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[2020-11-15 03:12:57] <Z-Man> Spot on. And the only reason we're hearing more alegations of fraud is because Trump has been priming his followers for months that it would happen. So now they're highly susceptible to confirmation bias and see every tiny thing that seems unusual to them as evidence for fraud. And since most of them never watched an election before this closely, very silly things seem unusual to them. Say, a journalist van with camera equipment arriving at
[2020-11-15 03:12:58] <Z-Man> a vote counting center. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-election-2020/detroit-election-fraud-video-fake-ballot-b1640129.html
[2020-11-15 19:14:45] <Lucifer_arma_> yep. We had a similar effect in the 2004 election due to ongoing bad feelings from 2000, where Ohio did a bunch of late voter roll purges and it looked like they might have been able to swing Ohio for Bush.
[2020-11-15 19:15:20] <Lucifer_arma_> Maybe it happened. There's solid evidence that it affected the result in Ohio. But Bush won fair and square in enough places that even without Ohio, he had the win.
[2020-11-15 19:16:24] <Lucifer_arma_> one of the things that makes democracy strong is the sheer numbers of people voting and the difficulty in stamping out the will of the people. You have to dig really deep into the election to cause a result that runs contrary to the will of the people.
[2020-11-15 19:16:56] <Lucifer_arma_> It's possible, and it's certainly been done in plenty of places (Maduro is a name popping into my head right now, also the Turkey thing).
[2020-11-15 19:17:41] <Lucifer_arma_> But one of the things that makes US elections fairly solid is precisely one of its biggest weaknesses, which is the hodge podge of election laws throughout the various states
[2020-11-15 19:18:25] <Lucifer_arma_> there's even been commentary talking about voter suppression efforts (which happen all the time, I was a victim of them six years ago and prevented from voting in the midterms)
[2020-11-15 19:18:55] <Lucifer_arma_> ironically, there's been enough work to expand voting that when you add in voter suppression efforts, you still end up with a net gain of new voting opportunities
[2020-11-15 19:19:43] <Lucifer_arma_> and I do wish we didn't have to talk about voter suppression like it's a thing that happens in the US, but in this election, the voter suppression efforts targeted likely democratic voters, and Biden still won
[2020-11-15 19:20:20] <Lucifer_arma_> I think the biggest argument against widespread voter fraud is that dems didn't take the senate and lost ground in the House. If there were widespread vote fraud, it was a severely half-assed effort at best.
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