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Log from 2019-06-15:
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[05:22:36] <Z-Man> It's also before taxes, right?
[05:25:03] <Z-Man> And you guys can, if you want to, pay your taxes for a whole year all at once after reporting earnings and expenses and stuff to the IRS?
[05:26:46] <Z-Man> Independent contractors can do that here, too. Normal folks get the maximum amount of taxes they may have to pay deduced right from the paycheck and can get a refund come tax time.
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[15:40:12] <Lucifer_arma> yes, it's before taxes.  We work with hourly rates before taxes because of historical variances in payroll deductions that change from one person to the next, so to be able to compare pay between jobs, we look at pre-tax rates
[15:40:47] <Lucifer_arma> hourly, in this case.  But my wife, who doesn't get paid by the hour, we look at her yearly gross to compare to other jobs (or her previous pay when she gets a raise)
[15:41:30] <Lucifer_arma> but there are complications in taxes.  :)  The social security tax is a flat 12.5% for everyone, but if you're a regular W-2 employee (not a contractor), your employer pays half of that
[15:42:08] <Lucifer_arma> independent contractors pay all of it.  It's the self-employment tax.  But you get a credit for it that you can apply to your income tax, so unless you earn more than $100k/year, you still wind up not paying it
[15:43:09] <Lucifer_arma> anyway, the tax computations every month are slightly more complicated than simply "pay the max and get a refund".  Your employer actually has to (quarterly) estimate how much you earn for the entire year and make the tax deductions based on that
[15:43:30] <Lucifer_arma> so in some jobs, you can get a raise partway into the year but see no net increase in pay because of the increase in payroll tax deductions
[15:44:18] <Lucifer_arma> for independent contractors, if we make less than $10k/month, we're "required" to file quarterly taxes with the appropriate payment.  More than $10k/month and we're required to file monthly
[15:44:48] <Lucifer_arma> but if we don't do that, then in tax season, yeah, we can either pay it all with one big payment, or hope we get enough credits (from like the earned income credit) to offset our taxes
[15:45:21] <Lucifer_arma> when I was working for SugarCRM, that's what I did.  I had three kids and a full-time mom (my first wife) as dependents, so my EIC was huge and I didn't bother filing quarterly taxes
[15:46:11] <Lucifer_arma> anyway, right now I'm doing the extra work in a spreadsheet to see what my hourly rate looks like so that whenever my wife says "get a job", I can point to my spreadsheet and say "Only if I can do better than that"
[15:46:20] <Lucifer_arma> self-employment = awesome
[15:46:52] <Lucifer_arma> she doesn't do that, though.  She did, at first, a bit, but now she knows better.  Instead, she says "You need to work more", and she's not wrong :)
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