that would have increased it even more
20:03 <wrtlprnft> (that file was a 1GB- chunk of /dev/zero)
20:14 -!- guru3 [n=guru3@2002:51e7:e65f:1:0:0:0:1] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
20:14 -!- guru3 [n=guru3@2002:51e7:e65f:1:0:0:0:1] has joined #armagetron
20:25 -!- nemostultae [n=nemostul@a1174.upc-a.chello.nl] has quit []
20:34 <Vanhayes> leaving
20:34 <Vanhayes> #leaving
20:35 -!- Vanhayes [n=Vanhayes@stjhnbsu84w-156034188459.nb.aliant.net] has quit ["Leaving"]
21:11 -!- GodTodd [n=GodTodd@67-42-207-93.albq.qwest.net] has joined #armagetron
21:31 <wrtlprnft> http://wrtlprnft.ath.cx/screen.png
21:31 <wrtlprnft> maybe this screen session is getting a bit too big/busy...
21:40 -!- guru3 [n=guru3@2002:51e7:e65f:1:0:0:0:1] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
21:40 -!- deja_vu_ [n=deja_vu@] has joined #armagetron
21:41 -!- guru3 [n=guru3@2002:51e7:e65f:1:0:0:0:1] has joined #armagetron
21:48 -!- deja_vu [n=deja_vu@p50908BCB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)]
21:49 <Self_Destructo> spidey: you there?
21:59 -!- Self_Destructo is now known as SD|away
22:07 <spidey> yea
22:07 <spidey> you gone?
22:26 <wrtlprnft> #night
22:26 <armabot> Good night wrtlprnft!
22:32 -!- guru3 [n=guru3@2002:51e7:e65f:1:0:0:0:1] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
22:33 -!- guru3 [n=guru3@2002:51e7:e65f:1:0:0:0:1] has joined #armagetron
23:22  * Lucifer_arma is back.
23:22  * Lucifer_arma wishes he'd never mentioned the cd thing now, heh
23:32 <Lucifer_arma> hehe, a song that says "Lucifer inflicting the pain!" is a really great arma song for me :)
23:32 <Lucifer_arma> GodTodd: Climbin' the Walls finally came in :)
23:32 <GodTodd> cool :)
23:32 <GodTodd> i got all three of mine before leaving for NM
23:32 <GodTodd> :D
23:33 <Lucifer_arma> cool.  :)  So are you in NM right now, or back already?
23:34 <GodTodd> yeah i'm in the land of entrapment....i think we're going back on sat
23:34 <Lucifer_arma> heh.  Ok.  :)
23:34 <Lucifer_arma> Yeah, I was playing this game the other night listening to Hell's Gates, and would you know that I was wiping out the other team hearing the guy saying "Lucifer inflicting the pain!"
23:34 <Lucifer_arma> it ws awesome!  ;)
23:35 <GodTodd> cool :)
23:35  * Lucifer_arma thinks music dramatically improves his game
23:35 <GodTodd> i know it dramatically improves my studying ;)
23:35 <Lucifer_arma> haha.  haven't tried that yet, but it's gotta be better than kids yelling
23:36 <GodTodd> heh true that
23:37 <GodTodd> hrmm....you know....i will probably never be even remotely decent at it....but i really wanna learn to play guitar :/
23:39 <Lucifer_arma> do it, man
23:41 <GodTodd> i'll hafta check out some pawn shops or something....see if i can get a halfway decent guitar and amp....
23:41 <GodTodd> any particular ones to stay away from?
23:42 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, pawn shop guitars :)
23:42 <GodTodd> haha
23:43 <Lucifer_arma> check out guitar center instead, they usually have a good deal on a guitar + amp combo, usually that comes with a fender squier
23:43 <GodTodd> i don't particularly wanna break the bank on a first guitar tho
23:43 <Lucifer_arma> cheap guitar, but they usually let you switch it out if you want
23:43 <Lucifer_arma> there are several things worth considering.  One is that general guitar buying wisdom is worthless nd usually results in having a guitar you hate
23:43 <GodTodd> i think there's one of those just down the road from home....
23:44 <Lucifer_arma> if you have the extra money to throw down on what seems like a silly guitar, it's worth it to do it
23:44 <GodTodd> right...i basically figure a lot of it is hands on feel
23:44 <Lucifer_arma> you remember that red strat I used to have?
23:44 <GodTodd> yep
23:44 <Lucifer_arma> I traded that in a guitar shop in wisconsin for a purple flying V shaped thing
23:45 <Lucifer_arma> which I in turn traded with a friend here in Austin for the guitar I have now
23:45 <Lucifer_arma> it's the one pictured on my website
23:45 <Lucifer_arma> man, that red strat really felt good to play, on my fingers anyway.  But I hated that thing.
23:45 <Lucifer_arma> it was bought with common guitar buying wisdom
23:45 <GodTodd> heh
23:47 <Lucifer_arma> get something that works, that's electrically sound and all
23:47 <Lucifer_arma> that's the problem with pawn shop guitars, they usually have wiring problems or bad pickups
23:47 <Lucifer_arma> the best way to get something that works is to buy brand new with a warranty :)
23:47 <GodTodd> true
23:48 <Lucifer_arma> and don't get in the snobby guitar player trap that says a $150 is worthless.  Just don't do that.  You don't need a fucking Les Paul or Fender Strat American Standard
23:48 <GodTodd> oh...that i know
23:48 <Lucifer_arma> you only need that crap if you're touring anyway.  If you're just playing at home, a $150 guitar that you like is worth a lot more to you over the lifetime of the guitar than anything else
23:49 <GodTodd> yep
23:49 <Lucifer_arma> so yeah, typical me advice, throw out what everyone else says and do what you want :)
23:49 <Lucifer_arma> but I'd steer clear of any fixer-uppers unless there's some sort of other connection.  I've spent years and some money fixing up my guitar, and it's a wonderful guitar--now.
23:49 <GodTodd> i figured that's what you'd say ;)
23:50 <Lucifer_arma> my wife got me a bass + amp combo for my birthday, but she took out the fender bass and stuck in an Ibanez.  I don't know what it cost, it was a birthday present
23:51 <Lucifer_arma> but she said she got a good deal, and it's an awesome bass, and that's all there is to it :)
23:51 <GodTodd> exactly
23:51 <Lucifer_arma> you pay extra for the substitution, but you still get a discount for the combo
23:51 <Lucifer_arma> the amp is pretty shitty, really.  It sounds good, but it's not very loud.  But it does sound really good.  :)
23:51 <GodTodd> hmmm....they have a bc rich pack for 200$
23:52 <Lucifer_arma> go check it out.  :)  My guitar's an old-school bc rich, before Jackson resurrected the line.
23:52 <Lucifer_arma> I haven't really liked the new bc riches, my palm hits the pickups, but that's just me.  I'm already pretty set in my ways, you're not.  ;)
23:53 <GodTodd> wonder if i can talk my way into a 200$ father's day present ;)
23:53 <GodTodd> heh
23:53 <GodTodd> yep....i'm malleable
23:53 <GodTodd> heh
23:53 <Lucifer_arma> I played a washburn one time, looked just like one of Nuno Bettencourt's guitars back in the day, and it was a really sweet playing guitar
23:54 <Lucifer_arma> odd, because most of the washburn's I've played have sucked ass
23:54 <GodTodd> bronze series warlock guitar...that mean anything to you?
23:54 <GodTodd> haha
23:54 <Lucifer_arma> low-dollar warlock?
23:54 <Lucifer_arma> the warlocks are the ones that you need the coffin-shaped cases to hold :)
23:55 <GodTodd> heh....it comes with a gig bag
23:55 <GodTodd> 12 watt amp
23:55 <Lucifer_arma> warlock was bc rich's old flagship guitar, you see it in all the old hair band videos.  If they're not playing a strat, they're probably playing a warlock.
23:56 <Lucifer_arma> I did like the warlock basses a lot, but my wife said they were too expensive compared to this ibanez she got me
23:56 <GodTodd> i might go check it out when i'm back in plano
23:56 <GodTodd> this pack says its 1/2 off
23:56 <Lucifer_arma> yeah.  One thing's for sure, Alamogordo is a bad place to shop for a guitar :)
23:56 <GodTodd> so that means it's normally 400$
23:56 <Lucifer_arma> that might be worth buying just to stick it up on ebay in a few months
23:56 <GodTodd> true
23:57 <GodTodd> sell it for 300$ ;)
23:57 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, that's another thing.  These days the risk isn't so bad of getting a bad buy, it's easy to resell stuff and recoup most of your investment
23:57 <GodTodd> true...i kinda like the looks at least of this pack....hafta sweet talk the wife...heh
23:58 <GodTodd> of course she has been saying the old 'you need to do more for yourself'.....this would be for me ;)
23:59 <Lucifer_arma> I can only recommend guitar playing now.  Sure, it's an addiction and all that, but it's something tht only makes your life better
23:59 <Lucifer_arma> you know, after I finally managed to beat out all the unrealistic crap that was put there by snobby guitar players and other crazy people
23:59 <GodTodd> it just seems like it would be a decent stress release....even if and when i suck

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DISCLAIMER: These logs of public chat may contain some content which may not be appropriate for all audiences. Use at your own risk.
Logs from 2006-2009 pulled from wrtlprnft
Format changes at: 2015-08-25, 2017-02-20, and 2020-03-23. Times (2015 and later) should be Eastern.

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