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Log from 2007-03-09:
--- Day changed Fri Mar 09 2007
00:02 <kamp> hi joe
00:02 <ghableska> hi
00:05 -!- Nixda124 [n=54382578@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has joined #armagetron
00:05 -!- Nixda124 [n=54382578@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has quit [Client Quit]
00:05 <DrJoeTron> i made a sweet mspaint picture durring graphic design while my project was printing
00:06 -!- [dlh] [n=[dlh]@c-76-19-206-67.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit []
00:06 <DrJoeTron> cool enough to save to a thumb drive
00:06 <ghableska> :o)
00:09 -!- MaZuffeR [n=MaZuffeR@darkmoor.sby.abo.fi] has quit ["Leaving."]
00:15 <kamp> joe
00:15 <kamp> give me the pass for shrunk
00:15 <kamp> i refuse to play with a guy named (wtf) dicksuck
00:17 <madmax|pt> lol
00:17 <kamp> never mind
00:17 <kamp> invader took care of it
00:32 -!- |Sticky| [n=kvirc@80-41-82-143.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #armagetron
00:47 <kamp> joe
00:47 <kamp> your server kicks too much for spam
00:48 -!- _Sticky_ [n=kvirc@80-43-72-84.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
00:48 -!- Lackadaisical [n=lack@ip202-29-210-87.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit ["Yes. he really did."]
00:49 -!- wejp_ [n=j@i577BACC4.versanet.de] has joined #armagetron
00:55 -!- madmax|pt [n=madmax@unaffiliated/madmaxpt/x-23911] has quit ["leaving"]
00:56 -!- madmax|pt [n=madmax@unaffiliated/madmaxpt/x-23911] has joined #armagetron
00:56 <madmax|pt> #realchatlogs
00:56 <armabot> madmax|pt: http://master3.armagetronad.net/armalogs/
01:01 <Vanhayes> #weather saint john
01:01 <armabot> Vanhayes: Temperature: 1°F / -17°C | Humidity: 36% | Pressure: 30.02in / 1016hPa | Conditions: Partly Cloudy | Wind Direction: NNW | Wind Speed: 16mph / 26km/h | Updated: 7:00 PM AST; Tonight - Cloudy with 40 percent chance of flurries early this evening. Clearing this evening. Wind northwest 30 km/h. Low minus 20. Cold wind chill minus 31.; Friday - Sunny. Wind northwest 20 km/h. High minus 6. (1 more message)
01:01 <Vanhayes> #more
01:01 <armabot> Vanhayes: UV index 3 or moderate. Cold wind chill minus 29 in the morning. Friday night..clear. Increasing cloudiness overnight. Wind northwest 20 km/h becoming light in the evening. Low minus 13.; Saturday - Cloudy with 60 percent chance of flurries or rain showers. High plus 4.;
01:02 <kamp> #weather 32608
01:02 <armabot> kamp: The current temperature in Stillwind Subdivision, Gainesville, Florida is 69.1°F (7:02 PM EST on March 08, 2007). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 38%. Dew Point: 42.8°F. Pressure: 30.10 in 1019.2 hPa (Rising). 
01:02 <kamp> #weather 33146
01:02 <armabot> kamp: The current temperature in Miami, Florida is 73.4°F (6:53 PM EST on March 08, 2007). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 57%. Dew Point: 57.2°F. Pressure: 30.05 in 1018 hPa (Rising). 
01:03 -!- zmanuel [n=manuel@p50872E6B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
01:03 <DrJoeTron> "D
01:03 -!- j0h4nn3s [n=j@i577B97A0.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
01:03 <Vanhayes> ugh what a week to redo our basement walls, not a day it was over -10
01:11 <spidey> #svn
01:11 <armabot> svn co https://armagetronad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/armagetronad/armagetronad/trunk/armagetronad <dirname>(more information: http://wiki.armagetronad.net/index.php/Working_with_SVN)
01:25 <|Sticky|> #serverinfo cafe
01:25 <armabot> |Sticky|: Fortress Café: Players (6/32): emo>__<con, G5, madmax, nc~Julian, °¯AshitakA, °°Gay-Lin
01:27 -!- [dlh] [n=[dlh]@c-76-19-206-67.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #armagetron
01:47 <kamp> #serverinfo tub
01:47 <armabot> kamp: The Lobster Tub(TEST): No online players.
01:47 <kamp> :)
01:47 <kamp> muahahaha
01:47 <kamp> #serverinfo capture
01:47 <armabot> kamp: Capture the Flag (This could be your server!): No online players.
01:47 <kamp> nah
01:47 <kamp> #serverinfo wild
01:47 <armabot> kamp: Crazy Tronners Wild Fortress: Players (9/14): Arm. Adv. Admin, MAROON BULLET, Player 1, Potato Chef, SNAFU, zen, [mho]ese, {<$%Aard%$>}, }O{
01:47 <kamp> hmm
01:48 <luke-jr|work> HMM
02:19 <ghableska> #weather 50266
02:19 <armabot> ghableska: The current temperature in West Des Moines, Iowa is 45.7°F (7:17 PM CST on March 08, 2007). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 62%. Dew Point: 33.8°F. Windchill: 44.6°F. Pressure: 28.98 in 981.3 hPa. 
02:24 <spidey> ping: unknown host google.com
02:24 <spidey> o.O
02:24 <ghableska> o.0
02:24 -!- luke-jr|work [n=luke-jr@adsl-76-194-177-181.dsl.ksc2mo.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
02:41 <kamp> quiet night
02:41 <ghableska> yup
02:41 <kamp> i guess it'll get more interesting when lucifer comes, and we wind up talking about the fortress league
02:41 <kamp> did you know gmail can grab pop mail from other servers?
02:41 <ghableska> I'm not surprised.
02:42 <kamp> me neither, but they didn't used to
02:42 <kamp> i figured it out the other day, and now i don't need to use my school's crappy webmail interface
02:42 <ghableska> :D
02:42 <kamp> you'd think a school as rich as florida would be able to get better webmail software
02:43 <ghableska> lol
02:44 <|Sticky|> whats happening to the fortress league...i should be getting access to a very good server soon so may be able to provide a server
02:44 <ghableska> hmm, where is it located?
02:45 <|Sticky|> uk unfortunately for you yanks
02:45 <ghableska> bah
02:45  * ghableska is used to playing with 150+ ms pings
02:45 <|Sticky|> but on a very good connection and spec pc so should most of all be stable
02:46 <ghableska> that's good :)
02:48 <kamp> good news sticky
02:48 <kamp> you're going to have it for a while?
02:50  * spidey broke something
02:50 <spidey> server can't resolve domains :(
02:50 <spidey> ping: unknown host google.com :(
02:51 <|Sticky|> kamp: probably as long as i remain a member of the society that own it
02:51 <|Sticky|> so years if i bother to remain a member
02:55 <kamp> sticky...
02:55 <kamp> that guy on the corner
02:55 <kamp> the one selling drugs
02:55 <kamp> don't listen to him, he lies
02:55 <kamp> think of the fortress league
02:55 <kamp> :)
02:55  * ghableska 's school is well known for drug use :p
02:56 <kamp> every school is well known for drug use
02:56 <ghableska> more than normal, that is
02:56 <|Sticky|> err not sure i follow your drugs joke there
02:56 <ghableska> mine?
02:56 <ghableska> or kamp's?
02:57 <kamp> so you remain a member of society
02:57 <kamp> ah whatever
02:57 <|Sticky|> "the society"
02:58 <kamp> no forget about it
02:58 <kamp> it fell dead flat
02:58 <|Sticky|> heh
02:58 <kamp> here, at least, when you're in prison, you're out of society
02:58 <kamp> that's the point of prison
03:01 <ghableska> http://deadspin.com/sports/clips/soon-americans-will-lack-the-need-to-move-240329.php
03:04 <|Sticky|> almost useful if you didnt have to go get a towel to mop up beer after you open it
03:04 <ghableska> hmm
03:05 <ghableska> it could compress towels and then throw them after the beer...
03:05 <|Sticky|> naa use one of the drinks serving robots
03:05 <|Sticky|> far better
03:07 <|Sticky|> http://robotgossip.blogspot.com/2006/01/robot-bartender-for-home.html
03:07 <ghableska> hmm
03:08 <ghableska> I won't be able to drink for a while, so it really doesn't matter, heh
03:08 <|Sticky|> fill it with coke
03:09 <kamp> disaster waiting to happen
03:09 <kamp> reminds me of that commercial with the rubber floors
03:10 <|Sticky|> heh people wonder why kids take drugs...you go to a school known for drug dealing but cant get access to alcohol, so illegal drugs become easier to access than leagle ones
03:10 <ghableska> haha
03:10 <kamp> yep
03:10 <kamp> it's a crying shame
03:10 <kamp> the alcohol buying age should be lower than the driving age, at least
03:11 <ghableska> yeah
03:11 <|Sticky|> whats the voting age in usa??
03:11 <kamp> but they can't do it anymore
03:11 <kamp> 18
03:11 <ghableska> 18
03:11 <ghableska> you can do a lot more damage with a car than with a can of beer
03:11 <kamp> not if you throw it at their head
03:11 <|Sticky|> car or beer?
03:11 <kamp> ...
03:11 <ghableska> haha
03:12 <kamp> unless it's a mini, i'm thinking you can't do that with a car
03:12 <ghableska> yeah, but can you aim when you're drunk?
03:12 <kamp> what're you talking about
03:12 <|Sticky|> yeah uk has similar problem you have to pay taxes and can go off and die but not allowed to vote or drink
03:12 <kamp> you were probably intending on catching it
03:12 <|Sticky|> die as in fight in the army
03:12 <kamp> yea
03:12 <kamp> well
03:12 <kamp> drive, 16
03:13 <kamp> vote, adulthood, 18
03:13 <kamp> drink, 21
03:13 <kamp> pretyt bad system
03:13 <ghableska> you can get a learner's permit at 14 here :p
03:13 <kamp> oh yea
03:13 <kamp> well that
03:13 <kamp> but i meant a real license
03:13 <|Sticky|> uk: drive 16. vote/drink 18
03:13 <kamp> that reminds me
03:13 <kamp> i'm going to have some vodka
03:14 <kamp> i've had this bottle of bad vodka in my freezer for-reaking ever
03:14 -!- Your_mom_arma [n=Your_mom@pool-151-204-204-25.pskn.east.verizon.net] has joined #armagetron
03:14 <ghableska> hi mom
03:14 <kamp> hey MOM
03:14 <kamp> mom
03:14 <kamp> whatever
03:14 <Your_mom_arma> hey
03:14 <|Sticky|> well technicaly drinking in uk is 5 years old but thats a strange part of the law
03:14 <kamp> haha
03:15 <kamp> it's like that in a european countries
03:15 <kamp> a lot of
03:15 <kamp> which is a phrase i left out
03:15 <|Sticky|> yeah
03:15 <kamp> or it's sort of like, understood
03:15 <kamp> that you can have posession of alcohol pretty much at any stage in your life
03:16 <|Sticky|> youy cant have possesion under age in public in uk i dont think
03:16 <|Sticky|> i think that 5 years old thing is for private residences only
03:16 <kamp> hmm
03:17 <kamp> in france at least, you can have wine whenever :)
03:17 <|Sticky|> kidding the french tried to put a recommended daily dosage for wine
03:18 <|Sticky|> you should drink atleast 2 glasses a day for good health...bollox
03:19 <kamp> one glass a day of red
03:19 <kamp> it works
03:19 <kamp> helps the circulation
03:19 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, whenever you get back ping me
03:19 <kamp> more than that, and you should probably follow it up with a couple more
03:19 <kamp> and then a couple more
03:19 <kamp> when the bottle's done, it's time to stop
03:20  * ghableska slaps spidey
03:20 <spidey> fuck off
03:20 <spidey> :)
03:20 <|Sticky|> yeah people always say 1 glass of red..im not so sure, surely there are better ways to get the benefical parts without the alcohol
03:21 <spidey> |Sticky|, stab yourself then run 2 miles
03:21 <|Sticky|> instruction or sugestion??
03:21 <spidey> both :D
03:21 <spidey> 'er
03:21 <spidey> yeah people always say 1 glass of red..im not so sure, surely there are better ways to get the benefical parts without the alcohol
03:21 <spidey> answer @ that
03:22 <|Sticky|> ahh
03:22 <|Sticky|> anyway g2g
03:22 <|Sticky|> #night
03:22 <armabot> Good night |Sticky|!
03:23 -!- |Sticky| [n=kvirc@80-41-82-143.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit ["KVIrc 3.2.4 Anomalies http://www.kvirc.net/"]
03:49 <ghableska> #weather 50266
03:49 <armabot> ghableska: The current temperature in West Des Moines, Iowa is 44.1°F (8:46 PM CST on March 08, 2007). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 62%. Dew Point: 32.0°F. Windchill: 39.2°F. Pressure: 28.97 in 980.9 hPa. 
04:23 <kamp> lalala
04:23 <kamp> #sing
04:24 <kamp> #whoami
04:24 <armabot> kamp: kamp
04:24 <ghableska> #whoami
04:24 <armabot> ghableska: ghableska
04:25 <Your_mom_arma> #armabot What are you doing?
04:25 <armabot> Your_mom_arma: You're kidding, right?
04:25 <spidey> O.o
04:26 <ghableska> #armabot Stupid.
04:26 <armabot> ghableska: You're kidding, right?
04:26 <ghableska> #armabot Am I kidding?
04:26 <armabot> ghableska: NO.
04:26 <ghableska> heh
04:26 <DrJoeTron> armabot knows the biz
04:26 <ghableska> DrJoeTron: I have ts :D
04:27 <spidey> ts is for losers cause luke-jr_ says so
04:27 <ghableska> #kill Lucifer_arma
04:27 <ghableska> err
04:27 <armabot> Lucifer_arma will die on Sat Jul 10 03:04:28 2010 due to being stabbed in the eye by Vanhayes.
04:27 <ghableska> #kill luke-jr_
04:27 <armabot> luke-jr_ will die on Wed Jun 13 08:36:05 2012 due to being stabbed in the eye by armabot.
04:27 <spidey> O.o
04:27 <spidey> hah
04:27 <DrJoeTron> ghableska do you have a mic?
04:27 <spidey> no
04:27 <ghableska> headset, yeah
04:27 <spidey> he just downloaded teamspeak so he could listen to you
04:27 <spidey> :O
04:27 <ghableska> ew, never
04:27 <kamp> i need a mic
04:28 <DrJoeTron> wanna register for ts?
04:28 <ghableska> register?
04:28 <kamp> and not just yell into my keyboard
04:28 <DrJoeTron> for my ts server :D
04:28 <ghableska> how?
04:28 <kamp> you ask him
04:28 <DrJoeTron> join it?
04:28 <kamp> rather gruffly
04:28 <kamp> Yo joe, register me , kiddo
04:29 <kamp> like that
04:29 <kamp> or even
04:29 <Lucifer_arma> #kill ghableska
04:29 <armabot> ghableska will die on Sun Sep 22 14:53:14 1985 due to being stabbed in the eye by Vanhayes.
04:29 <kamp> Joe, Do it
04:29 <DrJoeTron> pass is option
04:29 <DrJoeTron> join it so i can register you
04:29 <kamp> hey joe check this out
04:29 <ghableska> Lucifer_arma: sorry, I was going for luke-jr_
04:29 <kamp> #serverinfo tub
04:29 <armabot> kamp: The Lobster Tub(TEST): No online players.
04:29 <Lucifer_arma> #kill ghableska
04:29 <armabot> ghableska will die on Mon May 30 13:14:45 1988 due to being stabbed in the eye by wejp_.
04:29 <kamp> STILL empty!
04:29 <DrJoeTron> thats old news
04:29 <kamp> you're right
04:29 <kamp> it is old news
04:30 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: wtf do you want?
04:30 <kamp> :)
04:30 <spidey> :(
04:30 <DrJoeTron> like you!
04:30 <kamp> is nemo here
04:30 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, i can't get the trunk to compile :/
04:30 <kamp> yea
04:30 <spidey> i installed the dependencies you said
04:30 <kamp> [dlh]: so about that parsing, any thoughts?
04:30 <spidey> plus libboost
04:30 <spidey> cause the ./configure said to
04:30 <Lucifer_arma> er, are you trying to build the trunk or 0.2.8?
04:30 <spidey> trunk
04:30 <spidey> #svn
04:30 <armabot> svn co https://armagetronad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/armagetronad/armagetronad/trunk/armagetronad <dirname>(more information: http://wiki.armagetronad.net/index.php/Working_with_SVN)
04:30 <spidey> that
04:31 <Lucifer_arma> you want to be a tester?  :)
04:31 <ghableska> [21:31:20] Connecting to 
04:31 <ghableska> [21:31:23] No reply from server
04:31 <ghableska> Maybe the server is offline
04:31 <ghableska> or maybe teamspeak is not running on it
04:31 <ghableska> o_O
04:31 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, ugh, sure
04:31 <Lucifer_arma> I'd suggest you get 0.2.8 building anyway, it's easier than building the trunk and you can make sure the base system works fine thataway anyway
04:31 <DrJoeTron> uh
04:31 <DrJoeTron> lemme try
04:31 <Lucifer_arma> then after, if you want to build the trunk, fine :)
04:31 <spidey> just as soon as i figure out how compiling  libboost fucked up the network
04:31 <Lucifer_arma> #svn
04:31 <armabot> svn co https://armagetronad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/armagetronad/armagetronad/trunk/armagetronad <dirname>(more information: http://wiki.armagetronad.net/index.php/Working_with_SVN)
04:31 <spidey> ping: unknown host google.com
04:31 <Lucifer_arma> er, it shouldn't have?
04:31 <DrJoeTron> try again
04:31 <ghableska> ok
04:31 <Lucifer_arma> that's dns problem
04:31 <DrJoeTron> i just got in
04:31 <spidey> yea
04:32 <ghableska> [21:31:20] Connecting to 
04:32 <ghableska> [21:31:23] No reply from server
04:32 <ghableska> Maybe the server is offline
04:32 <ghableska> or maybe teamspeak is not running on it
04:32 <ghableska> err
04:32 <DrJoeTron> fucking christ
04:32 <ghableska> it's being stupid
04:32 <Lucifer_arma> https://armagetronad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/armagetronad/armagetronad/branches/0.2.8/armagetronad
04:32 <Lucifer_arma> that's the url you want for 0.2.8
04:32 <DrJoeTron> fuck teamspeak
04:32 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, need 0.3.0
04:32 <spidey> :D
04:32 <Lucifer_arma> and you want that one, not the tag
04:32 <Lucifer_arma> I'd suggest you get 0.2.8 building anyway, it's easier than building the trunk and you can make sure the base system works fine thataway anyway
04:32 <ghableska> what's the difference between nickname and login name?
04:32 <Your_mom_arma> im in the ts server
04:33 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, does 0.2.8 have the built in rotation stuff?
04:33 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: what distribution is it?
04:33 <DrJoeTron> yeah
04:33 <DrJoeTron> you're doing it wrong then ghableska
04:33 <spidey> debian sarge
04:33 <ghableska> ?
04:33 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: no, but the trunk is missing stuff for zones
04:33 <Lucifer_arma> it doesn't even do zone stuff that 0.2.8 does
04:33 <ghableska> what goes in nickname then?
04:33 <DrJoeTron> ghab dont put a login name in
04:33 <spidey> this is a classic play type thing
04:33 <DrJoeTron> you dont have one
04:33 <ghableska> ohh
04:33 <spidey> don't need zones :P
04:33 <DrJoeTron> we're making one
04:34 <Lucifer_arma> anyway, it doesn't matter, build 0.2.8 first because it has many fewer dependencies and you can get it building quickly
04:34 <ghableska> aha
04:34 <kamp> ahh
04:34 <kamp> two convos at once!
04:34 <ghableska> how do I type? :p
04:34 <Lucifer_arma> building the trunk is a pita, and it's better to already know that 0.2.8 builds and runs when you tackle the trunk
04:34 <kamp> you don't, ghableska, you talk
04:34 <ghableska> I don't feel like connecting my headset :S
04:34 <Your_mom_arma> joe grant talk privlages
04:34 <kamp> if your computer's anything like mine
04:34 <kamp> just yell at your keyboard
04:34 <kamp> and they'll hear you
04:34 <ghableska> heh
04:35 <Lucifer_arma> did you hear that?  I said "kamp is a garblegarblegrumbleblahblah!"
04:35 <kamp> why do you think i don't go on ts anymore
04:35 <spidey> one thing i hate about linux is
04:35 <kamp> besides the fact that joe will randomly let optic in
04:35 <spidey> i can never figure out the permissions :/
04:35 <kamp> i hear ya spidey
04:35 <Lucifer_arma> how hard can it be?  :)
04:35 <kamp> fuck permissions
04:35 <spidey> when i try to wget as armagetronad it tells me permission denied
04:35 <Lucifer_arma> u+w sets user writeable
04:35 <DrJoeTron> optic has been dead
04:35 <kamp> rxwrxwrxw for everything
04:35 <DrJoeTron> and will stay dead
04:36 <Lucifer_arma> what are you wgetting?
04:36  * kamp hears the police coming
04:36 <ghableska> run!
04:36 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, nothing right now
04:36 <spidey> i can't svn as armagetronad either
04:36 <Lucifer_arma> permission denied could be the remote server...
04:36 <Lucifer_arma> ahhhh, I see the problem then
04:36 <kamp> svn
04:36 <Lucifer_arma> do your building as a different user :)
04:36 <kamp> never used it
04:36 <kamp> crying shame
04:36 <Lucifer_arma> armagetronad should be a second-class user with very few rights on the system
04:36 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, can't execute as armagetronad either
04:37 <kamp> i need to get into programming for armagetron
04:37 <kamp> maybe in a month or two
04:37 <Lucifer_arma> maybe it's a borked user?
04:37 <kamp> and then i'll never play, like Lucifer_arma
04:37 <Lucifer_arma> try deleting the user and recreating it?
04:37 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, is there a rotation script for 0.2.8, i really need that...it's why we're using 0.3.0 right now
04:37 <spidey> did that
04:37 <spidey> twice O.o
04:37 <Lucifer_arma> there's several...
04:38 <DrJoeTron> ghableska you...you
04:38 <kamp> btw, joe, you should be pleased
04:38 <kamp> me and slo are probably going to bring the cage/tub into reputability and popularity
04:38 <ghableska> I what? :)
04:38 <DrJoeTron> you used the toilet all by yourself
04:38 <DrJoeTron> oh
04:38 <DrJoeTron> hows that
04:38 <kamp> we're having a competition
04:38 <Lucifer_arma> the trunk  is not 0.3.0
04:39 <Lucifer_arma> if you want 0.3.0, you need a different url
04:39 <spidey> svn: PROPFIND request failed on '/svnroot/armagetronad/armagetronad/branches/0.2.8/armagetronad'
04:39 <kamp> whoever adds 1000 more round wins to their name first wins
04:39 <spidey> svn: PROPFIND of '/svnroot/armagetronad/armagetronad/branches/0.2.8/armagetronad': Could not resolve hostname `armagetronad.svn.sourceforge.net': Temporary failure in name resolution (https://armagetronad.svn.sourceforge.net)
04:39 <spidey> !
04:39 <kamp> which means we'll be in there a lot
04:39 <DrJoeTron> ghableska hook that headset up
04:39 <Lucifer_arma> I still suggest 0.2.8 first because being the stable version, it's the easiest to build from scratch.
04:39 <DrJoeTron> haha
04:39 <ghableska> no
04:39 <DrJoeTron> no!
04:39 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: you have a DNS problem.  Didn't I already say that?
04:39 <kamp> which means that it won't be dead last on the list at all times
04:39 <ghableska> NO!
04:39 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, not i! :O
04:39 <spidey> i only wish i had this server
04:39 <Lucifer_arma> https://armagetronad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/armagetronad/armagetronad/tags/0.3.0
04:39 <DrJoeTron> i'd rather have no one, than a room filled with shit heads
04:39 <spidey> heh
04:39 <Lucifer_arma> https://armagetronad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/armagetronad/armagetronad/tags/0.3.0/armagetronad
04:40 <Lucifer_arma> the second one
04:40 <Lucifer_arma> fine, your server has a dns problem
04:40 <Lucifer_arma> that was obvious from your ping output you gave, coupled with the fact that you were connected over the network to it
04:40 <Lucifer_arma> cat /etc/resolv.conf
04:40 <spidey> root@zion:/home/armagetronad/tron# cat /etc/resolv.conf
04:40 <spidey> # Dynamic resolv.conf(5) file for glibc resolver(3) generated by resolvconf(8)
04:40 <armabot> Another day...
04:41 <spidey> that's all
04:41 <spidey> ...
04:41 -!- ghableska [n=ghablesk@12-216-182-238.client.mchsi.com] has left #Armagetron []
04:41 <Lucifer_arma> that's all?  no wonder your dns isn't working
04:41 <Lucifer_arma> your machine doesn't know about dns servers!
04:41 <Lucifer_arma> run resolvconf
04:41 <Lucifer_arma> as root, obviously
04:41 <DrJoeTron> bbl
04:41 <spidey> root@zion:/home/armagetronad/tron# resolvconf
04:41 <spidey> resolvconf: Error: No command argument supplied
04:41 <Lucifer_arma> you might do "man resolvconf" first and find out wtf it does :)
04:41 <spidey> k
04:42 <Lucifer_arma> how about "resolver", is that there somewhere?
04:42  * Lucifer_arma only knows how to hack resolv.conf by hand, has never used a tool to do it
04:42 <Lucifer_arma> what distribution is it?
04:42 <spidey> debian sarge..
04:43 <Lucifer_arma> http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/254
04:43 <Lucifer_arma> for some reason, that page tells you to hack resolv.conf
04:44 <spidey> thanks
04:45 <spidey> atleast now i know how to use the other 5 ip's
04:45 <spidey> -_-
04:45 <Lucifer_arma> haha
04:45 <kamp> :)
04:45 <kamp> all's well that ends well
04:45  * Lucifer_arma wonders if he enabled hostnamelookups for apache
04:45 <[dlh]> kamp: I've no clue on how to parse xml in javascript. There appears to be a javascript xml parser (http://xmljs.sourceforge.net), but I would rather use JSON (http://json.org, http://www.json.org/json.js)
04:46 <Lucifer_arma> er, wait a minute, that's not what he wants to do :)
04:46 <Lucifer_arma> he wants to convince wrtlprnft to make it a xml-rpc feed so he can just use any ajax widget to display it :)
04:47 <kamp> nah
04:47 <kamp> i want to go through the whole thing
04:47  * kamp is learning, remember?
04:47 <Lucifer_arma> anyway, you might instead look into getting your browser to load it like in a hidden frame or something and then walking the dom like you would any other way
04:47 <kamp> thanks nemo, you could have just said you didn't know though, you didn't have to do my research for me
04:47 <kamp> but thanks
04:47 <Lucifer_arma> I mean, why parse in javascript when you're running inside an application that probably has a far better parser than you'll find?
04:48  * Lucifer_arma wonders how the ajax widgets do it, seriously
04:48 <Lucifer_arma> aha!
04:48 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: http://packages.debian.org/unstable/net/resolvconf
04:48 <Lucifer_arma> looks like you need to install resolvconf
04:48 <Lucifer_arma> or, if it's not there, fuck it!
04:49 <[dlh]> Wait, how would making it a web service (XML-RPC) help at all?
04:49 <kamp> i dunno
04:49 <Lucifer_arma> just find out from your server host what dns servers they have and plug those in
04:49 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, 
04:49 <spidey> it's already installed
04:49 <kamp> i don't even know what that is
04:49 <Lucifer_arma> [dlh]: a lot of ajax widgets can use xml-rpc by themselves, so kamp wouldn't have to do any real work
04:49 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: then why didn't it find the command?  *confused*
04:50 <spidey> root@zion:/home/armagetronad/tron# resolvconf
04:50 <spidey> resolvconf: Error: No command argument supplied
04:50 <spidey> you miss read
04:50 <spidey> heh
04:50 <Lucifer_arma> oh, haha
04:51 <Lucifer_arma> [dlh]: besides that minor detail about ajax widgets, since kamp's trying to make an opera widget, it's possible/likely that opera has an api for making xml-rpc calls
04:51 <Lucifer_arma> so no need to parse the stream then, he can just focus on what he actually cares about
04:52 <Lucifer_arma> [dlh]: if opera does (it would surprise me if it doesn't!), then that might be enough to convince wrtlprnft to make an xml-rpc version of the feed
04:52  * Lucifer_arma considers doing an svn checkout of the script and just doing it
04:52  * Lucifer_arma wonders how much kamp would be willing to pay for it ;)
04:53 <kamp> meh
04:53 <kamp> i'm just spending time looking at the source of other widgets
04:54 <kamp> seeing how they do things
04:54 <kamp> easier than paying lucifer for something i'm determined to do myself
04:54 <kamp> makes zero sense, luci
04:54 -!- kamp [n=cpayan@ip72-209-64-18.ga.at.cox.net] has left #armagetron []
04:54 -!- kamp [n=cpayan@ip72-209-64-18.ga.at.cox.net] has joined #armagetron
04:55 <kamp> ah darn
04:55 <kamp> ctrl f4
04:55 <kamp> a powerful button
04:55 <kamp> err
04:55 <kamp> pair of buttons
04:58 <[dlh]> blah, I hate javascript.
04:58 <spidey> i'm kinda confused
04:58 <kamp> same here
04:58 <spidey> what happened to the resolv.conf >.<
04:58 <kamp> don't worry about it nemo
04:58 <kamp> i'm just trying to igure some things out
04:58 <kamp> i'm not really going to start this for a week or two
04:58 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, would installing/updating libraries cause it?
04:59 <kamp> thanks for all the help
04:59  * [dlh] *
04:59 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: if a library overwrote resolv.conf, yes
05:00 <Lucifer_arma> if a package invoked a call to resolvconf that caused it to generate a blank resolv.conf file, then yes
05:00 <spidey> 64 bytes from jc-in-f99.google.com ( icmp_seq=1 ttl=248 time=33.1 ms
05:00 <spidey> yay
05:00 <spidey> :D
05:00 <Lucifer_arma> :)
05:00 <spidey> put the ones i set for my cable router in
05:00 <Lucifer_arma> now, get the 0.3.0 tag
05:00 <spidey> they're opendns nameservers
05:00 <spidey> :D
05:00 <Lucifer_arma> https://armagetronad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/armagetronad/armagetronad/tags/0.3.0/armagetronad
05:00 <Lucifer_arma> that one, svn co the url I just gave and build that
05:01 <spidey> rgr
05:01 <spidey> checking out now
05:01 <Lucifer_arma> it has mostly the same dependencies as 0.2.8, but has the map rotation you wanted
05:01 <spidey> ty :)
05:01 <spidey> no more -x 'ing a autopackage, lol
05:01 <Lucifer_arma> haha
05:02 <spidey> ok, lets see
05:02 <spidey> i've never actually installed this on linux -_-
05:03 <Lucifer_arma> don't install it this time until you see it working :)
05:03 <spidey> O.o
05:03 <Lucifer_arma> to build from svn, you do "./bootstrap.sh"
05:03 <Lucifer_arma> then "./configure --disable-glout"
05:03 <Lucifer_arma> then "make"
05:03 <Lucifer_arma> then TEST it
05:03 <spidey> see
05:03 <spidey> here's what happens everytime
05:03 <spidey> automake: src/thirdparty/particles/Makefile.am: not supported: source file `ParticleDLL/actions.h' is in subdirectory
05:03 <spidey> automake: src/thirdparty/particles/Makefile.am: not supported: source file `ParticleDLL/Particle.h' is in subdirectory
05:03 <spidey> automake: src/thirdparty/particles/Makefile.am: not supported: source file `ParticleDLL/ParticleGroup.h' is in subdirectory
05:03 <spidey> automake: src/thirdparty/particles/Makefile.am: not supported: source file `ParticleDLL/ParticleState.h' is in subdirectory
05:03 <spidey> config/Makefile.am:6: invalid variable `nobase_config_DATA'
05:03 <spidey> desktop/Makefile.am:9: invalid variable `nobase_protocolfile_DATA'
05:03 <spidey> desktop/Makefile.am:8: invalid variable `nobase_desktopfile_DATA'
05:03 <spidey> www-root/Makefile.am:8: invalid variable `nobase_wwwroot_DATA'
05:03 <spidey> yada, yada
05:03 <Lucifer_arma> do something like "echo "SERVER_NAME StupidShit" >> config/server_info.cfg"
05:04 <Lucifer_arma> ahhh
05:04 <Lucifer_arma> automake --version
05:04 <Lucifer_arma> [root@ghostwheel dave]# automake --version
05:04 <Lucifer_arma> automake (GNU automake) 1.9.6
05:04 <spidey> automake (GNU automake) 1.4-p6
05:04 <[dlh]> heh, way too old
05:04 <Lucifer_arma> upgrade, that's before the critical 1.8
05:04 <spidey> hm
05:05  * spidey aptituded'd it
05:05 <spidey> :/
05:05  * Lucifer_arma *cough* Debian *cough*
05:05 <spidey> no
05:05 <spidey> i installed the wrong one
05:05 <spidey> heh
05:05  * Lucifer_arma makes a loud coughing noise that sounds a lot like "Debian"
05:05  * spidey installed the first one on the list
05:05 <spidey> there's a 1.9, heh
05:06 <Lucifer_arma> ok
05:06  * Lucifer_arma considers if it's worth adding a check for automake version somewhere
05:06 <Lucifer_arma> you can require it in configure.ac, iirc
05:06 <Lucifer_arma> aha!
05:06 <Lucifer_arma> where's kamp?
05:07 <Lucifer_arma> http://my.opera.com/community/dev/widgets/
05:07 <kamp> around
05:07 <kamp> yea dude
05:07 <kamp> i know
05:07 <DrJoeTron>   damn
05:07 <Lucifer_arma> From that page:  # Widgets can use AJAX technologies to create powerful cross-domain web applications.
05:07 <kamp> <-- a googling fool
05:07 <DrJoeTron> arma wont run on a rage mobile very well
05:07 <kamp> i'm working on something else right now
05:07 <kamp> rage mobile?
05:07 <DrJoeTron> yeah
05:07 <spidey> dpkg: serious warning: files list file for package `armagetronad-dedicated' missing, assuming package has no files currently installed.
05:07 <kamp> what's that?
05:07 <DrJoeTron> ATi Rage
05:07 <DrJoeTron> its a video card
05:07 <kamp> ...
05:07 <kamp> oh
05:07 <spidey> wtf do i keep getting that for when i install/uninstall with aptitude
05:07 <spidey> ?
05:07 <Lucifer_arma> wtf are you doing now, spidey?
05:07 <DrJoeTron> but its a laptop card
05:08 <kamp> Things arma should be ported to
05:08 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, updating automake
05:08 <kamp> 1. Wii
05:08 <DrJoeTron> i'll be luckly enough to get the thing to run TFC
05:08 <spidey> but aptitude keep bitching at me
05:08 <kamp> 2. PS3 (armagetron in HD!)
05:08 <Lucifer_arma> that's pretty weird
05:08 <spidey> about armagetronad 
05:08 <kamp> 3. some mobile phone
05:08  * Lucifer_arma adds Debian to the lists of distributions not to fool with unless he has real time to kill
05:08 <kamp> and then the rest, who cares
05:08 <kamp> heh
05:08 <Lucifer_arma> kamp: I won't be satisfied until arma runs in my toaster
05:09 <DrJoeTron> spidey
05:09 <spidey> what?
05:09  * Lucifer_arma suddenly remembers he doesn't have a toaster
05:09  * kamp wonders if the toast woul still turn out all right
05:09 <DrJoeTron> i got this neat feature for TS and or Ventrilo
05:09 <kamp> hah
05:09 <DrJoeTron> it shows who's talking while you
05:09 <DrJoeTron> 're in a game
05:09 <Lucifer_arma> well, I guess I'm satisfied, no more porting for me
05:09 <DrJoeTron> it works with Vent i know
05:09 <DrJoeTron> but TS im not quite too sure on as well
05:09 <spidey> Flagging scripts as executable...
05:09 <spidey> Done!  You may now run configure and start building.
05:09 <spidey> :O
05:10 <Lucifer_arma> yay
05:10 <Lucifer_arma> now ./configure --disable-glout
05:10 <DrJoeTron> man
05:10 <spidey> can i specify where to install "everything" except the libs to?
05:10 <DrJoeTron> not having a computer to the internet
05:10 <DrJoeTron> is soo....constraining...
05:10 <Lucifer_arma> er, wait
05:10 <Lucifer_arma> there are no libs
05:10 <Lucifer_arma> anyway, do ./configure --disable-glout --prefix=/dev/null
05:10 <spidey>  --libdir=DIR           object code libraries [EPREFIX/lib]
05:10 <spidey> O.o
05:11 <Lucifer_arma> that's a default option provided by autoconf, we dont' use it for anything
05:11 <Lucifer_arma> we don't have any libs!
05:11 <Lucifer_arma> if we had a library we distributed, that would control it, yes :)
05:11 <spidey> configure: error: You need the library xml2 to compile Armagetron. Read the file doc/install_linux.html.
05:11 <Lucifer_arma> install the libxml2-dev package
05:12 <spidey> i just installed that earlier -_-
05:12 <spidey> oh wait
05:12 <spidey> -dev?
05:12 <Lucifer_arma> -dev, yes
05:13 <DrJoeTron> musta
05:13 <DrJoeTron> krakish
05:13 <DrJoeTron> musta
05:13 <DrJoeTron> krakish
05:13 <spidey> Warning: The configure script decided that, to better work on your system,
05:13 <spidey>   it would be a good idea to modify files outside of /dev/null
05:13 <Lucifer_arma> what would the world be like without DrJoeTron's periodic babbling?
05:13 <spidey> O.o
05:13 <Lucifer_arma> er, heh
05:13 <Lucifer_arma> ummmm
05:13 <spidey> Configuration complete!
05:13 <Lucifer_arma> I think you should reconfigure, because you're going to be really pissed at me laughing my ass off if you install everything to /dev/null
05:14 <spidey> :O
05:14 <Lucifer_arma> where do you want arma to install to?
05:14  * spidey is to high to actually pay attention
05:14  * Lucifer_arma just assumed you'd notice the obvious /dev/null prank
05:14 <spidey> so don't really tell me to do something like that xD
05:15 <Lucifer_arma> ok.  well, pick a place.  That message basically just says "We're installing an initscript for you and a symbolic link in /etc to make it easy to find config files"
05:15 <Lucifer_arma> it only really matters if you need to disable it for the autopackage and for a really anal FHS distribution
05:16 <spidey> Warning: The configure script decided that, to better work on your system,
05:16 <spidey>   it would be a good idea to modify files outside of /home/armagetronad
05:16 <spidey> though
05:16 <spidey> it's not in /home/armagetron
05:16 <spidey> :/
05:16 <Lucifer_arma> did you do --prefix=/home/armagetronad ?
05:16 <Your_mom_arma> are we going to play freeciv today?
05:17 <Lucifer_arma> Your_mom_arma: probably not, I probably can't play any freeciv until after this weekend
05:17 <spidey> yes
05:17 <spidey> ./configure --disable-glout --prefix=/home/armagetronad
05:17 <Lucifer_arma> ok spidey, then it's going to put the binary in /home/armagetronad/bin , the config files in /home/armagetronad/etc
05:17 <Lucifer_arma> etc
05:17 <spidey> didn't
05:17 <kamp> freeciv...
05:17 <Lucifer_arma> I'd go one directory deeper and do --prefix=/home/armagetronad/armainstall or something
05:17 <Lucifer_arma> it won't install anything at all until you do "make install"
05:18 <Lucifer_arma> but you're not doing that yet
05:18 <Lucifer_arma> kamp: freeciv!
05:18 <spidey> omg
05:18  * spidey slaps self
05:18 <spidey> >.<
05:18 <kamp> never played it
05:18 <Lucifer_arma> kamp: ever play Sid Meier's Civilization?
05:18 <kamp> nope
05:18 <Lucifer_arma> Civilization 2?
05:19 <kamp> hey, dontrelle wilis is on the cover of sports illustrated
05:19 <spidey> man
05:19 <kamp> no sir
05:19 <spidey> only pros play civ!
05:19 <Lucifer_arma> Civilization 3?
05:19 <spidey> with the exception of luke
05:19 <kamp> ...
05:19 <kamp> take a wild guess
05:19 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, luke's not a pro, heh
05:19 <Lucifer_arma> http://www.freeciv.org/
05:19 <Lucifer_arma> if you're at all a history buff or a strategy gamer, you want to play freeciv with us sometime
05:19 <kamp> i'll check it out some time during spring break
05:19 <luke-jr_> ...
05:20 <spidey> don't you ... us
05:20 <Lucifer_arma> he's trying to multiply us, but we're not vectors!
05:20  * GodTodd is a vector.
05:20 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: so when you're happy with your prefix, do "make"
05:20 <spidey> lol
05:20 <spidey> done
05:20 <spidey> well, not done yet
05:21  * GodTodd wants to project himself onto Lucifer_arma 
05:21 <spidey> i did it back when i figured out i was stupid and forgot make :D
05:21 <Lucifer_arma> ok, whenever it's done, start it with "make run" and then custom connect to your machine
05:21 <Lucifer_arma> er, fire up a client locally and custom connect to your server is what I mean :)
05:21 <Lucifer_arma> you know, to see that it runs before you actually install it
05:22 <spidey> hm
05:22 -!- xfroggy [n=xfroggy@crlspr-] has joined #armagetron
05:22 <GodTodd> test before implementing? you must be mad, man!
05:22 <spidey> i wonder how bad the 3 gameservers are lagging right now
05:22 <spidey> xD
05:22 <kamp> how would you center an element using css?
05:23 <Lucifer_arma> kamp: depends on the element
05:23 <Lucifer_arma> what's the element?
05:23 <spidey> margin: auto;
05:23 <kamp> div
05:23 <Lucifer_arma> you want to center the whole div?
05:23 <kamp> margin: auto? never heard of it, i'll check it out
05:23 <kamp> yessir
05:23 <spidey> margin: auto; places it in the center of the page
05:23 <Lucifer_arma> width: 100%; margin-left: 20%; margin-right: 20%;
05:24 <Lucifer_arma> spidey: so you do margin: auto; and then just give a width?
05:24 <spidey> sometimes
05:24 <spidey> depends on what i'm doing
05:24 <spidey> http://fallin-angels.net/design1
05:24 <spidey> i think
05:24 <GodTodd> like pot? crack? heroin?
05:24 <GodTodd> ;)
05:24 <kamp> hm
05:24 <spidey> that has margin: auto;
05:24 <Lucifer_arma> oh come on, spidey doesn't smoke crack!
05:25 <kamp> opera needs to make th keyboard shortcuts work everywhere
05:25 <spidey> not crack...
05:25 <spidey> pot's fine :D
05:25  * GodTodd notices the lack of mention of heroin. :P
05:25 <spidey> ...
05:26 <spidey> doctors don't even stick niddles in my arms
05:26 <spidey> :|
05:26 <kamp> yea actually, your solution is pretty bad, luci
05:26 <kamp> i'd want to be able to set the width of the thing
05:26 <spidey> kamp, gimme link
05:26 <kamp> but i didn't say that
05:26 <spidey> and tell me what you're trying to do
05:26 <kamp> there is no link right now, it's on my computer
05:26 <spidey> upload :P
05:27 <kamp> i wouldn't worry about it
05:27 <kamp> you're absolutely correct
05:27 <kamp> http://www.bluerobot.com/web/css/center1.html
05:27 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, works
05:28 <spidey> make install'ing now :D
05:28 <spidey> ?
05:28 <spidey> kamp, ?
05:28 <kamp> setting margins to auto is right
05:28 <kamp> just saying
05:29 <spidey> ..
05:29 <Your_mom_arma> the problem with that page is all the info is displayed on less then half the width of my screen
05:29 <kamp> ?
05:29 <spidey> all that looks like that does is
05:29 <kamp> spidey, what?
05:29 <spidey> put everything 50% from the left
05:29 <kamp> was that english?
05:29 <kamp> there's no noun!
05:29 <spidey> no shit?
05:29 <spidey> :O
05:29 <kamp> nounless speech
05:29 <kamp> ...
05:30 <spidey> i just did
05:30 <kamp> i refuse to believe it can exist
05:30 <spidey> just did :O
05:30  * Your_mom_arma hates pages that work mainly in pixels
05:30 <spidey> anyways
05:30  * kamp uses inches :)
05:30 <spidey> margin: auto; width: ; and top: ; 
05:30 <spidey> is much easier
05:30 <kamp> yea
05:30 <spidey> text-align: center; if you want
05:31 <kamp> nah
05:31 <spidey> or you could do top:;bottom:;left:;right::
05:31 <spidey> :P
05:31 <xfroggy> #roulette
05:31 <kamp> nah
05:31 <armabot> xfroggy: *click*
05:31 <kamp> #roulette
05:31 <armabot> *BANG* Hey, who put a blank in here?!
05:31  * armabot reloads and spins the chambers.
05:32 <kamp> almost died
05:32 <xfroggy> lol
05:32 <GodTodd> good thing it was *practice* russian roulette
05:32 <GodTodd> ;)
05:33 <xfroggy> ;)
05:33 <GodTodd> then there's american roulette
05:33 <GodTodd> same as russian except you point it at someone else
05:33 <kamp> you knwo what's frustrating?
05:33 <DrJoeTron> bah
05:33 <DrJoeTron> fucking USB 1.0 ports
05:33 <spidey> yay
05:33 <kamp> google calendar
05:33 <spidey> a .pid
05:33  * xfroggy points and GodTodd and pushes the trigger
05:33 <spidey> ty Lucifer_arma ! :D
05:33 <xfroggy> GodTodd, *click*
05:34 <DrJoeTron> sooo fucking slow
05:34 <GodTodd> easier to pull the trigger :P
05:34 <kamp> google calndar is frustrating me to death
05:34 <GodTodd> fuck you joe :)
05:34 <kamp> it's cool and all
05:34 <kamp> but the sms notifications still aren't working
05:34 <kamp> i don't want to have to remember anything in my life!
05:38 <xfroggy> what about ur name
05:38 <kamp> it's pretty well engrained
05:38 <kamp> i've got it down pat, that's fine
05:38 <xfroggy> =\
05:38 <kamp> but my schedule?
05:38 <kamp> bah
05:38 <Lucifer_arma> don't forget about mexican roulette!
05:38 <spidey> armagetronad@zion:~$ chmod u+x serverstarter
05:38 <spidey> chmod: changing permissions of `serverstarter': Operation not permitted
05:38 <kamp> i only need a vague idea of my day to day schedule
05:38 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, care to teach me permissions next? xD
05:38 <Lucifer_arma> you need to be root for that part, spidey
05:39 <kamp> besides, i got unlimited texts so i could get google notifications and not worry about it
05:39 <spidey> run the server as root?
05:39 <Lucifer_arma> no, install it as root
05:39 <spidey> it's installed
05:39 <xfroggy> Oo
05:39 <Lucifer_arma> run it using the initscript provided :)
05:39 <spidey> read :P
05:39 <kamp> yea xfroggy
05:39 <spidey> chmod: changing permissions of `serverstarter': Operation not permitted
05:39 <kamp> it's a drag
05:39 <Lucifer_arma> right, I'm supposed to read through all that crap..
05:39 <Your_mom_arma> kamp can get his name tattooed on his hand, he cant tattoo a schedule to his arm not enough space
05:39 <xfroggy> I want unlimited sms =\
05:39 <Lucifer_arma> wtf is it doing a chmod for?
05:39 <spidey> it's not
05:39 <spidey> i am so i can execute it
05:40 <Lucifer_arma> er, it should already be done!
05:40 <spidey> ok it was
05:40 <spidey> but here's what happens
05:40 <spidey> [0] Warning in tString tPath::GetWritePath(const char*) const in tools/tDirectories.cpp:837 :
05:40 <spidey>         [0] Could not create path to /home/armagetronad/.armagetronad/var/var/scorelog.txt. Check your user's rights.
05:40 <spidey> it's fine when i do root
05:40 <spidey> it with*
05:40 <Lucifer_arma> ahhh, hm
05:40 <Lucifer_arma> ls -l ~/.armagetronad
05:41 <spidey> ls: /home/armagetronad/.armagetron: No such file or directory
05:41 <kamp> sweet
05:41 <Lucifer_arma> ls -l ~/.armagetronad
05:41 <kamp> now i just need a picture of a timepiece
05:41 <kamp> and the gimp
05:41 <spidey> my bad
05:41 <spidey> samething though
05:43  * Lucifer_arma wonders why there are two /var's in that path
05:44 <spidey> no idea :O
05:44 <Lucifer_arma> aha
05:44 <Lucifer_arma> try this:
05:44 <Lucifer_arma>  /home/armagetronad/bin/armagetronad-dedicated
05:45 <Lucifer_arma> where /home/armagetronad is whatever you used for --prefix
05:45 <xfroggy> #serverinfo wild fortress
05:45 <armabot> xfroggy: Crazy Tronners Wild Fortress: No online players.
05:45 <spidey> [0] Warning in tString tPath::GetWritePath(const char*) const in tools/tDirectories.cpp:837 :
05:45 <spidey>         [0] Could not create path to /home/armagetronad/.armagetronad-dedicated/var/scorelog.txt. Check your user's rights.
05:45 <kamp> #serverinfo tub
05:45 <armabot> kamp: The Lobster Tub(TEST): Players (1/6): Slopok Rodreges
05:46 <spidey> ok
05:46 <spidey> changed it to 7777
05:46 <spidey> xD
05:46 <spidey> it executes now
05:46 <kamp> #serverinfo cage
05:46 <armabot> kamp: The Lobster Cage: No online players.
05:46 <kamp> dagnabbit
05:46 <spidey> kinda
05:46 <kamp> slo's a spec
05:48 <spidey> there we go
05:48 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, it's fully started now :D
05:48 <spidey> well
05:48 <spidey> nvm
05:48 <kamp> :)
05:48 <spidey> forgot to disable the webserver
05:50 <spidey> now it's running :D
05:53 <kamp> btw luci
05:53 <kamp> can you think of any reason why the glances would stop working?
05:53 <spidey> you use default glances?
05:53 <spidey> numb pad* i mean
05:54  * spidey uses numbpad arrows and sometimes accidently disables the numbpad icon and crashes into a wall trying to glacne
05:54 <kamp> deafault
05:54 <spidey> no idear :D
05:55 <kamp> meneither
06:00 <Lucifer_arma> if I take a car and let it roll down a ramp, then take 4 measurements along its path, at each of those 4 measurements, total energy should be the same, right?
06:00 <Lucifer_arma> Potential energy turns into kinetic energy, but total energy is the same?
06:01 <kamp> no idea
06:01 <kamp> the only energy we talk about is in chemm
06:02 <Lucifer_arma> hmmm, this is mechanical energy
06:02 <Lucifer_arma> I don't think chemistry covers it
06:03 <kamp> no
06:04 <Lucifer_arma> I can check my measurements by computing, errr
06:04 <Lucifer_arma> heh
06:04 <spidey> hm
06:04 <Lucifer_arma> I need work done in the direction of motion, which is on an inclined plane
06:04  * spidey is confused xD
06:05  * Lucifer_arma suspects the kinetic computation
06:11 <Lucifer_arma> ok, it's checking out
06:11 <Lucifer_arma> I still have one computation that's off by a bit
06:12 <Lucifer_arma> damn, I'm going to have to delete all these formulas when it's time for the test :(
06:15  * Lucifer_arma needs to find a usb cable
06:16 <DrJoeTron> I have just figured out my new goal in life
06:16 <DrJoeTron> I'm going to be a One hit wonder
06:17 <GodTodd> doesn't that run in the family?
06:17 <DrJoeTron> through marriage it does
06:17 <GodTodd> heh
06:17 <kamp> why a one hit wonder?
06:17 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, does the server use ~./armagetronad or ~/.armagetronad-dedicated
06:17 <spidey> ?
06:17 <GodTodd> cuz he can't do two?
06:17 <DrJoeTron> because all i have to do is come up with one sweet song
06:17 <spidey> i've got one of both :/
06:17 <kamp> and why is the O capitalized
06:18 <kamp> one hit wonders don't exist too much
06:18 <DrJoeTron> and everyone remembers one hit wonders
06:18 <kamp> most people get three or four
06:18 <kamp> ...
06:18 <kamp> i don
06:18 <kamp> t
06:18 <GodTodd> he actually wants to be a One Hit Wonder
06:18 <DrJoeTron> i'm going to be the next eagle eye cherry
06:18 <kamp> ...who?
06:18 <DrJoeTron> or the new radicals
06:18 <kamp> again i say
06:18 <kamp> who?
06:18 <DrJoeTron> one hit wonders :p
06:18 <GodTodd> iron butterfly :D
06:18 <kamp> they don't sell singles anymore, bro
06:18 <DrJoeTron> you've heard both of there songs
06:18 <DrJoeTron> their*
06:18 <kamp> they look for people that can hold down an album
06:19 <kamp> not one hit wonders
06:19 <DrJoeTron> bullshit
06:19 <GodTodd> ummm...i have a trio album
06:19 <DrJoeTron> yeah
06:19 <GodTodd> they had one hit
06:19 <GodTodd> trust me
06:19 <GodTodd> heh
06:19 <DrJoeTron> its allos called iTunes
06:19 <DrJoeTron> also*
06:19 <DrJoeTron> those are pretty much the new singles
06:20 <GodTodd> now all of you stfu...i forgot to do my government homework and have half an hour or so to email it in
06:20 <GodTodd> heh
06:20 <DrJoeTron> SHIT
06:20 <DrJoeTron> i need to do my thesis
06:20 <DrJoeTron> it'll be great
06:21  * kamp just read the article about top ten free linux games
06:21 <kamp> where tron is 7th
06:21 <DrJoeTron> hahaha
06:21 <kamp> how the hell is oh well
06:21 <kamp> forget about it
06:21 <DrJoeTron> fuck you kamp
06:22 <GodTodd> fuck you joe
06:22 <DrJoeTron> fuck me GodTodd
06:22 <GodTodd> after homework
06:23 <kamp> ...
06:23 <kamp> what just happened
06:23 <kamp> did joe throw a random ass hissy fit?
06:23 <GodTodd> usually
06:23 <Your_mom_arma> if random=daily
06:24 <GodTodd> mom: at different times of day tho :D
06:24 <GodTodd> and that's an infinite loop
06:25 <GodTodd> if (random = daily)
06:28 <DrJoeTron> this laptop is turning into a white elephant
06:32 -!- [dlh] [n=[dlh]@c-76-19-206-67.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit []
06:35 -!- kamp42 [n=cpayan@ip72-209-64-18.ga.at.cox.net] has joined #armagetron
06:36 -!- kamp [n=cpayan@ip72-209-64-18.ga.at.cox.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
06:36 -!- kamp42 is now known as kamp
06:36 <kamp> hm
06:37  * kamp realizes he has absolutely no idea how to do anything in photoshop 7
06:39 <kamp> #serverinfo tube
06:39 <armabot> kamp: There doesn't seem to be a server matching “tube” at the moment, sorry.
06:39 <kamp> #serverinfo tub
06:39 <armabot> kamp: The Lobster Tub(TEST): Players (3/6): nekro turkey, Yarns, ||||
06:40 <kamp> #serverinfo tub
06:40 <armabot> kamp: The Lobster Tub(TEST): Players (3/6): nekro turkey, Yarns, ©S¦	||||
06:45 -!- hang3r [n=hang3r@124-168-236-35.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #Armagetron
06:50 <kamp> hi hang3r
06:50 <hang3r> hey kamp
06:50 <kamp> you're in australia, right
06:50 <hang3r> sure am
06:50 <kamp> neat
06:50 <kamp> my sister's going there this summer
06:51 <kamp> her last semester in college and she's doing it abroad :)
06:51 <hang3r> well I'm sure she'll like it
06:51 <hang3r> Can't really find many people that dislike australia
06:52 <DrJoeTron> kamp
06:52 <DrJoeTron> what are you trying to do in photoshop
06:52 <DrJoeTron> LENS FLARE!?
06:57 <DrJoeTron> :O
07:01 <kamp> in photoshop?
07:01 <DrJoeTron> yeah
07:01 <kamp> i'm just trying to get a picture of a watch, crop it, and then put it in another image
07:01 <DrJoeTron> layers?
07:01 <kamp> the cropping and all that, i haven't bothered trying, but putting the image of a watch in another image i can't seem to get
07:01 <DrJoeTron> thats easy shit
07:01 <DrJoeTron> lemme do it :p
07:02 <kamp> nah
07:02 <kamp> it'll turn out with some ms paint turd all over it
07:02 <DrJoeTron> pfft
07:02 <kamp> besides, I want to learn how to do some basics editing with photoshop
07:02 <DrJoeTron> marquee tools,
07:02 <DrJoeTron> and layers
07:02 <DrJoeTron> make them your friends
07:03 <kamp> how do you put an image in another image though?
07:03 <DrJoeTron> what do you mean
07:03 <DrJoeTron> just copy paste?
07:03 <DrJoeTron> or are you trying to fade it in to it
07:03 <kamp> copy paste.
07:04 <kamp> that would make sense
07:04 <DrJoeTron> learn to use your layers :d
07:06 <kamp> yea
07:06 <kamp> i was taught how to use photoshop once
07:07 <kamp> unfortunately, it is very unlike a bike
07:07 <kamp> you can't stop riding for years, and then come back on and pick it up automagically
07:10 -!- hang3r [n=hang3r@124-168-236-35.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
07:12 <kamp> #serverinfo tub
07:12 <armabot> kamp: The Lobster Tub(TEST): Players (3/6): pinky, w0rms3r, Xdude
07:14 <kamp> #serverinfo cage
07:14 <armabot> kamp: The Lobster Cage: No online players.
07:20 <kamp> #serverinfo cage
07:20 <armabot> kamp: The Lobster Cage: No online players.
07:20 -!- kamp [n=cpayan@ip72-209-64-18.ga.at.cox.net] has left #armagetron []
07:28 <DrJoeTron> ewwww
07:28 <DrJoeTron> some weird chick took my Photoshop Phriday image and has it on her myspace
07:29 <DrJoeTron> egad
07:29 <DrJoeTron> google is a horrible horrible mistress
07:33 <DrJoeTron> welp found the arma irc chat logs
07:33 <DrJoeTron> this sucks
07:33 <DrJoeTron> im not going on the internet anymore
07:35 <GodTodd> #realchatlogs
07:35 <armabot> GodTodd: http://master3.armagetronad.net/armalogs/
07:35 <GodTodd> :P
07:35 <DrJoeTron> im playing internet detective on myself
07:36 <Lucifer_arma> #google Dr Joe Tron
07:36 <armabot> Lucifer_arma: Search took 0.14 seconds: Armagetron Forums :: Index: <http://forums.armagetronad.net/>; Armagetron Forums :: View topic - Anybody need a moderator?: <http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?t=12701&sid=84c74114a07a2f5339c57b4b2d5f06fc>; K- Tron - Company News: <http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=90806&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=527980&highlight=>; Summary: (2 more messages)
07:36 <DrJoeTron> pft thats nothing
07:36 <Lucifer_arma> hey, what's in that third link?
07:36 <DrJoeTron> no idea
07:36  * Lucifer_arma was happy to find that you had to click through like 6-8 pages before you found irrelevant stuff on him
07:36 <DrJoeTron> GodTodd
07:36 -!- zmanuel [n=manuel@p50872E6B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #armagetron
07:37 <GodTodd> DrJoeTron:): 
07:37 <DrJoeTron> plano texas right?
07:37 <GodTodd> yep
07:37 <DrJoeTron> found your myspace
07:37 <Your_mom_arma> DrJoeTron: link to the myspace page?
07:37 <GodTodd> heh...i haven't messed with that in a while
07:37 <Lucifer_arma> oh, that third link is irrelevant, just happens to contain Dr, Joe, and Tron all on the same page
07:37  * Lucifer_arma challenges you all to find a myspace page for him
07:37 <DrJoeTron> http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=503106
07:39 <Your_mom_arma> its on a verypoorly made myspace page to make it even worse the guy couldnt figure out how to embed the image
07:39 <DrJoeTron> haha yeah
07:40 <Lucifer_arma> I found that page joe, and googled "fancella yapri"
07:40 <Lucifer_arma> only to find one more link to someone who's that person's friend
07:40 <Lucifer_arma> I don't know wtf that person is
07:40 <DrJoeTron> hahha
07:40 <DrJoeTron> man
07:40  * spidey jumps with joy
07:41 <spidey> :D:D
07:41 <Lucifer_arma> spidey setup a myspace page?
07:41 <spidey> finally got everything setup! :D
07:41 <DrJoeTron> hahaha
07:41 <spidey> spidey?myspace? never!
07:41  * Lucifer_arma wonders if there's a more anti-myspace chat room than this
07:41 -!- luke-jr_ [n=luke-jr@2002:1891:f663:0:20e:a6ff:fec4:4e5d] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
07:41 <spidey> next person to mention my name in a sentance with myspace gets zapped by luke-jr_'s almightiness
07:42 <Lucifer_arma> spidey hates myspace, I see
07:42 <GodTodd> i only set mine up for shits and grins when i was bored once
07:42 <DrJoeTron> i don't like myspace
07:42 <Lucifer_arma> I don't like your space either, joe
07:42 <spidey> well
07:42 <spidey> i don't get why have myspace when you can have forums or a shoutbox
07:42 <GodTodd> anyone wanna kill a bass fisher guy?
07:42 <Lucifer_arma> no kidding.  Why do I need myspace when I've got my own fucking webserver?
07:43  * Lucifer_arma kindly asks nobody to say "bandwidth"
07:43 <spidey> lol
07:43 <GodTodd> that reminds me...i need to set up a webserver
07:43 <GodTodd> bandwidth :D
07:43 <Lucifer_arma> you can use mine :)
07:43 <GodTodd> true...i suppose i could
07:44 <Lucifer_arma> all you need to do is ask :)
07:44 <GodTodd> i think my hosting contract is up in april
07:44 <Lucifer_arma> you can even cname a domain to some host I give you and it'll respond appropriately
07:44 <GodTodd> gonna renew the domain tho
07:44 <Lucifer_arma> that's how we do the wiki
07:44 <Lucifer_arma> tank owns armagetronad.net, he just cnamed wiki.armagetronad.net to wiki.davefancella.com
07:44 <GodTodd> then i might actually do something useful with it too heh
07:45 <Lucifer_arma> there is a pretty significant upgrade planned during spring break, though
07:45 <Lucifer_arma> as soon as I download the newest Mandriva, that is ;)
07:45 <GodTodd> heh
07:45 -!- luke-jr_ [n=luke-jr@2002:1891:f663:0:20e:a6ff:fec4:4e5d] has joined #armagetron
07:45  * Lucifer_arma thinks he's a major revision out of date right now
07:45 <GodTodd> i could even use the ssh i suppose
07:45 <GodTodd> hmmm
07:45 <Lucifer_arma> I'm tired of nursing gentoo
07:45 <Lucifer_arma> you could.  I could fire up an ftp server if you'd prefer that
07:46 <Lucifer_arma> but really, ssh works fine :)
07:46 <GodTodd> well....we have the ssh set up already
07:46 <Lucifer_arma> you can have as many databases as you want, I'll even throw on postgres if you wanted that for some weird reason
07:46 <GodTodd> what's that?
07:46 <Lucifer_arma> er, right now it's got java support, but that may change when I get Mandriva on there
07:46 <Lucifer_arma> postgres is a database that's comparable with oracle
07:46 <Lucifer_arma> but open source
07:47  * luke-jr_ stabs Konv
07:47 <Lucifer_arma> and not nearly as entrenched.
07:47 -!- mode/#armagetron [+o luke-jr_] by ChanServ
07:47 <@luke-jr_> #later tell Hyphy I don't suppose you could *actually* pay me the $80 owed by any chance, just this once? Kinda short on money here, and your little game might put me negative.
07:47 <GodTodd> ahhh
07:47 <armabot> luke-jr_: The operation succeeded.
07:47 <@luke-jr_> #later tell rickyross I don't suppose you could *actually* pay me the $80 owed by any chance, just this once? Kinda short on money here, and your little game might put me negative.
07:47 <armabot> luke-jr_: The operation succeeded.
07:47 <@luke-jr_> "comparable with oracle" = "lack of standards compliance"?
07:47  * Lucifer_arma wonders how many new monitors luke has to buy when he stabs something
07:47 <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr_: how standards compliant can a database be that lets you store php scripts as stored procedures?
07:47 -!- mode/#armagetron [-b Hyphy!*@*] by luke-jr_
07:47 -!- mode/#armagetron [-b *!n=1805ee63@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] by luke-jr_
07:48 -!- mode/#armagetron [-b *!n=1805ee63@*] by luke-jr_
07:48 -!- mode/#armagetron [-b *!*@c-24-7-31-144.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] by luke-jr_
07:48 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: the SQL syntax has issues, IIRC
07:48 <Your_mom_arma> why did you unban him?
07:48 <@luke-jr_> Your_mom_arma: I need him to pay me
07:48 <Lucifer_arma> so he could beg him for money, why else?
07:48  * Lucifer_arma really hopes luke figures out not to sell services to known smegheads after this
07:48  * spidey gives luke-jr_ a stolen credit card 
07:48 <spidey> :O
07:49 <Your_mom_arma> what happened to the whole stolen credit card no more buisness with hyphy convo
07:49 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: he wasn't known at the time he started
07:49 <Lucifer_arma> yes he was
07:49 <@luke-jr_> not to me
07:49 <Lucifer_arma> when someone comes in here and talks a bunch of shit to everyone, and then demands you give him a server, he's a known smeghead
07:49 <Lucifer_arma> I mean, when he's someone previously unaffiliated with this channel
07:49 <Lucifer_arma> if it were spidey, well...
07:49 <@luke-jr_> that was after he started, I bet
07:49 <Lucifer_arma> nope
07:49 <spidey> ...
07:50 <@luke-jr_> maybe I missed it
07:50 <Lucifer_arma> that was exactly how he did it
07:50 <Lucifer_arma> you did, you weren't here
07:50 <spidey> indeed
07:50 <spidey> remember
07:50  * GodTodd remembers that dude coming in every hour or so.
07:50 <spidey> he came in bitching about luke-jr_ 's hosting sucking because luke-jr_ wasn't here at the time
07:50 <spidey> btw luke-jr_ 
07:50  * luke-jr_ considers requiring people to mail a signature of some sort in the future
07:50 <spidey> when rickyross told you he lived in CA
07:50 <GodTodd> "is luke-jr_ here? i want to get a server.  tell him i'll pay a century in advance" and such
07:50 <spidey> isn't his isp  canadian?
07:51 <@luke-jr_> spidey: is it?
07:51 <Lucifer_arma> "we're not your answering service, send him an email"
07:51 <Lucifer_arma> "Fuck you, you will do it!"
07:51 <@luke-jr_> ROFL
07:51 <@luke-jr_> really??
07:51 <Lucifer_arma> and then some asshat here (I think it was vanhayes) went and relayed the message!
07:51 <GodTodd> luke-jr_: would you mail in a signature to order something?
07:51 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: dunno :/
07:51 <GodTodd> easy solution
07:51 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: I'd insist on a digital sig
07:51 <Lucifer_arma> you need to require a billing address for every credit card :)
07:51 <Vanhayes> what did I do?
07:52 <@luke-jr_> but I'm me
07:52 <GodTodd> companies have used it forever
07:52 <GodTodd> pay in advance
07:52 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: there was one, but not his... :/
07:52 <GodTodd> no money, no service
07:52 <GodTodd> *shrug*
07:52 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: and then it's charged back after I start service?
07:52 <Lucifer_arma> the billing address needs to match with the credit card info...
07:52 <Lucifer_arma> you'll retrieve the credit card info yourself and compare
07:52 <@luke-jr_> I can't get the CC info myself :/
07:52 <Lucifer_arma> then you're not setup right
07:53 <@luke-jr_> I'm arguing with Google on that point actually
07:53 <Vanhayes> why am I an asshat?
07:53 <GodTodd> luke-jr_: you ever tried to charge something back?
07:53 <GodTodd> it's a pain in the ass
07:53 <@luke-jr_> that they failed to provide me with useful info to verify, so they should be responsible
07:53 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: no it isn't
07:53 <Lucifer_arma> Vanhayes: for relaying rickyross's message to luke-jr about setting up service?
07:53 <@luke-jr_> you go to the bank and fill out a form
07:53 <@luke-jr_> easy
07:53 <GodTodd> sure sure
07:53 <GodTodd> you're always right
07:53 <GodTodd> i've never done it
07:53 <Lucifer_arma> it's entirely possible hyphy didn't use a stolen credit card and he did the chargeback himself
07:53 <GodTodd> uh huh
07:53 <@luke-jr_> and yes, I have done it before
07:53 <GodTodd> as have i
07:53 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: that could be interesting
07:54 <@luke-jr_> what really gets me is
07:54 <GodTodd> it's only easy if the company doesn't fight it
07:54 <@luke-jr_> one of them had the name "noob cakes"
07:54 <@luke-jr_> assuming Google even verified that
07:54 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: I'm finding out right now that I can't fight it
07:54 <Vanhayes> uh not sure if I did that, but once I learned it was hyphy i told luke that he should stop all business with him right then, no good would come of it
07:55 <Lucifer_arma> I don't know if you did that, ghableska may have done it to fuck with luke, or spidey.  All's I know for sure is I didn't.  :)
07:55 <GodTodd> if you set up correctly you sure as hell can
07:55 <Lucifer_arma> no, you can't fight a chargeback
07:55 <Lucifer_arma> I think it's a federal law that allows you to do it in the first place
07:55 <Lucifer_arma> only for purchases up to $50, though
07:55 <@luke-jr_> he prepaid about $180
07:55 <Lucifer_arma> it's so that for purchases below a certain amount, large companies like wal-mart could make a lot of money fucking over a lot of people in a little way
07:56 <Lucifer_arma> so they arm you with the chargeback
07:56 <Lucifer_arma> $180 on one single credit card you should be able to fight
07:56 <Lucifer_arma> but if the card was stolen, you're fucked
07:56 <Lucifer_arma> if it was his...
07:56 <@luke-jr_> it probably was stolen :/
07:57 <GodTodd> that puts you back to requiring a valid billing address :)
07:57 <@luke-jr_> wonder if i can get the # of the card owner
07:57 <Lucifer_arma> and using a credit card service that lets you verify it
07:57 <GodTodd> yep
07:57 <Lucifer_arma> doesn't PayPal verify credit cards?
07:57 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: and what if he just gives me the address on the card? I can't verify it...
07:57 <Lucifer_arma> there is no address on the card?
07:57 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: PayPal doesn't give you any info on CCs
07:57  * Lucifer_arma looks at one of his cards
07:57 <GodTodd> ummm...there's an address on it?
07:57 <GodTodd> not on any of mine
07:57 <@luke-jr_> hm
07:57 <@luke-jr_> then how would *I* verify it?
07:58 <GodTodd> Lucifer_arma> and using a credit card service that lets you verify i
07:58 <GodTodd> it*
07:58 <Lucifer_arma> nope, no address on mine
07:58 <Lucifer_arma> there are several ways, depending on how you want to do it
07:58 <@luke-jr_> how is a CC service going to get it?
07:58 <Lucifer_arma> I *could* do your research for you, but you should do it
07:58 <Lucifer_arma> Ill give you a pointer, though
07:58 <GodTodd> it's their business to get it
07:58 <Lucifer_arma> look at oscommerce's supported gateway plugins
07:59 <Lucifer_arma> a number of them are for commercial credit card verification systems, with at least 2 for paypal last time I checked
07:59 <GodTodd> if i order from guitarcenter.com, it verifies the billing address before the checkout finishes
07:59 <Lucifer_arma> anyway, paypal is evil, but I suspect they strongly verify credit cards
07:59  * luke-jr_ notes PayPal doesn't protect sellers much or care to
07:59 <Lucifer_arma> I've had people reject credit cards when I typoed my mailing address
08:00 <GodTodd> yep
08:00  * Lucifer_arma notes there are services besides paypal
08:00 <GodTodd> many
08:00 <GodTodd> many
08:00 <Lucifer_arma> well, I don't typo it that much
08:00  * luke-jr_ notes PayPal wasn't even involved in Hyphy's transactions
08:00 <Lucifer_arma> my point, made.  :)
08:00  * luke-jr_ should have suspected something when Hyphy had so many problems paying
08:00 <Lucifer_arma> he was going through his stack to see which ones still worked?  ;)
08:01 <wrtlprnft> umm
08:01 <@luke-jr_> he couldn't get a PayPal acct, Google rejected his first few payments as "risky"
08:01 <@luke-jr_> that's my guess looking back on it
08:01 <wrtlprnft> why doesn't kamp use XmlHttpRequest?
08:01 <Lucifer_arma> because nobody was here to tell him about it?
08:01 <@luke-jr_> lol
08:01 <Lucifer_arma> is he still here?
08:01 <wrtlprnft> no
08:01 <Lucifer_arma> oh, no
08:01 <wrtlprnft> otherwise i'd have pinged him
08:02 <Lucifer_arma> is it an opera-specific thing?
08:02 <wrtlprnft> http://wrtlprnft.ath.cx/serverlist/list.js
08:02 <wrtlprnft> huh?
08:02 <GodTodd> luke-jr_:): was that before or after you started service?
08:02 <@luke-jr_> looks like something AJAX would use
08:02 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: after
08:02 <wrtlprnft> all AJAX is based on it
08:02 <wrtlprnft> gmail, flickr, etc
08:02 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: first payment went through fine
08:02 <@luke-jr_> back when he started
08:02 <Lucifer_arma> (in a snotty voice) well, I did tell him to use ajax... :)
08:03 <Lucifer_arma> hey, you know, whatever happened with hyphy is mostly over now.  I don't think luke's going to get any money out of him, but it would be neat if he did
08:03 <Lucifer_arma> can we worry about how luke can avoid getting fucked over in the future?
08:03 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: BTW, FBI doesn't care about anything under like $15k
08:03 <GodTodd> yeah...i think it's a lost cause
08:03 <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr_: why doesn't that surprise me?  :(
08:04 <@luke-jr_> it's the US gov't, that's hwy
08:04 <@luke-jr_> why*
08:04 <GodTodd> yeah...that'd be cost efficient....send the fbi to help everyone who is screwed out of $80
08:04 <GodTodd> :/
08:05 <GodTodd> it's not exactly a rare situation
08:05 <Lucifer_arma> the advantage to paypal is that you can use whatever bank account you want.  The other credit card gateways require you to setup a special merchant account at a bank.
08:05 <Lucifer_arma> amazon has the honor system, too, but I don't know what-all is available from it
08:06 <Your_mom_arma> ask for a billing address, send them a letter with a random string of letter+numbers and ask them to email you back said string of charachters
08:07 <@luke-jr_> haha
08:07 <GodTodd> nah....a cc verification service is better
08:07 <@luke-jr_> Your_mom_arma: why not just get a signature mailed?
08:08 <@luke-jr_> Google claimed they provided info for me to assess the risk
08:08 <Lucifer_arma> also, require a deposit
08:08 <@luke-jr_> "CVV : Pass"
08:08 <Lucifer_arma> waive the deposit for people you have reason to trust, but don't get naive on anybody
08:08 <Lucifer_arma> but require like n $80 deposit or so
08:08 <@luke-jr_> hm
08:08 <GodTodd> pretty much, you have to assume a customer is going to screw you
08:09 <GodTodd> until they earn trust
08:09 <Lucifer_arma> right, and you have to conduct yourself in a way that you can protect yourself from said screwing without accusing the customer of being a bad guy
08:09 <GodTodd> exactly
08:09 <@luke-jr_> but the problem is, no matter what I do, I make it harder for people to buy service from me
08:10 <@luke-jr_> and it's difficult enough finding customers already
08:10 <GodTodd> kinda like security cameras in stores are "for your protection and to keep your prices down"
08:10 <Lucifer_arma> getting a better credit card validation service will probably handle 90% of the cases
08:10 <Your_mom_arma> how many customers have you had?
08:10 <Lucifer_arma> but look, consider this
08:10 <Lucifer_arma> a large company with plenty of capital can afford to be screwed by a few customers
08:10 <@luke-jr_> Your_mom_arma: 5-10 IIRC
08:10 <Lucifer_arma> they just write it off as a loss (and you can write this off as a loss, and it'll affect your taxes)
08:11 <Lucifer_arma> you're nto a large company with plenty of capital, you need each customer to provide a small amount of reasonable protection
08:11 <Lucifer_arma> even if you just make them buy 3 months to start before letting them go month-to-month
08:11 <GodTodd> for instance....the apartment you're in, luke....did you sign a lease?
08:12 <Lucifer_arma> even so, the place where it really matters is in the credit card validation.  Without a good one, you're in the same boat.
08:12 <@luke-jr_> my next expected customer is getting with friends just to meet the monthly cost, I can't require 2-3 months prepayment :/
08:12 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: yep, though I hear you can easily ignore those if you ignore the deposit
08:12 <wrtlprnft> Lucifer_arma: actually, where did he ask for xml-rpc?
08:12 <wrtlprnft> can't find anything
08:12 <Lucifer_arma> wrtlprnft: I suggested it
08:12 <Lucifer_arma> he didn't ask for it
08:12 <Your_mom_arma> what are your rates that they would need to split the costs
08:13 <Lucifer_arma> my understanding is that ajax widgets use xml-rpc, and that he'd be able to grab someone else's ajax widget to do the deed
08:13 <@luke-jr_> Your_mom_arma: http://lightfoot.dashjr.org
08:13 <GodTodd> luke-jr_: actually...in most states...they can get at least 3 more months of rent from you if you break the lease
08:13 <@luke-jr_> Your_mom_arma: the main problem is my target customer base is non-working
08:13 <wrtlprnft> Lucifer_arma: no, most don't
08:13 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: even if the lease is only for 2 or 1 month longer?
08:14 <Lucifer_arma> wrtlprnft: well, what were you doing sleeping in the middle of the night when you could've been helping kamp?!?!?
08:14 <GodTodd> luke-jr_: no, then they get the rest of the lease....unless the apartment is in impeccable condition
08:14 <Your_mom_arma> even someone who isnt working should be able to pull together $20
08:14 <GodTodd> the point is....they make you obligate to a certain term before considering you for month to month
08:14 <Lucifer_arma> well, he has to weigh it against how much it costs to just get your own server, too
08:14 <@luke-jr_> Your_mom_arma: $20 * 3 = $60
08:14 <GodTodd> you rarely can walk into an apartment at month to month status
08:15 <Lucifer_arma> GodTodd: yeah, the potential damages are much different though.  You can trash an apartment and cause thousands of dollars in damage.
08:15 <Lucifer_arma> what's the worst damage luke's going to get?
08:15 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: Windows or managed Linux costs are generally higher
08:15 <@luke-jr_> and the latter don't support Arma anyway
08:15 <GodTodd> yeah...but i was mainly looking at the "earn trust" aspect
08:16 <Lucifer_arma> I'm with you, I suggested a deposit in the first place :)
08:16 <GodTodd> i know
08:16 <Lucifer_arma> but it absolutely can't replace getting a better credit card validation service :)
08:16 <GodTodd> nope
08:16 <Your_mom_arma> are there even 32 civ players?
08:16 <GodTodd> that's the first step
08:16 <@luke-jr_> Your_mom_arma: LOL
08:16 <@luke-jr_> Your_mom_arma: AIs count toward slots, and yes there are
08:17 <@luke-jr_> the "solution" I'm looking at right now is expanding my target customer base by adding VPS services
08:17  * Lucifer_arma doesn't see a benefit to a commercial civ server offering
08:17  * luke-jr_ doesn't either, and should probably remove it
08:17 <Lucifer_arma> well, what services do you offer right now?
08:17 <@luke-jr_> managed Arma hosting
08:17 <Lucifer_arma> is it just game hosting, or do you do web hosting too?
08:17 <@luke-jr_> web hosting is sortof on the side
08:17 <@luke-jr_> I can't compete with most webhosts
08:18 <Lucifer_arma> no, probably not, most are really huge companies that only make pennies on each customer anyway
08:18 <Lucifer_arma> but you don't need to compete with them in pricce :)
08:18 <@luke-jr_> if I can manage to invest in VPS hosting, I can probably compete in that market
08:19 <Lucifer_arma> you could compete in service, most of the large webhosting companies have issues, angry customers, etc.
08:19 <Lucifer_arma> well, back off a bit and think about it some more.  How would you make money with VPS hosting?
08:19 <Lucifer_arma> what, exactly, is your value offering?
08:19 <@luke-jr_> O.o
08:20 <@luke-jr_> a VPS?
08:20 <Lucifer_arma> in no uncertain terms
08:20 <Lucifer_arma> no, "a VPS" isn't a value offering, it's a piece of software
08:20 <wrtlprnft> waa, i have 999 forum posts :D
08:20 <Lucifer_arma> why do people buy VPS?
08:20  * GodTodd notes that Lucifer_arma is getting dangerously close to the operative term..."mission statement" ;)
08:20 <@luke-jr_> cheap root-access server
08:20 <@luke-jr_> No definitions found for 'value offering'.
08:21 <Lucifer_arma> you need to play the role of the ultra-conservative venture capitalist and convince yourself you actually have a plan :)
08:21 <GodTodd> yep
08:21 <wrtlprnft> Lucifer_arma: well, you also get the CPU time and memory it uses
08:21 <Lucifer_arma> value offering is corporatespeak.
08:21 <@luke-jr_> I do, sortof
08:21 <Lucifer_arma> wrtlprnft: that's still not a value offering!  :)
08:21 <@luke-jr_> colo a box, and set it up to host VPS :p
08:21 <Lucifer_arma> ok, what's google's value offering?
08:21 <wrtlprnft> Lucifer_arma: so what's standard web hosting then?
08:21 <wrtlprnft> you get even less
08:21 <@luke-jr_> Google sells something?
08:21 <@luke-jr_> :p
08:21 <Lucifer_arma> google has customers, people use google for something, what's their offering?
08:22 <Lucifer_arma> think back to when google was the late-comer to the search market
08:22 <@luke-jr_> ...
08:22 <Lucifer_arma> why did google take over the market?  what's so special about them?
08:22 <@luke-jr_> they used to be good for searches
08:22 <wrtlprnft> they had a working search engine?
08:22 <wrtlprnft> they had no annoying ads?
08:22 <@luke-jr_> (now they just suck usually)
08:22 <Lucifer_arma> how good?  altavista was pretty good...
08:22 <Lucifer_arma> ask jeeves was pretty good...
08:22 <@luke-jr_> Metacrawler was too :p
08:23 <@luke-jr_> dunno
08:23 <@luke-jr_> Why did AIM pwn Excite! PAL?
08:23 <Lucifer_arma> did google return results faster?
08:23  * luke-jr_ wonders how many people actually know Excite had an IM service
08:23 <wrtlprnft> fast enough
08:23 <Lucifer_arma> did google return a bunch of useful results?
08:23 <DrJoeTron> ta
08:23 <Lucifer_arma> I'll spell it out.  :)
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08:24 <GodTodd> google reached further into the internet than previous engines
08:24 <Lucifer_arma> Their value offering was "Help you to find the information you're looking for quickly and accurately"
08:24 <GodTodd> more*
08:24 <Lucifer_arma> that's still their value offering, they've just extended it.
08:24 <@luke-jr_> except you can't find crap with it
08:24 <@luke-jr_> just a ton of useless webpages
08:24  * GodTodd finds lots of stuff with it.
08:24  * luke-jr_ finds lots of irrelevant and useless stuff with it :p
08:24 <Lucifer_arma> sure you can, but whether or not you can now is irrelevant.  Before their IPO when they could still use PageRank, they had phenomally good results.
08:25 <GodTodd> then you're not using it right :P
08:25 <@luke-jr_> wait-- did PageRank go away?
08:25 <Lucifer_arma> yep.  part of the IPO.  Standford held the patent on it, adn google couldn't do an IPO with the most important piece of intellectual property they used being owned by a third party
08:26 <Lucifer_arma> *Stanford
08:26 <Lucifer_arma> that's why google's results have been degrading, but they've been doing an admirable job replacing PageRank, their results are just degrading.
08:26 <@luke-jr_> :/
08:26 <Lucifer_arma> anyway, that's all beside the point.  The point is, they have a very real value offering that they've even applied to their advertising service.
08:27 <Lucifer_arma> now, it's true their advertising service needs work, but there's a lot of "google is a big corporation so are necessarily evil now" going on, too
08:27 <Lucifer_arma> s/but/and
08:27 <Lucifer_arma> point is, you can't just say "I'll sell <this> to people and make money!"
08:28 <Lucifer_arma> that's the slashdot business plan.
08:28 <Lucifer_arma> 1.  Create <this service>
08:28 <@luke-jr_> why not?
08:28 <Lucifer_arma> 2.  ???
08:28 <Lucifer_arma> 3.  Profit!
08:28 <Lucifer_arma> because it doesn't work!
08:28 <@luke-jr_> people do it all the time?
08:28 <@luke-jr_> what are BestBuy and RadioShack and such?
08:28 <Lucifer_arma> 90% of new business ventures fold within the first year
08:29 <Lucifer_arma> they're companies that have a well-defined value offering for the stuff they sell
08:29 <@luke-jr_> all they do is sell crap they buy from someone else
08:29 <Lucifer_arma> remember, RadioShack started off as the only hobbyists electronics store around
08:29  * GodTodd likes fry's. ;)
08:29 <Lucifer_arma> BestBuy is a big cheapo electronics store.  Their value offering?  Large selection of stuff you want for low prices.
08:30 <@luke-jr_> last time I went to BestBuy they told me they didn't have what I wanted
08:30 <Lucifer_arma> fry's has definitely taken over RadioShack's original mission.  RS now seems to just sell cell phones and remote control cars
08:30 <@luke-jr_> (I finally found it)
08:30 <@luke-jr_> I've never seen a Fry's
08:30 <Lucifer_arma> doesn't matter if it's what you specifically want, it's what 80% of americans want
08:30 <Your_mom_arma> no fry's where i am either
08:30 <GodTodd> they're spreading :)
08:30 <Lucifer_arma> they're growing rapidly, filling the void left by RadioShack when RS decided to focus on cell phones and RC cars
08:30 <GodTodd> they bought out incredible universe a while back
08:30 <Your_mom_arma> been to their website though
08:31 <Lucifer_arma> when the arrive to Your_mom_arma (hi there!) 's town, he's going to shit a brick
08:31 <@luke-jr_> so what if spidey and I get together and offer VPS hosting with managed services for a wide array of services?
08:31 <GodTodd> yep
08:31 <Lucifer_arma> he's going to build robots and take over the world
08:31 <Your_mom_arma> haha
08:31 <@luke-jr_> wtf is incredible universe?
08:31 <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr_: what's the value offering?
08:31 <Lucifer_arma> value offering = the reason people give you money for what you do
08:31 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: wide array of services supported?
08:31 <Lucifer_arma> why?  why does it matter if you have a wide array of services?
08:31 <@luke-jr_> ...
08:32 <Lucifer_arma> that's a property of the company, it's not value to the customer
08:32 <@luke-jr_> sure it is?
08:32 <GodTodd> each service has to have a value
08:32 <Lucifer_arma> you have to put yourself in the customer's shoes and ask "Why should I buy this from them?"
08:32 <@luke-jr_> if the company doesn't support it, you need to do it yourself
08:32 <Lucifer_arma> remember, the customer is looking at competitors, and the competitors may not even be the same thing
08:32 <Lucifer_arma> maybe the competitor is the customer's 8yo cousin
08:32 <@luke-jr_> s/wide array/infinite array? :p
08:32 <GodTodd> if i say, go buy a hard drive.
08:33 <GodTodd> where do you go?
08:33 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: no clue
08:33 <Lucifer_arma> nobody comes to mind?
08:33 <@luke-jr_> NewEgg and TigerDirect, but I avoid both
08:33 <GodTodd> you've not bought a hard drive?
08:33 <@luke-jr_> not recently
08:33 <Lucifer_arma> so the people that come to mind are people you perceive as not offering sufficient value, or even negative value
08:33 <GodTodd> right
08:33 <Your_mom_arma> goes to newegg
08:34  * Lucifer_arma bought his last hard drive at fry's
08:34 <GodTodd> i go to fry's
08:34 <GodTodd> heh
08:34 <Lucifer_arma> what are people going to do with your VPS service?
08:34 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: not in the past 3 years
08:34 <GodTodd> ok luke...what have you bought in the last month?
08:34 <GodTodd> name something
08:34 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: food
08:34 <GodTodd> anything
08:35 <@luke-jr_> that's about it
08:35 <GodTodd> and where did you go?
08:35 <@luke-jr_> Walmart
08:35 <Lucifer_arma> http://www.sba.gov/smallbusinessplanner/index.html
08:35 <GodTodd> and why?
08:35 <Lucifer_arma> I'm going to cover you up with links until you believe me
08:35 <@luke-jr_> it's near the bus stop
08:35 <GodTodd> location is part of the value they offer
08:35 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: host crap
08:35 <Lucifer_arma> http://www.smallbusinessplanguide.com/web/index.php
08:36 <GodTodd> how about this....wtf do people overpay for coffee at starbucks?
08:36 <Lucifer_arma> Writing a business plan will force you to objectively develop and evaluate your tactical and strategic plans. It will also help you identify the opportunities and risks encountered as a result of your decisions.
08:36 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: no clue
08:36 <GodTodd> variety, atmosphere, locations.....among others
08:36 <GodTodd> those are all valuable to the customers
08:37 <GodTodd> so much so that 3-4$ for coffee is tolerable
08:37 <Your_mom_arma> the ability to order coffee with names longer then a sentence
08:37 <@luke-jr_> lol
08:37 <GodTodd> that too for some ;)
08:38 <GodTodd> see...the first thing you have to do is make sure *you* know what you offer of value to the customer
08:38 <GodTodd> if you don't know neither do they
08:38 <GodTodd> and you have to be able to tell them what it is in order to convince them they *need* it
08:38 <@luke-jr_> people who want VPS's or specific services usually know what they want already
08:39 <Lucifer_arma> http://www.entrepreneur.com/bizstartups/index.html
08:39 <GodTodd> you can't assume that the customer knows anything
08:39 <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr_: that's not good enough
08:39 <Lucifer_arma> basically here's what's happening:
08:39 <Lucifer_arma> "Why should I buy VPS from you and not somebody else?"  "I don't know."
08:39 <@luke-jr_> "My prices are cheaper"?
08:39 <Lucifer_arma> how much money is "I don't know" worth?
08:39 <GodTodd> than who?
08:40 <GodTodd> you have to know your competition too
08:40 <Lucifer_arma> "your prices are cheaper, so I see, but you get what you pay for."
08:40 <@luke-jr_> :p
08:40 <@luke-jr_> "you have more control when there is a problem"
08:40 <GodTodd> than which service(s)
08:40 <Lucifer_arma> seriously, you do.  I did more volume when I raised prices in my barbecue stand and tapped the whole market.
08:40 <GodTodd> ?
08:40 <@luke-jr_> than any other VPS host I've seen
08:40 <Lucifer_arma> people didn't want to buy the food when it was cheaper because they didn't think it could be good for that price.
08:40 <GodTodd> too general
08:41 <@luke-jr_> ...
08:41 <Lucifer_arma> how about "Your mysql database will fly on my VPS"
08:41 <GodTodd> that sounds better :)
08:41 <@luke-jr_> who cares? :p
08:41 <Lucifer_arma> how about "You'll spend less time working on your server and more time doing business"
08:41 <GodTodd> nobody if you wanna lose money...
08:41 <GodTodd> "don't worry about your server, that's our job"
08:42 <Lucifer_arma> right, "Take care of your customers, we'll take care of your silicon"
08:42 <Lucifer_arma> and read some of the links I just gave you before I got bored
08:43 <GodTodd> "server maintenance greek to you? we'll assign a geek to you!"
08:43 <GodTodd> man that was lame
08:43 <GodTodd> heh
08:43 <@luke-jr_> O.o
08:43 <Lucifer_arma> haha, that was awesome
08:43 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: you steal that?
08:43 <Lucifer_arma> maybe me and todd should start up a VPS business
08:43 <GodTodd> nope
08:43 <GodTodd> made that up right now
08:43 <@luke-jr_> >.>
08:43 <GodTodd> i want a cut if you use it
08:43 <@luke-jr_> and you say it's lame...
08:43 <GodTodd> :P
08:43 <@luke-jr_> XD
08:44 <Lucifer_arma> it is lame, but it's exactly the kind of thing that'll get someone to click a link and read the 5 pages you wrote describing your value offering in detail
08:44 <GodTodd> exactly
08:44 <GodTodd> the point of it is to get the chuckle and humanize the whole thing
08:44 <Lucifer_arma> and then, if you've done your work really well and you have a good service, then, maybe, if you're lucky, 20% of the people who made it that far will buy it
08:44 <Lucifer_arma> that's what you're up against
08:44 <@luke-jr_> couldn't use it without actually having a staff tho, I'd think
08:44 <GodTodd> why?
08:45 <Lucifer_arma> are you a geek?  are you going to assign yourself to your customers?
08:45 <GodTodd> it can be the "royal we"
08:45 <@luke-jr_> eh, it sortof implies a dedicated geek
08:45 <GodTodd> nah
08:45 <Lucifer_arma> are you a dedicated geek?
08:45 <@luke-jr_> ...
08:45 <Lucifer_arma> you're not a part-time geek, are you?
08:45 <GodTodd> you don't say "we'll give you your own geek"
08:45 <Lucifer_arma> no, what it implies is that when they need help or there's trouble, you will be there to help them
08:45 <GodTodd> it says "a geek will maintain your shit"
08:45 <@luke-jr_> heh
08:46 <Lucifer_arma> it implies that you won't ignore their problems, no matter how petty
08:46 <GodTodd> exactly
08:46 <Lucifer_arma> it makes you feel good :)
08:46 <@luke-jr_> what if I want to ignore petty problems? :p
08:46 <GodTodd> which is a value *dingdingding* over a conglomerate.
08:46 <Lucifer_arma> then you should consider working in a large tech support department instead
08:47 <@luke-jr_> hum
08:47 <@luke-jr_> what makes a problem 'petty' anyhow?
08:47  * GodTodd thinks he and Lucifer_arma should be business consultants.
08:47 <GodTodd> heh
08:47 <Lucifer_arma> nothing, nothing at all.  A customers problems are real.
08:47 <@luke-jr_> so why can't I ignore a null array?
08:47 <Lucifer_arma> even if it takes you 10 seconds to fix the problem and you *know* they could have done it yourself.
08:48 -!- Vanhayes [i=Vanhayes@stjhnbsu83w-156034243013.nb.aliant.net] has quit [Connection timed out]
08:48  * Lucifer_arma thinks if luke ever listens to him and GodTodd, and is successful, then luke should pay us $millions.
08:48 <GodTodd> thing is....you can charge *more* if you have a way to guarantee uptime.
08:48 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: what kind of a cut were you thinking?
08:48 <GodTodd> negotiable ;)
08:48 <Your_mom_arma> 1 900 tech support
08:48 <Lucifer_arma> indeed, you can charge more if you offer better personal service
08:48 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: successful is $millions?
08:49 <Lucifer_arma> or stock options :)
08:49 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: to guarantee uptime would require owning the datacenter more or less
08:49 <GodTodd> not necessarily
08:49 -!- zmanuel [n=manuel@p50872E6B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Connection reset by peer]
08:49 <@luke-jr_> unless you can "pass on" an upstream guarantee
08:49 <Lucifer_arma> not at all, you have to depend on the datacenter, obviously
08:49 <GodTodd> exactly
08:49 <GodTodd> you're getting it :)
08:49 <Lucifer_arma> but if you mirror them enough on several datacenters so you can switch out from one to the other...
08:49 <GodTodd> yep
08:50 <@luke-jr_> not without interruptions
08:50 <Lucifer_arma> or if you keep yourself in a spot where you can quickly restore them on another server
08:50 <GodTodd> that's why you do 9X% uptime
08:50 <Lucifer_arma> no, not without interruptions, but it's perception that matters
08:50 <GodTodd> no one guarantees 100%
08:50 <@luke-jr_> GodTodd: yes they do
08:50 <Lucifer_arma> no, but you do need to guarantee a lot of 9s for the service to be reliable
08:50 <Lucifer_arma> er
08:50 <@luke-jr_> I've seen it
08:50 <Lucifer_arma> competitive
08:50 <Lucifer_arma> then they weren't expecting you to believe it
08:51 <@luke-jr_> VPS's aren't mirrorable either
08:51 <GodTodd> like earthlink....if you have a business dsl account they guarantee something like 98 or 99% uptime
08:51 <Lucifer_arma> they cant guarantee 100% uptime becuase they have to periodically do maintenance and crap, replace parts and stuff, and it's nearly impossible to do all that without causing downtime for someone
08:51 <GodTodd> but it's like twice as much
08:51 <@luke-jr_> actually, it was physical dedicated servers that had the 100%
08:51 <Lucifer_arma> ah
08:51 <Lucifer_arma> then they know damn well you'll never be able to do it because you'll break it yourself plenty of times )
08:51 <Lucifer_arma> :)
08:52 <@luke-jr_> hmm
08:52 <@luke-jr_> even if you just leave it running a ping? :)
08:52 -!- Your_mom_arma [n=Your_mom@pool-151-204-204-25.pskn.east.verizon.net] has quit ["cya"]
08:52 <GodTodd> you also need to think about (since it's online shit) a TOS of some sort
08:52 <@luke-jr_> http://lightfoot.dashjr.org/?page=svcterms
08:52 <Lucifer_arma> which says something like "we do <this> for you, and you do <this> for us"
08:52 <Lucifer_arma> where your <this> is a VALUE OFFERING
08:53 <Lucifer_arma> http://www.corporateassociates.co.in/value-offering.html
08:53 <Lucifer_arma> there you go, there's someone else's value offering
08:54 <Lucifer_arma> it's a little hard to read, it's a bunch of corporatespeak
08:55 <Lucifer_arma> We have spent a great deal of time ensuring a strong value offering and a 'real' solution set - the implementation, although challenging, has been beneficial to both the customer and Affinity.  <--- from an interview I found
08:55 <@luke-jr_> http://quantact.com/ <-- value offering is top, bottom, or both?
08:55 <Lucifer_arma> bottom
08:55 <Lucifer_arma> top is features
08:56 <Lucifer_arma> in fact, you can generate the bottom from the top pretty simply
08:56 <Lucifer_arma> make a chart
08:56 <Lucifer_arma> in the left column, list features
08:56 <Lucifer_arma> in the middle column, define the feature
08:56 <Lucifer_arma> in the right column, write a sentence or two describing how it's a benefit to the customer
08:56 <Lucifer_arma> when you're done with all of your features, take the right column and write it into an essay
08:56 <Lucifer_arma> then read it back to yourself
08:57 <@luke-jr_> ...
08:57 <@luke-jr_> who would read an essay to decide on services to buy?
08:57 <Lucifer_arma> the whole entire world
08:57 <GodTodd> in fact...i've often thought of starting a business....but i can't think of anything i can fit into a viable value statement so i know it'll fail ;)
08:57 <Lucifer_arma> but that's irrelevant, the essay is for you, not your customers
08:57  * luke-jr_ wouldn't
08:57 <@luke-jr_> I just skim the datacenter specs, making sure it suits my needs etc
08:58 <Lucifer_arma> when it's time to write actual sales copy, you follow a similar process, but the end result is different by design
08:58 <GodTodd> it goes back to the "you need to know what you offer before you offer it"
08:58 <Lucifer_arma> because you have to accomodate people who skim :)
08:58 <Lucifer_arma> you also have to accomodate people who want to read 10k words before deciding
08:58 <GodTodd> yep
08:58 <Lucifer_arma> in any case, the essay I've just assigned as your homework is for you to read and understand.
08:59 <@luke-jr_> do I need to write it? XD
08:59 <@luke-jr_> or can I make Corinne?
08:59 <GodTodd> shit...some people do it as a simple FAQ
08:59 <Lucifer_arma> and you have to do the process, the process is very important
08:59 <Lucifer_arma> if you want to make corinne do it, I'd suggest you do the table at least
09:00 <GodTodd> anyone seen those "Dogbones" pillows in stores?
09:01 <@luke-jr_> think it would work to have the service be "whatever is necessary to fit your hosting requirements" with the first month free while the pricing is evaluated? :o
09:01 <Lucifer_arma> no, you'll lose too much money that way
09:01 <@luke-jr_> hm
09:01 <GodTodd> if you have a lot of money to lose, sure
09:01 <@luke-jr_> difficult to evaluate arbitrary services
09:02 <Lucifer_arma> you want to spell out explicitly what you'll do, and then when you do things outside the list, people will love you for it
09:02 <@luke-jr_> without actually running them
09:02 <GodTodd> that's why you make it solid but "negotiable"
09:02 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, but they'll pay for the evaluation
09:02 <Lucifer_arma> when a business is serious about it, you have to consider that they're already paying 2-3 guys $80k/year to evaluate the service
09:03 <Lucifer_arma> what does it matter if they toss $2k onto the pile to evaluate your service for a few months?
09:03 <GodTodd> "can you do this too?" "Sure can! that's a free service but that other thing will cost extra, i'm afraid"
09:03 <@luke-jr_> you're assuming I'm selling to businesses
09:03 <Lucifer_arma> selling to businesses is easy, compared to selling to regular people :)
09:04 <Lucifer_arma> well, if you're not selling to business, you have to work even harder to justify your value offering
09:04 <@luke-jr_> not when the businesses have enough $ to replace me entirely
09:04 <GodTodd> luke-jr_: mine doesn't assume any such thing :P
09:04 <Lucifer_arma> because the services most people are looking for can be provided on myspace :/
09:04 <@luke-jr_> Lucifer_arma: what if I create hype about having your own IM service? XD
09:04 <Lucifer_arma> you'll be suprised how big a business can be before they take all their IT into their own offices
09:05 <@luke-jr_> nah, MSN emulates that too much :/
09:05 <Lucifer_arma> but it doesn't matter, you sell to who you want to sell to.  The important thing is that third column, where you describe why your feature is a benefit to your customer
09:05 <@luke-jr_> company I work for is about 16 people and we do our own IT mostly
09:05 <GodTodd> see...you have to be unique or clever.....really helps if you're both :D
09:05 <Lucifer_arma> and to fill in that third column, you have to put yourself in the shoes of your customer
09:06 <Lucifer_arma> hey GodTodd (hi there!) , you want to sell software?  :)
09:06 <GodTodd> hrmm?
09:06 <Lucifer_arma> I still need to make the initial distribution...
09:06 <Lucifer_arma> I've still got that guy in oz that's talking it over with his partners
09:06  * luke-jr_ needs to get to bed >_<
09:06 <@luke-jr_> zzzzzzz
09:06  * luke-jr_ 2 hrs overdue
09:06 <Lucifer_arma> ok, but as soon as that essay is done, I want to see it and the table :)
09:07 <Lucifer_arma> and don't forget to take op from yourself
09:07 <GodTodd> we'll whip this business into shape yet ;)
09:07 -!- mode/#armagetron [-o luke-jr_] by luke-jr_
09:08 <GodTodd> what software? just audacity or do you have an in to a bunch of stuff? ;)
09:09 <Lucifer_arma> built around audacity, any software that would be intensify the value offering is ok :)
09:09 <Lucifer_arma> all software has to be open source, of course
09:10 <GodTodd> so pretty much you're offering an "easily installable source disk for a valuable piece of software"?
09:10 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, does most of what your average band on a budget needs to record an album, for a price they can afford
09:11 <Lucifer_arma> basically, any working band should be able to record CDs with it, period
09:11 <Lucifer_arma> unsigned, probably all have day jobs and are doing the band as a labor of love
09:12 <GodTodd> if you download it do you have to put components together on it?
09:12 <Lucifer_arma> don't have the $30k to spend in a recording studio, do have $700 computers
09:12 <Lucifer_arma> well, we have to add stuff to make it worth buying over just downloading audacity for free :)
09:12 <GodTodd> exactly what i'm after :)
09:13 <Lucifer_arma> we also have to give up a portion of profits to support audacity directly
09:13 <GodTodd> definitely
09:13 <GodTodd> they'd be a "partner"
09:14 <Lucifer_arma> right.  :)
09:14 <GodTodd> without their program, no cd :)
09:14 <Lucifer_arma> try explaining that to the people who have taken it, changed the name, and tried to pass it off as their own
09:14  * GodTodd wouldn't want to converse with those people.
09:14 <Lucifer_arma> we have to go to ebay and try to sell it there, but we don't have to expect to make any money at it
09:14 <Lucifer_arma> we'll be doing it to attack the people I just mentioned :)
09:15 <GodTodd> haha
09:15 <GodTodd> "don't accept imitations!  the real deal for a better price!"
09:15 <Lucifer_arma> indeed.  Even link the imitations we know about to show them :)
09:15 <GodTodd> yep
09:16 <Lucifer_arma> I figure we'll cafepress to regular consumers, and then try to hit up OEM sales somehow
09:16 <Lucifer_arma> start with small shops and move on up
09:16 <GodTodd> that's probably the most prudent way to go
09:16 <Lucifer_arma> get it to where the business is worth a million or so, then sell it, take the money and run :)
09:16 <GodTodd> how many copies is the aussie considering?
09:17 <Lucifer_arma> 500-1000 is his first batch size discussed
09:17  * GodTodd isn't counting chickens....but that's not a bad starting point.
09:18 <Lucifer_arma> no, it's not bad at all.  Also, we'll be developing a base cd distribution that the audacity project will be selling directly from their own store
09:18 <Lucifer_arma> THAT cd needs some value-add to it, and we need to value-add on top of it.
09:18 <GodTodd> they will?
09:18 <Lucifer_arma> seriously, we've got our work cut out for us, but it's the right way to do it
09:19 <GodTodd> well you figure...people buy shit from the people they think they're "screwing" the most
09:19 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, see, I'll develop the automation scripts required to build the CD, and I'll use them to build audacity's CD
09:19 <GodTodd> ah
09:19 <Lucifer_arma> then I'll add our own stuff on top of it and we go try to sell it :)
09:19 <Lucifer_arma> we'll maintain audacity's for them as part of our contribution to them, and in exchange we get a ton of goodwill, which means bugfixes!
09:19 <GodTodd> right
09:20 <Lucifer_arma> make no mistake, we will be paying them for their time, even if we don't make any money for awhile :)
09:20 <GodTodd> and the better the relationship the better *our* cd is over any other
09:20 <GodTodd> more value
09:21 <Lucifer_arma> right
09:21 <GodTodd> kinda like "buy at wholesale cost" is a misnomer....some people's "wholesale cost" is way below others
09:21 <Lucifer_arma> so, if you want to do this with me, we have to do everything we just told luke to do
09:21 <GodTodd> yep
09:22 <Lucifer_arma> and then split up the work somehow.  If the aussie guy actually orders, I can probably get my wife to jump on sales here in austin
09:22 <GodTodd> which, for me at least, means also familiarizing myself with the product
09:22 <Lucifer_arma> well, you did say you'd have time to play your guitar over spring break :)
09:22 <GodTodd> hopefully ;)
09:23 <Lucifer_arma> you can also go to /home/share/music on my server and get some tracks to play with
09:23 <GodTodd> i think i downloaded it not too long ago
09:23 <Lucifer_arma> those will take awhile to download, you'll just have to put the time into it if you haven't already
09:23 <Lucifer_arma> they're around 40MB each
09:23 <GodTodd> the oggs or the mp3s?
09:23 <Lucifer_arma> but you can grab a drum line and its corresponding bass and guitar lines
09:23 <Lucifer_arma> .wav files
09:23 <GodTodd> ahhh
09:24 <Lucifer_arma> gridownsme is pretty small
09:24 <Lucifer_arma> grab the waves and import them into audacity to fool with :)
09:24 <GodTodd> that's helpful :)
09:24 <Lucifer_arma> hmmm
09:25 <Lucifer_arma> it looks like there's no guitar for it
09:25 <Lucifer_arma> ok, better pick
09:25 <GodTodd> what about the smegforbrains stuff?
09:25 <Lucifer_arma>  /home/share/music/armagetron/opening_track
09:25 <Lucifer_arma> I can't guarantee there are any individual tracks left for smegforbrains
09:26 <Lucifer_arma> I've got mixes I'm intending to encode and put up on the website, burn off a CD and send to cafepress
09:26 <Lucifer_arma> I've been procrastinating that for sooo long
09:26 <Lucifer_arma> I should just fucking do it, right now!
09:26 <GodTodd> heh
09:26 <Lucifer_arma> I'm as dressed up as I'm going to get, I just need a photo
09:26 <Lucifer_arma> got my scanner working, I can draw up the cover
09:27 <GodTodd> heh
09:27 <Lucifer_arma> I just pissed off my 3yo.  He walked up to the edge of the couch like he always does and waited for me to tell him to go lay with his mom
09:27 <Lucifer_arma> instead of that, though, I just sent him back to his bed
09:31 <GodTodd> haha
09:31 <GodTodd> so...audacity is essentially a poor man's studio mixer or something?
09:32 <Lucifer_arma> pretty much
09:32 <Lucifer_arma> it's actually quite full-featured, and growing of course
09:32 <GodTodd> ok...that's good value from the product itself then
09:32 <GodTodd> :)
09:32 <Lucifer_arma> it does some things that makes it better than the commercial proprietary offerings
09:32 <Lucifer_arma> oh yeah, it's a wonderful program.  I do all of my mixing with it
09:33 <Lucifer_arma> I do my initial recording with ecasound, though.  But after that's done, I do the rest in audacity.
09:33 <GodTodd> what kind of equipment (if any) do you need to utilize audacity?
09:33 <Lucifer_arma> you can do recording in it, I just find it easier/faster to use ecasound from the commandline
09:33 <Lucifer_arma> just a sound card
09:33 <GodTodd> k
09:34 <Lucifer_arma> you can literally record a song and engineer it to the same level of quality as anything recorded in 1993 using a $300 computer you bought at wal-mart
09:34 <GodTodd> nice :)
09:34 <Lucifer_arma> the problem, though, is how do we get all the independent bands out there to know about it without having to go to each one individually to make the sale?
09:35 <Lucifer_arma> the answer is that we need to get on the shelves of fry's :)
09:35 <GodTodd> right
09:36 <GodTodd> possibly music stores too
09:36 <Lucifer_arma> guitarcenter
09:36 <GodTodd> yep
09:36 <Lucifer_arma> probably want to hit up any mom and pop's still alive
09:36 <GodTodd> definitely
09:36 <GodTodd> pretty much...any place that "part time" musicians go
09:37 <GodTodd> the more people that use it and like it, the more word of mouth helps
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09:56 <Lucifer_arma> mkdir distributo
09:56 <Lucifer_arma> er, oops
09:57 <hang3r> lol, sloppy focus lucifer?
09:58 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, it happens sometimes
09:58 <Lucifer_arma> good thing though, that would have been a typo
09:59 <hang3r> I'm waiting for the day someone gets caught with their pants down doing an "rm -rf .pron"
09:59 <Lucifer_arma> heh
10:00 <Lucifer_arma> I have a quickly-expiring cache so I don't have to worry about it
10:00 <Lucifer_arma> I did start up a movie one time with my speakers accidentally cranked
10:00 <Lucifer_arma> but my kids didn't think horse noises were unusual :P
10:01  * Lucifer_arma wants some music now
10:01 <spidey> luke-jr_, don't involve me in your crap :|
10:01 <Lucifer_arma> what did he do this time?
10:01 <spidey> something about vps hosting
10:02 <spidey> dunno i got a pop up
10:02 <Lucifer_arma> ?  what did that have to do with you?
10:02 <Lucifer_arma> probably just one of our sidelong cheapshots at you :)
10:03 <hang3r> Lucifer_arma, Horse noises? So you're into the good stuff then... :X
10:03 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, no
10:03 <spidey> #last --with spidey --nolimit
10:03 <armabot> spidey: [08:42:30] <luke-jr_> so what if spidey and I get together and offer VPS hosting with managed services for a wide array of services?, [08:06:23] <Lucifer_arma> I don't know if you did that, ghableska may have done it to fuck with luke, or spidey.  All's I know for sure is I didn't.  :), [08:02:21] <luke-jr_> spidey: is it?, [08:01:05] <Lucifer_arma> if it were spidey, well..., [07:53:19] (9 more messages)
10:04  * Lucifer_arma can't see luke partnering with a known heathen for a business venture
10:04 <hang3r> lol
10:04 <spidey> huh?
10:05 <Lucifer_arma> you know, I only get writer's block when I start a new program
10:05 <Lucifer_arma> what do I do first?
10:05 <spidey> pwned :D
10:05 <spidey> rm -rf /
10:05 <spidey> :D
10:06 <Lucifer_arma> ssh hachi.dashjr.org - rm -rf /
10:06 <Lucifer_arma> oops, wrong window again
10:06 <spidey> haha
10:06 <hang3r> Lucifer_arma, just start on a library that it needs, or at least a function 
10:06 <Lucifer_arma> I always wind up rewriting when I do that :(
10:06 <Lucifer_arma> maybe I should just bite the bullet and do the inevitable rewrite?
10:07 <Lucifer_arma> but that's work!  That's force times distance!
10:07 <hang3r> why rewrite, just improve what you have, unless of course a rewrite is needed
10:07 <Lucifer_arma> heh
10:07 <Lucifer_arma> you should see how much time I waste tweaking function parameters :)
10:07 <Lucifer_arma> "Er, I don't like the name of that parameter"
10:07 <Lucifer_arma> "Now I want to use keyword arguments"
10:08 <Lucifer_arma> "Nah, keyword arguments suck, I want to go back"
10:08 <hang3r> lolGotMilkFromCow()
10:08 <Lucifer_arma> I think I need a metal playlist, that's my problem
10:09 <Lucifer_arma> ahhhhhhhh
10:10 <spidey> rock man, rock!
10:10 <Lucifer_arma> oh yeah, I wanted to take the input from a file and just pass a filename on the commandline
10:10 <Lucifer_arma> (nothing clears my mind like good metal)
10:10 <spidey> rock < metal
10:11 <spidey> alligator mouth eats loser
10:11 <Lucifer_arma> right on!
10:11 <spidey> :D
10:11 <Lucifer_arma> er, no!
10:11 <spidey> lmao
10:11  * Lucifer_arma ============D   >spidey
10:12  * Lucifer_arma ============D  >spidey
10:12  * Lucifer_arma ============D >spidey
10:12  * Lucifer_arma ============D>spidey
10:12 <spidey> ===============|-)~~~~ Lucifer_arma 
10:12 <spidey> OO
10:12  * Lucifer_arma =>spidey====D
10:12  * Lucifer_arma =>spidey====D    >hang3r
10:13 <Lucifer_arma> hey, why did my dick get shorter after I impaled spidey with it?
10:13 <spidey> old age
10:13  * Lucifer_arma =>spidey========D>hang3r
10:13  * Lucifer_arma =>spidey>hang3r==============D
10:13 <Lucifer_arma> there, just like worms
10:13 <spidey> shrivvels up over time
10:13 <spidey> :D
10:13 <Lucifer_arma> it gets bigger every time it eats something
10:14 <spidey> maybe i'll start stabbing from the inside
10:14 <spidey> :O
10:14 <Lucifer_arma> you know, this is beautiful and meaningful irc artwork, but I *am* trying to write a program
10:14 <spidey> #kill Lucifer_arma 
10:14 <armabot> Lucifer_arma will die on Thu Mar  5 02:56:53 1987 due to being stabbed in the eye by luke-jr_.
10:14 <spidey> hah
10:14 <Lucifer_arma> wow, he got me before he was born
10:15 <spidey> lol
10:15 <Lucifer_arma> ok, so I need to read the file to get a list of files I want to encode
10:16 <Lucifer_arma> I guess I'll pass in the encoding formats on the commandline
10:16 <Lucifer_arma> ah fuck it, I'll just start coding
10:17 <hang3r> my syntax.
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10:17 <spidey> O.o
10:17 -!- hang3r_ is now known as hang3r
10:18  * spidey wish nohup didn't overwrite nohup.out
10:18 <hang3r> !ping
10:18 <spidey> then i wouldn't need logs :(
10:18 <spidey> #ping
10:18 <armabot> pong
10:18 <hang3r> #ping
10:18 <armabot> pong
10:18 <Lucifer_arma> er
10:18 <Lucifer_arma> I think nohup.out is just garbage anyway
10:18 <spidey> it's a console log
10:19 <spidey> and i'll be needing it since i can't figure out how to make startserver do it
10:19 <Lucifer_arma> sudo /etc/init.d/armagetronad-dedicated start
10:19 <spidey> ?
10:20 <Lucifer_arma> this is where I got hung up last time
10:20 <Lucifer_arma> I think I'll just hardcode it, that'll fix it for me :)
10:22 <Lucifer_arma> oh yeah
10:22 <Lucifer_arma> now I remember what's supposed to be in the file
10:26 <hang3r> wow shrunkland is just full of rim riders
10:27  * hang3r misses oscilloscope and fonkey, supertard and etc
10:27  * spidey doesn't miss oscilloscope
10:30 <spidey> i've been doing other stuff and forgot my local server was offline >.<
10:30  * spidey will only have dsl for a few months :(
10:30 <spidey> there's a gas leak so we ran out of gas earlier than we where supposed to...so had to disconnect the cable :(
10:32 <hang3r> buy a wireless card and see if there are any access points in your area (I.E. small businesses, neighbors etc)
10:32  * spidey lives in the woods :D
10:36 <xfroggy> I think animals use wifi nowdays also
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10:51 <Lucifer_arma> not in tennessee, those animals are hick animals
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10:53  * spidey throws hang3r at Lucifer_arma 
10:53 <spidey> :O
10:54  * Lucifer_arma catches hang3r and throws him back
10:54 <spidey> cheater
10:55 <hang3r> shh, im trying to fix xchat events to my liking
10:55  * spidey pokes hang3r 
10:55 <spidey> :D
10:56 <spidey> shit
10:56 <spidey> gotta get up in 2 hours, lost track of time, bbl1
10:56 <Lucifer_arma> whatcha doing, hang3r (hi there!) ?
10:57 <hang3r> im trying to get rid of the horizontal tab that separates the time from the actual text
10:57 <hang3r> err vertical rather
10:59 <Lucifer_arma> Uptime: 3 days, 14 hours and 7 minutes
10:59 <hang3r> hang3r@Prometheus:~$ uptime
10:59 <hang3r>  20:59:46 up  4:39,  2 users,  load average: 0.20, 0.25, 0.27
11:01 <Lucifer_arma> that's not a bad uptime for a laptop, though :)
11:01 <Lucifer_arma> at least, when it can't hibernate properly :(
11:01 <Lucifer_arma> now, what format do I want for the input file?
11:01 <Lucifer_arma> I hate coming up with file formats :/
11:02 <Lucifer_arma> I know, I'll just make it a python file!  :)
11:03  * Lucifer_arma wonders if it would be more useful to make Drupal encode on the fly for the first download and cache the result for subsequent downloads
11:09 <hang3r> can someone type a message with my nickname in it please
11:12 <spidey> gay
11:12 <spidey> can't sleep :(
11:13  * spidey does something useful, like finish his math he has to test on today
11:13 <hang3r> #whois
11:13 <spidey> o.O
11:13 <hang3r> #whoareyou hang3r
11:13 <armabot> hang3r: I am your woman.
11:20 <Lucifer_arma> hang3r: hang3r (hi there!) hang3r (hi there!) 
11:20 <Lucifer_arma> ok, I give up
11:20 <Lucifer_arma> I'm now too sleepy to think straight
11:20  * Lucifer_arma recalls this happened the last time he tried to write this program
11:23 <spidey> what program?
11:26 <Lucifer_arma> the one I tried to coerce you into writing :)
11:26 <spidey> what's that?
11:26 <Lucifer_arma> take a list of sound files with artist/title/album/track and output a series of ogg/mp3 files of varying quality
11:27 <Lucifer_arma> basically, start with say 5 tracks and wind up writing 30 files, 15 oggs of low/medium/high quality and 15 mp3s of same
11:27 <Lucifer_arma> it's a lot of work to do by hand
11:28 <Lucifer_arma> of course, if I just did it by hand, it would already be done, instead of waiting for this program to materialize out of thin air, as it were
11:28 <spidey> man
11:28 <spidey> i tell ya what
11:29 <spidey> tomorrow after i finish the control panel i'ma make for the gameservers we run, i'll make it :D
11:29 <spidey> if the pot lasts that long, and you don't mind php xD
11:29 <Lucifer_arma> I don't mind php, but it needs to run from a terminal :)
11:29 <Lucifer_arma> hell, at this point I'd even take it in perl
11:29  * spidey don't know perl
11:29 <spidey> i heard it's alot like php
11:29 <spidey> but i never really read anything O.o
11:30 <Lucifer_arma> oggenc is the command to encode to ogg vorbis, and lamenc is the mp3 one, I believe.  I don't actually have lame installed, so it's not a big deal
11:30 <Lucifer_arma> perl is annoying, that's all.  Basically, either you like perl or you like python, most programmers can be split on that line
11:30 <Lucifer_arma> at least, that's been my experience ;)
11:31 <spidey> i wanna start reading a python :D
11:31 <spidey> almost finished with my php books to :O
11:32 <Lucifer_arma> python's fun, no doubt about that.  :)
11:32 <Lucifer_arma> actually, I don't relaly like php, but I don't hate it either.  I'll use it when it's the appropriate language, or if the program I'm using was written in it
11:32 <Lucifer_arma> these days python is my default language
11:32 <Lucifer_arma> except, I think I'm a start a c++ project
11:32 <Lucifer_arma> ah oh, my 3yo just hurt himself
11:33 <spidey> O.o
11:33 <spidey> dude
11:33 <spidey> i couldn't sleep so i decided to finish my math books
11:33 <spidey> all i did was wrote my name on them and put 'em on the floor
11:33 <spidey> :/
11:37 <Lucifer_arma> haha
11:39 <spidey> update: selftest 1 half done
11:39 <spidey> :O
11:39 <spidey> when i figured out i could use a calculator on this it got easier :O
11:39 <spidey> they got me on college path when i asked for the one for dumb peopl
11:39 <spidey> e:/
12:12 -!- hang3r [n=hang3r@124-168-236-35.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
12:49 -!- madmax|pt [n=madmax@unaffiliated/madmaxpt/x-23911] has quit ["leaving"]
15:33 -!- [dlh] [n=[dlh]@c-76-19-206-67.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #armagetron
16:11 -!- luke-jr|work [n=luke-jr@adsl-76-194-177-181.dsl.ksc2mo.sbcglobal.net] has joined #armagetron
16:21 -!- MaZuffeR [n=MaZuffeR@darkmoor.sby.abo.fi] has joined #armagetron
17:40 -!- MaZuffeR [n=MaZuffeR@darkmoor.sby.abo.fi] has quit ["Leaving."]
18:03 -!- Hellsing [n=5b60d1ae@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has joined #armagetron
18:04 <Hellsing> ???
18:04 <Hellsing> hell(o)?
18:04 <Hellsing> jemand da?
18:04 <Hellsing> lol
18:05 <Hellsing> ???
18:05 -!- Hellsing [n=5b60d1ae@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has quit [Client Quit]
18:06 -!- Hellsing [n=5b60d1ae@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has joined #armagetron
18:10 <Hellsing> anyone speak german?
18:11 <Hellsing> i have a problem
18:11 <Hellsing> i wanna host my server map
18:12  * z-man-work is listening
18:13 <Hellsing> :'(
18:13 <Hellsing> nobody helps me
18:13 <z-man-work> you're not done stating your problem :)
18:14 <Hellsing> u can help me?
18:14 <z-man-work> Probably. Depends on the problem.
18:15 <Hellsing> i have built a map for Armagetron. 
18:15 <Hellsing> and I wanna offer this map to the others
18:16 <z-man-work> The easiest way is to use our resource repository: http://beta.armagetronad.net/addmaps.php
18:17 <Hellsing> i must buy anything?
18:17 <z-man-work> no.
18:18 <Hellsing> how i make it?
18:18 <z-man-work> You have to register with Luke. He requires some form of authentication. You're not registered at forums.armagetronad.net, right?
18:18 <z-man-work> Only on the nixda forums?
18:18 <Hellsing> right
18:18 <Hellsing> jea
18:19 <luke-jr|work> basically, you need to convince me that the author name you want to use is actually your name in some way
18:19 <z-man-work> Hmm, no big problem. I'm registered on nixda (as plain z-man), you can send the authentication message to me, I'll forward it.
18:19 <luke-jr|work> yeah, that would work
18:20 <Hellsing> i wanna use "hellsing"
18:20 <luke-jr|work> all lowercase?
18:21 <Hellsing> sry, i speak german
18:21 <Hellsing> :(
18:21 <luke-jr|work> O.o
18:21 <Hellsing> lowercase?
18:21 <luke-jr|work> "hellsing", not "Hellsing"
18:21 <luke-jr|work> or not "HellSing"
18:21 <Hellsing> Hellsing
18:22 <Hellsing> :)
18:22 <luke-jr|work> ok :)
18:22 <luke-jr|work> just send z-man-work a PM on the nixda forums to prove that's your name
18:22 <Hellsing> big roblem!!!!!!!!!!!!
18:22 <luke-jr|work> and stick around here, so I can send you your password
18:22 <luke-jr|work> ?
18:22 <Hellsing> i must eat!
18:22 <luke-jr|work> O.o
18:22 <Hellsing> and shut down the PC
18:22 <z-man-work> hehe, then come back later.
18:22 <Hellsing> ok
18:23 <Hellsing> tomorrow?
18:23 <Hellsing> :)
18:23 <Hellsing> bye
18:23 <z-man-work> we won't go away :)
18:23 <Hellsing> thas good to here
18:23 <Hellsing> hear
18:23 <Hellsing> bye
18:23 <luke-jr|work> :)
18:23 -!- Hellsing [n=5b60d1ae@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has quit ["CGI:IRC"]
18:33 -!- GodTodd_ [n=GodTodd@cpe-72-190-92-193.tx.res.rr.com] has joined #armagetron
18:34 -!- GodTodd [n=GodTodd@cpe-72-190-92-193.tx.res.rr.com] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
18:35 -!- GodTodd [n=GodTodd@cpe-72-190-92-193.tx.res.rr.com] has joined #armagetron
18:35 <armabot> DrJoeTron is GodTodd's bitch.
18:35 -!- epsy [n=epsy@mar75-4-82-227-65-72.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #armagetron
18:36 <epsy> hi
18:36 -!- GodTodd_ [n=GodTodd@cpe-72-190-92-193.tx.res.rr.com] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
18:36 -!- GodTodd_ [n=GodTodd@cpe-72-190-92-193.tx.res.rr.com] has joined #armagetron
18:37 -!- GodTodd_ [n=GodTodd@cpe-72-190-92-193.tx.res.rr.com] has quit [Client Quit]
18:44 -!- Lackadaisical [n=lack@ip202-29-210-87.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #armagetron
19:03 -!- Lucifer_arma [n=satan@ppp-70-251-188-3.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
19:33 -!- MaZuffeR [n=MaZuffeR@darkmoor.sby.abo.fi] has joined #armagetron
20:53 <mkzelda> "People who bother me" - N_GGERS
20:56 <[dlh]> … naggers
20:56 <luke-jr|work> [dlh]: you beat me to it
20:56 <luke-jr|work> :(
20:56 <luke-jr|work> I was waiting for someone to answer wrong
20:57 <[dlh]> it is a southpark episode.
20:57 <mkzelda> that was great
21:08 -!- DrJoeTron [n=DrJoeTro@adsl-76-215-1-196.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net] has joined #Armagetron
21:26  * epsy now eats
21:32 -!- DIGITX [n=DIGITX@] has joined #ARMAGETRON
21:33 <DIGITX> MObile
21:33 <DIGITX> LOL
21:33 <DIGITX> NA CU
21:33 -!- DIGITX [n=DIGITX@] has quit [Client Quit]
21:51 <epsy> back
22:08 -!- _Sticky_ [n=kvirc@80-41-82-143.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #armagetron
22:10 <luke-jr|work> ...
22:26 -!- Lucifer_arma [n=satan@ppp-70-251-188-3.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #armagetron
22:32 -!- Lucifer_arma [n=satan@ppp-70-251-188-3.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
22:34 -!- [RC]coconutz [n=55dc25a2@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has joined #armagetron
22:34 -!- [RC]coconutz [n=55dc25a2@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has quit [Client Quit]
22:38 -!- ghableska [n=ghablesk@12-216-182-238.client.mchsi.com] has joined #Armagetron
22:39 <epsy> luke-jr|work, … ?
22:39 <luke-jr|work> ...
22:39 <epsy> …
22:39 <luke-jr|work> you got carfax?
22:39 <epsy> what's that ?
22:39 <GodTodd> getting a new car?
22:40 <epsy> getting a new fax ?
22:40 <ghableska> #weather 50266
22:40 <armabot> ghableska: The current temperature in West Des Moines, Iowa is 40.5°F (3:37 PM CST on March 09, 2007). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 73%. Dew Point: 32.0°F. Windchill: 35.6°F. Pressure: 28.96 in 980.6 hPa (Rising). 
22:40 <luke-jr|work> GodTodd: yes
22:40 <GodTodd> carfax == report on past ownership/condition of used cars
22:40  * ghableska hates driving
22:40 <GodTodd> did you get the other one checked out?
22:40  * epsy drives lightcycles only
22:42 <luke-jr|work> GodTodd: not yet
22:43 <luke-jr|work> oh, the old one
22:43 <luke-jr|work> yeah
22:43 <GodTodd> what'd they say it was?
22:44 <luke-jr|work> gasket exploded or something
22:44 <luke-jr|work> oil and antifreeze mixing etc
22:44 <GodTodd> ahhh ewww :/
22:46 -!- Lucifer_arma [n=satan@ppp-70-251-188-3.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #armagetron
22:46 <ghableska> o_O
22:49 <ghableska> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/6434471.stm <-- "We want you to feel loved. You can have sex and you can have a baby.  
22:49 <ghableska> "That baby will grow up and will kind of look like you."
22:51 <GodTodd> so basically....not enough chicks and emo dudes are gaming?
22:51 <ghableska> heh
22:53 <Lucifer_arma> there's a part of me that wishes skullflame had never activated our emo prejudices around here
22:53 <ghableska> skullflame?
22:53 <ghableska> was he the one with the pregnant girlfriend?
22:53 <Lucifer_arma> yeah, that's him
22:53 <Lucifer_arma> he's the emo kid that set us all off
22:53 <ghableska> heh
22:54 <_Sticky_> #serverinfo cafe
22:54 <armabot> _Sticky_: Fortress Café: Players (8/32): gea, Kamakazi, MaZuffeR, Monkey, Ossi, pavelo, safariskater, ~luAp~
22:54 <_Sticky_> oooh
22:55 <Lucifer_arma> damn, my kid really fucked up my keyboard
22:55 <Lucifer_arma> I may need a new one now
22:55 <ghableska> :o
22:55 <GodTodd> tommy used to hide my wireless mouse and pull the keys off my wireless keyboard
22:57 <epsy> armabot, serverinfo classic play
22:57 <epsy> armabot: serverinfo classic play
22:57 <armabot> epsy: Tigers Network Classic Play: Players (1/16): KNULLGUBBE
22:57 <armabot> epsy: Tigers Network Classic Play: Players (1/16): KNULLGUBBE
22:57 <epsy> heh
22:57 <Lucifer_arma> ok, I got the 6 back on
22:57 <Lucifer_arma> now for left-alt
22:57 <Lucifer_arma> Im having to steal parts from right-control and that stupid popup menu key
22:59 <Lucifer_arma> ok, left-alt works now
22:59 <GodTodd> that popup menu key is only there for spare parts anyway, isn't it?
22:59 <GodTodd> kinda like the extra button on shirts?
23:00 <Lucifer_arma> I already used the windows key for spare parts
23:00 <GodTodd> that one too :)
23:00 <Lucifer_arma> my next laptop should have a lock on it
23:01 <GodTodd> heh
23:02 -!- z-man [n=manuel@p508734C7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #armagetron
23:03 -!- Lucifer_arma [n=satan@ppp-70-251-188-3.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
23:08 -!- madmax|pt [n=madmax@unaffiliated/madmaxpt/x-23911] has joined #armagetron
23:09 <madmax|pt> hi
23:09 <ghableska> hi max
23:26 <madmax|pt> Clan names are getting worse
23:27 <madmax|pt> 'Royal Cows'
23:30 <DrJoeTron> thats actually a step in the right direction
23:30 <GodTodd> is that as opposed to 'Patrician Cows'?
23:31 <DrJoeTron> its opposed to Seven Dragon
23:31 <DrJoeTron> dragons
23:31 <DrJoeTron> on armagetron
23:31 <DrJoeTron> SUPER fucker deep guys
23:31  * GodTodd was making a joke. :P
23:31 <DrJoeTron> too bad
23:31 <DrJoeTron> you fuel the rant instead
23:32 <GodTodd> fuck you joe
23:32 <DrJoeTron> ok
23:32 <GodTodd> slut
23:32 <GodTodd> nympho
23:32 <GodTodd> you're never satisfied are you?
23:33 <GodTodd> what was the name of the band your uncle in law or whomever was in?
23:36 <luke-jr|work> http://www.jayssite.com/stuff/childhacker/childhacker.html
23:38 <ghableska> luke-jr|work:....
23:38 <GodTodd> can't take it seriously after this: "Most American families use trusted and responsible Internet Service Providers, such as AOL."
23:39 <ghableska> you're behind :p
23:39 <GodTodd> no
23:39 <luke-jr|work> hehe
23:39 <GodTodd> gave up on it after that
23:39 <epsy> armabot, lastseen loops
23:39 <armabot> epsy: loops has last been seen on Chico's Brake Boost Styball 4 minutes ago.
23:39 <epsy> grmpf
23:39 <ghableska> #lastseen ghableska
23:39 <armabot> ghableska: ghableska has last been seen on  Wild West  =Capture The Flag= 0 days 18 hours 53 minutes ago.
23:42 <GodTodd> gave it another try....then this: "Popular hacker software includes "Comet Cursor", "Bonzi Buddy" and "Flash"."
23:42 <GodTodd> wtf?
23:43  * GodTodd accesses NASA's database with bonzi buddy.
23:43 -!- Vanhayes [n=Vanhayes@stjhnbsu83w-156034206082.nb.aliant.net] has joined #armagetron
23:44 <luke-jr|work> ...
23:44  * luke-jr|work watches GodTodd make a fool of himself
23:44 <epsy> …
23:44 <GodTodd> i didn't write or link the silly thing :P
23:44 -!- epsy [n=epsy@mar75-4-82-227-65-72.fbx.proxad.net] has quit ["END OF LINE"]
23:45  * GodTodd turns in all those "hackers"...you know, all the web design firms that use flash
23:46 <GodTodd> so i'm supposed to ground my son if a website tells me to download flash?
23:46 <GodTodd> what an idiot
23:48 <[dlh]> …
23:49 <luke-jr|work> I would
23:49 -!- Rico [n=rico@user-5442281c.l6.c1.dsl.pol.co.uk] has joined #armagetron
23:50 <GodTodd> bahahaha
23:50 <GodTodd> Hackers tend to dress in bright, day-glo colors. They may wear baggy pants, bright colored shirts and spiky hair dyed in bright colors to match their clothes. They may take to carrying "glow-sticks" and some wear pacifiers around their necks.
23:50 <GodTodd> these are the kind of people you take seriously, luke-jr_ ?
23:51 <GodTodd> ummm he'd better be joking...."BSD, Lunix, Debian and Mandrake are all versions of an illegal hacker operation system, invented by a Soviet computer hacker named Linyos Torovoltos, before the Russians lost the Cold War"
23:52 <DrJoeTron> welcome to  computers
23:52 <madmax|pt> Hm, arrested development finally released in portugal
23:52 <DrJoeTron> where electricity is still an arcane magic
23:55 <luke-jr|work> GodTodd: you're the only one taking it seriously
23:56 -!- z-man [n=manuel@p508734C7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
23:56 <GodTodd> nah...just wondering why it's not organized correctly on the site
23:58 <GodTodd> i mean...if you have a humor section, that should really be in it

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Logs from 2006-2009 pulled from wrtlprnft
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