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Log from 2006-11-04:
--- Day changed Sat Nov 04 2006
00:00 <guru3> right now i really want to block my computers from picking up an ipv6 address from the radvd that's running on the network
00:00 <luke-jr_work> so do it
00:00 <guru3> ive not no clue what protocol it is
00:01 <luke-jr_work> ipv6-route?
00:01 <luke-jr_work> maybe
00:02 <luke-jr_work> nope
00:03 <guru3> running ethereal on it
00:03 <guru3> maybe i'll get lucky & find it
00:03 <luke-jr_work> 17:03:46.981049 IP6 fe80::2b0:d0ff:fe25:d2d4 > ip6-allnodes: ICMP6, router advertisement, length 88
00:04 <guru3> maybe i should just block all ipv6 traffic in the forward table
00:04 <guru3> (of ip6tables)
00:05 <luke-jr_work> eck
00:05 <luke-jr_work> why?
00:05 <guru3> don't think i'll be doing any ipv6 across the uni lan
00:05 <guru3> as they don't have routing for it
00:06 <luke-jr_work> bug em
00:06 <luke-jr_work> what's his IP?
00:07 <luke-jr_work> the one advertising
00:07 <guru3> only know the link local ipv6...
00:07 <luke-jr_work> yeah
00:07 <luke-jr_work> that
00:09 <luke-jr_work> ip6tables -I INPUT -p icmpv6 --icmpv6-type router-advertisement --source fe80:... -j DROP
00:09 <guru3> what's the diff between -A and -I again?
00:10 <GodTodd> -7
00:10 <luke-jr_work> -I inserts at the top
00:10 <luke-jr_work> -A appends to the bottom
00:10 <guru3> how can you delete a rule that's like in the middle?
00:10 <luke-jr_work> -D
00:10 <guru3> any args?
00:10 <luke-jr_work> the rule
00:10 <luke-jr_work> -F will wipe em all
00:11 <luke-jr_work> BTW, unless your computer is a router itself, FORWARD is never used
00:11 <guru3> ive got a comp between me and the uni network
00:11 <guru3> it's bridging eth0-2
00:11 <guru3> for lan, wifi, and wan
00:11 <guru3> so forward table is used there
00:11 <luke-jr_work> o
00:12 <luke-jr_work> ethX is lame
00:12 <luke-jr_work> I call my network interface 'lan', 'wifi', and 'wan' :)
00:12 <guru3> smart allack ><
00:12 <guru3> im hard core and memorize which is which
00:13 <wrtlprnft> luke-jr_work: do your name your hard drive partitions too?
00:13 <wrtlprnft> *do you rename
00:13 <luke-jr_work> guru3, that might be smart, if it wasn't for the fact that they can change every reboot
00:13 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, no, they don't change ;p
00:14 <guru3> muahahaha that's true
00:14 <wrtlprnft> /dev/old_hd_partition_with_some_unimportant_stuff
00:14 <guru3> but that tends to be nly if i change the hardware
00:14 <luke-jr_work> guru3, or change the kernel
00:14 <wrtlprnft> mine don't change, luckily
00:14 <luke-jr_work> hmm
00:14 <luke-jr_work> I *should* name HDs
00:14 <luke-jr_work> based on serial #
00:14 <luke-jr_work> that way it would detect when I change them around
00:14 <wrtlprnft> yeah
00:15 <guru3> geh
00:15 <luke-jr_work> would only work for the removable ones tho
00:15 <wrtlprnft> because /dev/hd1265023672 is easier to remember than /dev/hada
00:15 <wrtlprnft> because /dev/hd1265023672 is easier to remember than /dev/hda
00:15 <luke-jr_work> no, dummy
00:15 <luke-jr_work> the udev rule has the serial #
00:15 <luke-jr_work> not the device
00:16 <wrtlprnft> ah
00:16 <luke-jr_work> so I plug in old_hd_with_useless_crap, it gets named that
00:16 <luke-jr_work> if I unplug that and put in another HD, I get it named /dev/anime_hd
00:16 <luke-jr_work> =p
00:16 <guru3> looks like that rule works luke
00:16 <guru3> thanks
00:18 <guru3> gonna just try blocking all external ipv6 traffic
00:20 <guru3> ip6tables -A FORWARD -m physdev --physdev-in eht2 --physdev-out eth2 -j DROP
00:20 <guru3> ip6tables -A INPUT -m physdev --physdev-in eht2 --physdev-out eth2 -j DROP
00:20 <guru3> that ought to do it yeah?
00:21 <luke-jr_work> why not
00:21 <guru3> see if radvdump still picks shit up
00:22 <luke-jr_work> ip6tables -t raw -I PREROUTING -j DROP
00:22 <luke-jr_work> more efficient to do it there
00:22 <luke-jr_work> err
00:22 <luke-jr_work> better yet
00:22 <luke-jr_work> ip6tables -t raw -P PREROUTING DROP
00:22 <guru3> except
00:22 <guru3> i still want eth0 and eth1 to be able to ipv6-ify
00:23 <luke-jr_work> ip6tables -t raw -i eth2 -o eth2 -P PREROUTING DROP
00:23 <luke-jr_work> :)
00:23 <guru3> dshite
00:23 <guru3> *shite
00:23 <guru3> i still got a router advertisement
00:24 <luke-jr_work> err
00:24 <luke-jr_work> ip6tables -t raw -i eth2 -P PREROUTING DROP
00:24 <luke-jr_work> crap
00:24 <luke-jr_work> um
00:24 <luke-jr_work> ip6tables -t raw -I PREROUTING -i eth2 DROP
00:24 <luke-jr_work> there
00:24 <luke-jr_work> that should do it
00:25 <guru3> need a -j in there?
00:25 <luke-jr_work> yes
00:25 <luke-jr_work> :)
00:25 <luke-jr_work> (before DROP)
00:25 <guru3> i sort of like the look of ip6tables -t raw -i eth2 -o eth2 PREROUTING DROP
00:25 <guru3> altho i think that needs a -j as well
00:25 <luke-jr_work> that won't work
00:25 <guru3> why?
00:26 <luke-jr_work> 1) it matches packets going BOTH from eth2 and to eth2
00:26 <luke-jr_work> eg, both need to be true
00:26 <luke-jr_work> it's AND nor OR
00:26 <guru3> hmm
00:26 <luke-jr_work> 2) PREROUTING only knows source interface
00:26 <luke-jr_work> it hasn't been routed yet =p
00:26 <guru3> i see
00:26 <luke-jr_work> so no output interface is known
00:26 <guru3> my -m physdev --physdev blah
00:27 <guru3> that one needed to match both didn't it?
00:27 <luke-jr_work> but if there's no assigned IPv6 on eth2, I see no reason there'd be anything outgoing
00:27 <luke-jr_work> physdev is for bridges
00:27 <guru3> it is a bridge...
00:27 <luke-jr_work> erm
00:27 <luke-jr_work> then it should be called br0
00:27 <luke-jr_work> not eth2
00:27 <Your_mom_arma> bridges are for rivers
00:27 <luke-jr_work> o
00:28 <luke-jr_work> I see
00:28 <guru3> ill try the lines i had before but seperating --physdev-in and --physdev-out
00:29 <guru3> but ok, iptables -p udp --dport 67:68 --sport 67:68 -j ACCEPT
00:29 <guru3> (-A FORWARD that is)
00:29 <guru3> that lets any and all udp port 67 or 68 traffic thru
00:29 <guru3> right?
00:30 <luke-jr_work> assuming both dport and sport are 67/68
00:30 <luke-jr_work> which isn't very common
00:30 <luke-jr_work> also assuming there isn't an earlier rule blocking it
00:30 <guru3> so it matches 67 to 67, 67 to 68, 68 to 67, and 68 to 68
00:30 <luke-jr_work> right
00:30 <luke-jr_work> but only root can use those ports
00:31 <luke-jr_work> so it'd be a root-to-root connection
00:31 <guru3> it's dhcpc
00:31 <luke-jr_work> o
00:31 <guru3> -c
00:31 <luke-jr_work> why are you blocking IPv4 traffic? =p
00:31 <guru3> im doing connection tracking
00:31 <luke-jr_work> so?
00:31 <guru3> and blocking unwanted inbound tcp connections from the inet
00:31 <luke-jr_work> that's easy
00:31 <guru3> -m state --state NEW,INVALD -j DROP
00:32 <guru3> but for some reason that rule was catching dhcp requests
00:32 <luke-jr_work> makes sense
00:32 <luke-jr_work> I see
00:32 <guru3> but when you have like 67:68
00:32 <luke-jr_work> um
00:32 <guru3> that's like "port 67 or 68"
00:32 <luke-jr_work> that DROP matches the interface too, right?
00:32 <guru3> yeah
00:32 <guru3> just saving on typing
00:32 <luke-jr_work> heh
00:32 <luke-jr_work> ok
00:33 <guru3> 67:68 = 67 or 68
00:33 <luke-jr_work> 67 to 68 ;p
00:33 <guru3> i thought - was to
00:33 <luke-jr_work> - is invalid
00:33 <guru3> "oh my"
00:34 <guru3> ok
00:34 <guru3> so 22:80 would be 22 to 80
00:34 <guru3> and -m tcp is the same as -p tcp yeah?
00:34 <luke-jr_work> right, and wrong
00:35 <luke-jr_work> -m tcp only loads it, doesn't match it
00:35 <guru3> so -m tcp --protcol tcp = -p tcp
00:35 <luke-jr_work> I think -m tcp would be undefined by itself
00:35 <luke-jr_work> -p tcp implies -m tcp
00:35 <guru3> ok
00:35 <guru3> so then if you have two -ms
00:36 <guru3> like -m tcp (implied by -p tcp) and -m physdev --phy..blah
00:36 <guru3> that has to match both those
00:36 <luke-jr_work> -m loads a module
00:36 <luke-jr_work> it doesn't match anything
00:36 <guru3> ah
00:36 <guru3> everything in a rule has to match
00:36 <luke-jr_work> right
00:36 <guru3> if you have --physdev-in and --dport
00:36 <guru3> both match or nothing happens
00:37 <luke-jr_work> yep
00:37 <guru3> didn't know about that
00:37 <luke-jr_work> note netfilter and iptables support functions
00:37 <luke-jr_work> so you could match --physdev-in and -j to your function
00:37 <luke-jr_work> and then match the rest there
00:37 <guru3> too complicated ><
00:37 <luke-jr_work> nah
00:38 <luke-jr_work> simpler
00:38 <wrtlprnft> does anyone know why mplayer doesn't want to be emerged without the esd USE flag?
00:38 <luke-jr_work> better than repeating --physdev-in lots
00:38 <guru3> next time i level up my iptables knowledge
00:38 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, explain
00:38 <wrtlprnft> i set media-video/mplayer -esd in package.use
00:38 <wrtlprnft> but it still wants to compile with esd
00:39 <wrtlprnft> and esd itself fails to compile
00:39 <luke-jr_work> probably have multiple mplayer elements in package.use
00:39 <luke-jr_work> only one is allowed
00:39 <wrtlprnft> but i don't need esd so i wanna get rid of them all
00:39 <luke-jr_work> why not USE=-esd in make.conf?
00:39 <wrtlprnft> no, package.use has 4 lines
00:39 <luke-jr_work> esd is a global USE flag
00:39 <wrtlprnft> and only one mplayer one
00:39 <wrtlprnft> and i set USE=-esd too
00:39 <luke-jr_work> emerge -vp mplayer
00:39 <wrtlprnft> USE="-gtk -gnome -qt -kde -dvd -alsa -cdr -cups -X unicode nptl nptlonly -arts -esd"
00:40 <wrtlprnft> why isn't there a -allthatdesktopcraf USE flag?
00:40 <wrtlprnft> *allthatdesktopcrap
00:40 <guru3> -*
00:40 <luke-jr_work> USE flags don't support grouping? =p
00:40 <wrtlprnft> x_X
00:41 <luke-jr_work> /exec -o emerge -vp mplayer
00:41 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, switch to Utopios when it's done
00:41 <wrtlprnft> argh, duh, I'm stupid
00:41 <DrJoeTron> Your_mom_arma
00:41 <luke-jr_work> ?
00:41 <wrtlprnft> i used emerge -uDavt world to see what package was responsible for esound
00:42 <DrJoeTron> Your_mom_arma i've got someone who
00:42 <Your_mom_arma> ping
00:42 <DrJoeTron> 's been dying to hear you shred
00:42 <Your_mom_arma> haha
00:42 <wrtlprnft> forgot to change that to emerge -uDavNt world to make it reconsider mplayer, too
00:42 <luke-jr_work> lol
00:42 <wrtlprnft> thanks, anyways
00:43 <guru3> oh yeah thanks for the iptables help luke
00:43 <guru3> i may have more queries later on
00:43 <wrtlprnft> http://www.google.com/search?client=opera&rls=en&q=utopios+linux&sourceid=opera&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
00:43 <wrtlprnft> ag
00:43 <wrtlprnft> *ah
00:43 -!- ghableska [n=ghablesk@12-240-54-90.client.mchsi.com] has joined #Armagetron
00:43 <wrtlprnft> the first result concerns you
00:43 <wrtlprnft> not you ghableska
00:43 <wrtlprnft> hi :P
00:44 <ghableska> hi...
00:44 <ghableska> nice way to say hello :P
00:44 <wrtlprnft> well, i had that line typed when you joined
00:44 <ghableska> hehe
00:46 <guru3> link local ipv6
00:47 <guru3> *site local
00:47 <guru3> is the fec0::/96 range right?
00:47 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, ...?
00:48 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, try without "linux"
00:48 <wrtlprnft> umm, well
00:49 <guru3> fec, fed, fee, fef
00:49 <wrtlprnft> i usually use linux as a keyword for any terms that might describe non- computerrelated things, too
00:49 <luke-jr_work> Utopios is unique ;)
00:49 <luke-jr_work> only use outside of the OS is in reference to Debian in a Slashdot post
00:49 <luke-jr_work> and some guy's name on a foreign forum
00:50 <wrtlprnft> *might*
00:50 <luke-jr_work> heh
00:50 <wrtlprnft> well, anyways, what am i gonna gain from this besides not having an official opera ebuild?
00:50 <wrtlprnft> i don't wanna fork any os
00:50 <luke-jr_work> it's not a fork
00:50 <wrtlprnft> i don't need an easy installer
00:50 <wrtlprnft> * Easily Forkable - Gentoo's structure requires significant effort and infrastructure to fork. With the flexibility of Utopios, anyone should be able to easily maintain their own private forks with simple changes (added/overridden packages, etc). This has many possibilities including the ability to maintain customised versions for individual organizations.
00:51 <DrJoeTron> forks!
00:51 <luke-jr_work> Utopios is easily forkable
00:51 <wrtlprnft> spoons!
00:51 <luke-jr_work> Which means you could easily maintain a fork adding Opera
00:51 <wrtlprnft> knives!
00:51 <wrtlprnft> lobster!
00:51 <DrJoeTron> butter!
00:51 <DrJoeTron> >-;;,ccc3
00:51 <luke-jr_work> Utopios itself will maintain multiple repositories of MMD
00:52 <luke-jr_work> so it would even be easy to exclude Utopios branding just by removing certain MMD repos
00:52 <wrtlprnft> still, it would need me to reboot my server, right?
00:52 <guru3> fec0::/10
00:52 <guru3> that's the site local range
00:52 <guru3> right?
00:52 <luke-jr_work> hmm?
00:52 <luke-jr_work> theoretically, a Gentoo migration script would be possible ;p
00:52 <wrtlprnft> grr
00:52 <luke-jr_work> since Utopios's package manager is capable of handling Gentoo ebuilds
00:52 <wrtlprnft> now on my other machine kdejava isn't compiling
00:53 <wrtlprnft> /bin/sh: line 2: -d: command not found
00:53 <luke-jr_work> (as well as native Perl packages from CPAN, etc)
00:53 <wrtlprnft> i still don't see the big gain for me
00:53 <luke-jr_work> so, don't want Utopios branding, you could either BRANDING -= Utopios *or* guarantee a full removal by removing the utopios-branding repository
00:54 <luke-jr_work> well, there'd be featuresets
00:54 <luke-jr_work> so you could do FEATURES -= desktop
00:54 <wrtlprnft> well, but i do want some desktop apps
00:54 <luke-jr_work> so install those
00:54 <wrtlprnft> i do want gvim on it for ssh
00:54 <wrtlprnft> i do want mplayer for sound
00:55 <luke-jr_work> so install gvim/mplayer
00:55 <wrtlprnft> but then, what good is the preset?
00:55 <luke-jr_work> { NAME=="mplayer"; FEATURES+="alsa"; }
00:55 <luke-jr_work> it would work like automatically turning off USE flags
00:56 <wrtlprnft> i don't want alsa nor esd nor jack nor whatever they called
00:56 <wrtlprnft> i don't get their use
00:56 <luke-jr_work> how will mplayer play sound?
00:56 <wrtlprnft> argh
00:56 <luke-jr_work> lol
00:56 <wrtlprnft> sorry, mixed up alsa and arts
00:56 <luke-jr_work> ah!
00:57 <wrtlprnft> arts being what i don't want at all
00:57 <luke-jr_work> arts is evil crap that must die :)
00:57 <wrtlprnft> root@laptop 137 # eselect -h /home/mathias
00:57 <wrtlprnft> !!! Error: Can't load module -h
00:57 <wrtlprnft> zsh: killed eselect -h
00:57 <spidey> luke-jr_work, is just crap that must die
00:57 <wrtlprnft> don't all gentoo programs offer nice help screens?
00:57 <luke-jr_work> the MMD and raw package configuration is a format that's based on SQL loosely
00:58 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, --help maybe
00:58 <wrtlprnft> nope, that neither
00:58 <wrtlprnft> using man now
00:58 <luke-jr_work> man
00:58 <luke-jr_work> :)
00:58 <luke-jr_work> based on writing MMD for Psi, I think the format needs some kind of macros ;p
00:58 <wrtlprnft> luke-jr_work: it would have been “eselect help” btw
00:58 <luke-jr_work> lol
00:58 <wrtlprnft> nice to know *after* reading the man page
00:59 <luke-jr_work> { FEATURES[] == "PGP"; RDEPEND += ( {{ NAME="gnupg"; }}; ); }
01:00 <luke-jr_work> part of the psi package
01:00 <wrtlprnft> i'd rather like to have pgp support for opera
01:00 <wrtlprnft> but apparently they're working on it
01:00 <luke-jr_work> really?
01:00 <luke-jr_work> for web stuff?
01:01 <luke-jr_work> that would make Opera so tempting...
01:01 <wrtlprnft> no, for email of course
01:02 <wrtlprnft> for web stuff you have https and logins if you need it
01:02 <wrtlprnft> emails are inherently insecure
01:03 <[Xpert]DarkStar> night all
01:03 <[Xpert]DarkStar> i'm off to sleep
01:03 <[Xpert]DarkStar> cu
01:04 <wrtlprnft> btw i think trying not to bother a user with technical software details, but then bothering him/her with legal bs is kind of counterproductive
01:04 <luke-jr_work> https and logins don't protect the user from a bad site
01:05 <luke-jr_work> you need to trust the site you're logging into
01:05 <wrtlprnft> umm, there's ssl certificates
01:05 <luke-jr_work> SSL certs only guarantee the remote site is who they claim to be
01:05 <luke-jr_work> and then, not even all the time
01:05 <wrtlprnft> you need to initially trust the pgp key owner too
01:05 <luke-jr_work> not if you own the key
01:05 <luke-jr_work> and it's being used to ID you
01:06 <luke-jr_work> I'm thinking for logins
01:06 <wrtlprnft> luke-jr_work: but if you know the cerificate once you can be sure it's the same guy in the future
01:06 <luke-jr_work> the website gives <input type="pgp-check" value="some random code"/>
01:06 <luke-jr_work> and the user's browser lets them sign it with their key
01:06 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, same guy sure, but what if I don't trust that guy with my login info>
01:06 <luke-jr_work> ?
01:06 <ghableska> #weather 50265]
01:06 <armabot> ghableska: Error: Spurious "]". You may want to quote your arguments with double quotes in order to prevent extra brackets from being evaluated as nested commands.
01:06 <wrtlprnft> just make another login?
01:06 <ghableska> #weather 50265
01:07 <wrtlprnft> another set of password/username
01:07 <armabot> ghableska: The current temperature in Des Moines, Iowa is 46.4°F (5:54 PM CST on November 03, 2006). Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 37%. Dew Point: 21.2°F. Windchill: 41.0°F. Pressure: 30.19 in 1022 hPa.
01:07 <luke-jr_work> the login needs to work across multiple websites
01:07 <luke-jr_work> including ones I do trust
01:07 <luke-jr_work> and ones I don't
01:07 <wrtlprnft> you know there's stuff like msn passport and crap like that?
01:07 <wrtlprnft> that's basically doing the same
01:07 <luke-jr_work> that's no more secure
01:07 <wrtlprnft> not that i like it
01:07 <luke-jr_work> MSN Passport is easily spoofed
01:07 <luke-jr_work> the other crap just offloads the authentication to email
01:08 <luke-jr_work> keys in the browser are the only real solution
01:08 <wrtlprnft> anyways, i do see the use of it, but it's very hypothetical
01:08 <guru3> what package in gentoo has the /etc/init.d/net.lo script?
01:08 <luke-jr_work> baselayout I bet
01:08 <wrtlprnft> it would require some well-known browser to adapt it to be used
01:08 <wrtlprnft> baselayout, yes
01:08 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, or plugins for such
01:08 <wrtlprnft> can't rely on plugins, really
01:08 <Vanhayes> #armaconfig respawn
01:08 <armabot> Vanhayes: Sorry, no matches :S
01:09 <wrtlprnft> i don't have the RESPAWN_HACK enabled
01:09 <Vanhayes> ah, ok
01:09 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, no?
01:09 <guru3> thnx\
01:09 <luke-jr_work> a lot harder to spoof
01:10 <luke-jr_work> Mozilla's PGP mail support is via plugins
01:10 <wrtlprnft> but it's mail. checking a key is some additional check you can skip if you like
01:11 <wrtlprnft> and you can only send encrypted mails if you know the other guy's public key, so you know he has PGP
01:11 <luke-jr_work> you assume it's verified only on the server
01:11 <luke-jr_work> take a forum for example
01:11 <luke-jr_work> you sign each post
01:11 <luke-jr_work> the post includes a hidden element with the signature
01:11 <luke-jr_work> the reader's browser verifies it
01:11 <wrtlprnft> why not just include the key in the post
01:11 <wrtlprnft> ?
01:11 <luke-jr_work> the server could be untrusted
01:11 <luke-jr_work> to hide it from browsers w/o support
01:11 <wrtlprnft> just run the post's content through pgp to sign it
01:12 <luke-jr_work> not easy enough for regular users
01:12 <wrtlprnft> of course you wouldn't give the server your private key
01:12 <luke-jr_work> the site I use for gold uses manual PGP authentication
01:12 <luke-jr_work> I need to go home....
01:12 <wrtlprnft> anyways, write a ff extension to do that and shut up about it
01:12 <wrtlprnft> cya
01:12 <wrtlprnft> i need to go to bed
01:12 <wrtlprnft> #night
01:12 <armabot> Good night wrtlprnft!
01:12 <Your_mom_arma> cya?
01:13 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, maybe if I cared for FF
01:13 <ghableska> cya wrtlprnft
01:13 * wrtlprnft doesn't care for it
01:13 <luke-jr_work> wrtlprnft, does Opera support plugins?
01:13 <wrtlprnft> luke-jr_work: plugins yes, extensions no
01:13 <luke-jr_work> the diff?
01:14 <wrtlprnft> they do have some reasoning for not supporting extensions
01:14 <luke-jr_work> the difference being?
01:14 <wrtlprnft> plugins = acrobat reader, flash, mplayer, stuff like that
01:14 <luke-jr_work> so... <objects> only
01:14 <wrtlprnft> extension = something that has acess to the chrome and everything
01:14 <luke-jr_work> oh
01:14 <wrtlprnft> *access
01:15 <wrtlprnft> plugins can only read the content they're associated with and only display in that area
01:15 <luke-jr_work> well, if I make up a design plan, would you be willing to look into Opera support?
01:15 <wrtlprnft> well, it would be impossible pretty much
01:15 <luke-jr_work> maybe, maybe not
01:15 <luke-jr_work> bbiab
01:15 <wrtlprnft> you *could* hack the spellchecker
01:15 <luke-jr_work> lol
01:15 -!- luke-jr_work [n=luke-jr@adsl-70-128-250-253.dsl.ksc2mo.swbell.net] has quit ["Leaving"]
01:15 <wrtlprnft> it uses aspell
01:16 <wrtlprnft> so you could change that to really add a pgp signature
01:17 <Your_mom_arma> who broke lucifers internet?
01:20 <wrtlprnft> http://wrtlprnft.ath.cx/wikiconnect.png ← note the time at the bottom
01:20 <wrtlprnft> though that's a result of previous connection attempts, it would probably fix itself if i just restarted opera
01:21 <wrtlprnft> anyways, now i'll really go to bed
01:23 <Vanhayes> Your_mom_arma: I did, I was jealous of its supiority
01:23 <Your_mom_arma> makes sence to me
01:23 <ghableska> wrtlprnft: pretty
01:24 <Your_mom_arma> luci isnt in irc so his internet connections probobly acting up
01:27 <DrJoeTron> that kid is weird
01:28 <Your_mom_arma> hey i get on teamspeak with a voice changer because im 14
01:28 <Your_mom_arma> really? i couldnt tell
01:28 <Your_mom_arma> i need a louder amp
01:29 <DrJoeTron> haha
01:30 <guru3> afk
01:30 -!- MaZuffeR [n=MaZuffeR@darkmoor.sby.abo.fi] has quit ["-"]
01:37 -!- [dlh] [n=[dlh]@a0204.upc-a.chello.nl] has left #armagetron []
01:45 <Vanhayes> #ping
01:45 <armabot> pong
01:45 <ghableska> #pong
01:45 <armabot> ping
01:46 <ghableska> http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewsr.html?pid=10299 <-- ouch
02:00 -!- manta [n=kim@host-69-59-72-81.nctv.com] has joined #armagetron
02:01 <Vanhayes> luke-jr_: ping
02:03 <manta> pong
02:03 <manta> 2 minutes, not bad :)
02:04 <spidey> lol
02:13 <spidey> i just realized something
02:13 <spidey> they fucked up my billing thingy for the soldat server
02:13 <spidey> Amount: $0.00 Total Paid: $0.00 Total Due: $0.00
02:14 <spidey> #cnn 38256
02:14 <armabot> spidey: The current temperature in Paris, TN is 43.0°F. Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 48%. Wind: ESE at 2 mph (3 km/h).
02:14 <Vanhayes> #weather Saint John
02:14 <armabot> Vanhayes: Temperature: 32°F / 0°C | Humidity: 75% | Pressure: 30.16in / 1021hPa | Conditions: Clear | Wind Direction: West | Wind Speed: 5mph / 7km/h | Updated: 9:00 PM AST; Tonight - Cloudy periods. 40 percent chance of rain showers or wet flurries early this evening. Fog patches overnight. Wind northwest 20 km/h gusting to 40 becoming light this evening. Low minus 5.; Saturday - Sunny. Wind becoming west 20 km/h (1 more message)
02:14 <Vanhayes> snowed here today
02:14 <Vanhayes> first snow of the year
02:20 <ghableska> how much snow?
02:21 <Vanhayes> about 5 minutes of light flurries worth :)
02:21 <Vanhayes> none stayed on the ground but its nice to see it
02:21 <ghableska> haha
02:22 <ghableska> #weather 50265
02:22 <armabot> ghableska: The current temperature in Des Moines, Iowa is 44.6°F (6:54 PM CST on November 03, 2006). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 39%. Dew Point: 21.2°F. Windchill: 39.2°F. Pressure: 30.19 in 1022 hPa.
02:22 <ghableska> #cnn 50265
02:22 <armabot> ghableska: The current temperature in West Des Moines, IA is 47.0°F. Conditions: Mostly Cloudy. Humidity: 35%. Wind: SE at 10 mph (16 km/h).
02:22 <ghableska> I never know which one to believe :P
02:23 -!- Lucifer_arma [n=satan@ppp-70-253-192-111.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #armagetron
02:23 <Lucifer_arma> can anybody hit the wiki?
02:23 <guru3> all my comps are coming up with proper ip configs now at last
02:23 <ghableska> works fine for me
02:23 <ghableska> there are ads now?
02:24 <guru3> wiki loads
02:24 <guru3> i just wish the adds were about 150 pixels thinner
02:27 <Lucifer_arma> heh
02:28 <Lucifer_arma> the choice is a large ad or a small ad, there aren't really medium ad choices :/
02:28 <Lucifer_arma> we need to not change them often in order to collect good data, though. So maybe this time next week try a different size
02:28 <Lucifer_arma> then a week or so later, try adding a smaller ad to the bottom, that sort of thing
02:30 <Vanhayes> what are you trying to do?
02:30 <spidey> #g 2006 - 1956
02:30 <armabot> spidey: 2,006 - 1,956 = 50
02:30 <spidey> tom hanks is old o.O
02:30 <Vanhayes> my dads older
02:30 <Your_mom_arma> is it based on wiki hits or people who actually follow the link?
02:30 <Lucifer_arma> Vanhayes: determine if having ads on the wiki will actually be helpful to us
02:30 <Lucifer_arma> clicks, you have to click the ad for it to make any money
02:31 <spidey> you know you can fake those..
02:31 <spidey> cycle proxies
02:31 <Your_mom_arma> should i go click a bunch?
02:31 <spidey> xD
02:31 <Lucifer_arma> no, you shouldn't :)
02:31 <ghableska> *click*
02:31 <Lucifer_arma> we need accurate numbers, not artificially inflated numbers
02:31 <Your_mom_arma> ok
02:31 <manta> what about all the people who programed their gateway boxes to filter out adds?
02:31 <Lucifer_arma> if the numbers look good and we keep ads, then yeah, you should go click a bunch :)
02:32 <Lucifer_arma> manta: doesn't matter to me. People can avoid looking at them any way they want, I want to see what a realistic income from the wiki would look like,
02:32 <Lucifer_arma> and if it's high enough (I still need to quantify "high enough"), then I can justify putting money up front to put into real hardware for it
02:33 <Lucifer_arma> and then we'll be able to do regular upgrades, updates, and maintenance stuff that I"m currently footing the bill for on my own (which means there haven't been any)
02:34 <manta> well it certainly would be a good thing
02:34 <manta> we all know how hard you work
02:35 <Vanhayes> I don't
02:35 <Vanhayes> then again im pretty unobservant
02:35 <Vanhayes> hmm
02:35 <Vanhayes> #check unobservent
02:35 <armabot> Vanhayes: No spelling suggestion made. This could mean that the word you gave is spelled right; it could also mean that its spelling was too whacked out even for Google to figure out.
02:36 <Vanhayes> Is unobservant a word, or did I make it up?
02:36 <spidey> #dict unobservant
02:36 <Your_mom_arma> #dict
02:36 <armabot> spidey: wn, gcide, and moby-thes responded: gcide: Unobservant \Unobservant\ See {observant}; wn: unobservant adj 1: not consciously observing; "looked through him with blank unseeing eyes" [syn: {unseeing}] 2: not paying attention [syn: {inattentive}, {unvigilant}, {unwatchful}]; moby-thes: 34 Moby Thesaurus words for "unobservant": careless, disregardant, disregardful, distracted, distrait, heedless, (1 more message)
02:36 <spidey> #dict unobservent
02:36 <armabot> spidey: No definition for "unobservent" could be found.
02:36 <spidey> =p
02:36 <Vanhayes> #check unobservant
02:37 <armabot> Vanhayes: No spelling suggestion made. This could mean that the word you gave is spelled right; it could also mean that its spelling was too whacked out even for Google to figure out.
02:37 <manta> unobservant
02:37 <manta> adj 1: not consciously observing; "looked through him with blank unseeing eyes" [syn: unseeing] 2: not paying attention [syn: inattentive, unvigilant, unwatchful]
02:37 <Vanhayes> Well thats good to know, I sometimes make words up that sound right to me but dont look right
02:38 <Vanhayes> #dict Impostering
02:38 <armabot> Vanhayes: No definition for "Impostering" could be found.
02:38 <Vanhayes> ya...
02:38 -!- complexity [n=complexi@bb-66-63-118-224.gwi.net] has joined #armagetron
02:38 <complexity> how can i get someones user id if they are using unicode in there name?
02:38 <DrJoeTron> hi.
02:39 <Your_mom_arma> #lastseen complexity
02:39 <DrJoeTron> did you ever think of typing /players
02:39 <armabot> Your_mom_arma: timed out
02:39 <DrJoeTron> #lastseen Dr Joe Tron
02:39 <armabot> DrJoeTron: Dr Joe Tron has last been seen on The Lobster Cage 0 days 1 hours 6 minutes ago.
02:39 <ghableska> #lastseen ghableska
02:39 <armabot> ghableska: ghableska has last been seen on 2020 team challenge 57 minutes ago.
02:40 <Vanhayes> #lastseen lastseen
02:40 <Vanhayes> time out
02:40 <armabot> Vanhayes: timed out
02:40 <manta> #lastseen manta
02:40 <armabot> manta: (WS)Manta has last been seen on 2020 team challenge 49 minutes ago.
02:40 <DrJoeTron> #lastseen vangaynus
02:40 <Vanhayes> lol
02:40 <armabot> DrJoeTron: timed out
02:40 <DrJoeTron> :D
02:42 <Vanhayes> #armaservers
02:42 <armabot> Vanhayes: ~"XzL.Clan The Server (9 players) || Swampland in 2.7.1 (8 players) || ¬ | D u r k a D u r k a L a n d | ¬/xff9900 (8 players) || Strawberry Fields (5 players) || Tigers Network Classic Play (4 players) || -=}ID< Immortal Dynasty Server (4 players) || Crazy Tronners Wild Fortress (4 players) || -=:[Welknown Server]:=- (3 players) || The Lobster Cage (3 players) || ~|DS|~DarkSyndicate's (1 more message)
02:43 <ghableska> #lastseen vangaynus
02:43 <armabot> ghableska: vangaynus seems to be on icemans network nuke zone - www.icemans.net right now.
02:43 <guru3> off to bed
02:43 <guru3> good night
02:44 <ghableska> cya
02:44 <Vanhayes> night
02:46 <DrJoeTron> hagha
02:47 -!- complexity [n=complexi@bb-66-63-118-224.gwi.net] has quit ["leaving"]
02:48 <DrJoeTron> you're welcome complexity
02:50 <DrJoeTron> Your_mom_arma
02:50 <DrJoeTron> what do you use for camera settings
02:50 <DrJoeTron> i remember you telling me it but i dont remember it
02:50 <DrJoeTron> because im sick of the 2.8.2 camera
02:50 <Your_mom_arma> its on the wiki somewhere
02:50 <DrJoeTron> heh ok
02:57 <ghableska> #google vangaynus
02:57 <armabot> ghableska: Search took 0.08 seconds: Armagetron Forums :: View topic - Has my attitude improved?: <http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?p=96991>
02:57 <Vanhayes> Ha
02:57 <Vanhayes> I remember that
02:59 <Vanhayes> luke-jr_: ping
03:16 <DrJoeTron> majination sure dissapeared
03:19 <Your_mom_arma> well yeah?
03:20 <DrJoeTron> :/
03:20 <DrJoeTron> ok so im stating the obvious
03:21 <DrJoeTron> what else is new
03:21 <Your_mom_arma> well i wasnt sure if that was some kind of sarcasm saying he hadnt really
03:22 <DrJoeTron> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkDI_spL0HQ what the christ, its dolphin boy
03:26 <ghableska> interesting
03:27 <Your_mom_arma> cool
03:52 <DrJoeTron> man i wanna get sam & max
03:52 <luke-jr_> ...
03:52 <luke-jr_> Vanhayes:
03:57 <spidey> STFU
03:57 <spidey> -caps
03:57 <ghableska> O_o
03:57 <spidey> DrJoeTron, defcon? =p
03:57 <spidey> stfu was at luke-jr_
03:57 <spidey> =p
04:11 <luke-jr_> stfu spidey
04:11 <spidey> you stfu
04:11 * ghableska yawns
04:11 <spidey> to lazy to even spell it out
04:11 <spidey> xD
04:12 <luke-jr_> stfu spidey
04:12 <spidey> die
04:12 <luke-jr_> stfu spidey
04:12 <spidey> /ignore luke-jr_
04:12 <luke-jr_> stfu spidey
04:12 <ghableska> now now, children... :P
04:13 <luke-jr_> stfu spidey
04:14 <spidey> *!*@CPE-24-31-245-218.kc.res.rr.com added to ignore list.
04:14 <spidey> perfect
04:14 * luke-jr_ reconnects w/ diff IP
04:16 -!- luke-jr_ [n=luke-jr@CPE-24-31-245-218.kc.res.rr.com] has left #armagetron ["Leaving"]
04:16 -!- luke-jr__ [n=luke-jr@2002:1891:f657:0:20e:a6ff:fec4:4e5d] has joined #armagetron
04:16 <spidey> gay
04:16 <spidey> i can ignore that mask to =p
04:16 <luke-jr__> lol
04:17 * luke-jr__ /ignores only spidey's /notices
04:17 <spidey> rofl!!
04:17 <spidey> =(
04:17 <spidey> would be if you where in a game
04:18 <spidey> xD
04:18 <luke-jr__> nah
04:18 <spidey> lol
04:18 <luke-jr__> all it does is show a - instead of <>
04:18 <luke-jr__> big deal
04:18 <spidey> no bubbles?
04:18 <spidey> =(
04:18 <ghableska> #weather 50265
04:18 <luke-jr__> lol
04:18 <armabot> ghableska: The current temperature in Des Moines, Iowa is 46.4°F (8:54 PM CST on November 03, 2006). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 40%. Dew Point: 23.0°F. Windchill: 41.0°F. Pressure: 30.17 in 1022 hPa.
04:18 <luke-jr__> baka
04:18 <luke-jr__> it's just /notice
04:18 <spidey> mine shows a >< instead of a -
04:18 <luke-jr__> ...
04:19 <luke-jr__> anyhow
04:19 <spidey> >luke-jr__< i bet this is annoying
04:19 <luke-jr__> that's a send
04:19 <luke-jr__> dummy
04:19 <luke-jr__> anyhow
04:19 <luke-jr__> my wife vetoed tonight's civ
04:19 <luke-jr__> prolly tomorrow's too :|
04:19 <luke-jr__> so anyway
04:19 <luke-jr__> time to go take her to bed :D
04:19 <luke-jr__> 'night
04:21 <ghableska> cya
04:21 * spidey drop kicks ghableska
04:23 <ghableska> er, no?
04:27 <spidey> er,yes
04:27 <GodTodd> hrmm...the day my wife tells me when to go to bed i'll officially give up my balls and my rights to call myself a man
04:27 <spidey> he's whipped
04:27 <spidey> remember...push over
04:27 <spidey> =p
04:28 <GodTodd> heh...you *assume* i was talking about someone specific....could be just a general statement ;)
04:29 <spidey> we know you was talking about luke-jr__ =p
04:29 <GodTodd> on my lawyer's advice i will neither confirm nor deny that observation
04:29 <spidey> lol
04:35 <Your_mom_arma> Lucifer_arma: spidey: civ?
04:38 <spidey> after the night i had last night
04:38 <spidey> i'll be lucky to stay awake 1 more hour
04:51 <Lucifer_arma> spidey asked to wait until saturday
04:52 <Lucifer_arma> when my wife orders me to bed I expect sex
04:56 <Lucifer_arma> if I don't get it, I get back up
05:01 <GodTodd> haha
05:01 <GodTodd> same here
05:10 <ghableska> #night
05:10 <armabot> Good night ghableska!
05:10 -!- ghableska [n=ghablesk@12-240-54-90.client.mchsi.com] has left #Armagetron []
05:15 -!- Fonkay [i=Fonkay@blk-89-218-73.eastlink.ca] has joined #armagetron
05:15 <Fonkay> hello crazys
05:17 -!- manta [n=kim@host-69-59-72-81.nctv.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
05:18 <Vanhayes> well if we are all crazy wouldnt that make crazy the norm, thus making you the crazy one?
05:19 <Vanhayes> plus its crazies :)
05:20 <Your_mom_arma> that logic doesnt make anysence, she would be an outcast if we where all crazy and she where sain
05:22 <Vanhayes> well if Im crazy then my logic doesnt really have to make ense
05:23 <Your_mom_arma> i guess thats true
05:23 -!- manta [n=kim@64-118-125-125-as-07.dialin.oakhurst.sti.net] has joined #armagetron
05:23 <Vanhayes> man, they had a sweet deal down at the bar tonight, a bucket of beer for 8 bucks untill midnight
05:24 <Vanhayes> it was draft but I mean for 8 bucks it was worth it
05:26 <Fonkay> crazies isn't actually a word is it? and if it isn't, then i can spell it any way i like
05:27 <Vanhayes> well I could be making it up, it happens sometimes
05:28 <Vanhayes> #dict Crazies
05:28 <armabot> Vanhayes: No definition for "Crazies" could be found.
05:28 <Vanhayes> guess I made it up
05:28 <Vanhayes> #dict Crazys
05:28 <armabot> Vanhayes: No definition for "Crazys" could be found.
05:52 -!- Commn [i=lksdfn@cpe-65-29-121-215.twmi.res.rr.com] has joined #armagetron
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06:11 <Your_mom_arma> did inv kick you fonk?
06:24 <DrJoeTron> uh
06:24 <DrJoeTron> how are you able to talk more than 2letters
06:26 <Your_mom_arma> i could only say 4 letters not enough to fix it
06:26 <Your_mom_arma> sorry
06:27 <Your_mom_arma> who did it?
06:32 -!- Fonkay [i=Fonkay@blk-89-218-73.eastlink.ca] has quit []
06:35 <DrJoeTron> probably invader did
06:36 <Your_mom_arma> that wasnt cool
06:41 <DrJoeTron> yeah it wasnt
06:42 -!- DrJoeTron [n=DrJoeTr0@adsl-67-36-181-241.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
06:49 <Your_mom_arma> Lucifer_arma: http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/income-guide/adsense-tips.html
06:49 <Your_mom_arma> http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/income-guide/
06:55 -!- manta [n=kim@64-118-125-125-as-07.dialin.oakhurst.sti.net] has quit ["Ex-Chat"]
07:30 -!- Your_mom_arma [n=Jacob@pool-151-204-69-159.delv.east.verizon.net] has quit ["bye."]
07:40 -!- Vanhayes [n=Vanhayes@stjhnbsu83w-156034246197.nb.aliant.net] has quit [""Quitted Quitting""]
09:00 -!- GodTodd [n=GodTodd@cpe-76-183-44-91.tx.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
09:22 -!- GodTodd [n=GodTodd@cpe-76-183-44-91.tx.res.rr.com] has joined #armagetron
09:56 -!- GodTodd [n=GodTodd@cpe-76-183-44-91.tx.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
--- Log closed Sat Nov 04 10:04:56 2006
--- Log opened Sat Nov 04 11:13:34 2006
11:13 -!- wrtlprnft [n=wrtlprnf@ppp-82-135-0-2.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined #armagetron
11:13 -!- Irssi: #armagetron: Total of 12 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 12 normal]
11:13 -!- Irssi: Join to #armagetron was synced in 5 secs
--- Log closed Sat Nov 04 11:17:22 2006
--- Log opened Sat Nov 04 21:19:09 2006
21:19 -!- wrtlprnft [n=wrtlprnf@85.233.38.240] has joined #armagetron
21:19 -!- Irssi: #armagetron: Total of 18 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 18 normal]
21:19 -!- Irssi: Join to #armagetron was synced in 4 secs
21:19 <Vanhayes> #ping
21:19 <armabot> pong
21:20 <guru3> gnip
21:21 <wrtlprnft> gnip?
21:21 <guru3> ping backwards
21:21 <wrtlprnft> duh
21:21 <guru3> :>
21:21 <guru3> someone's supposed to say gnop
21:21 <wrtlprnft> gnop
21:21 <wrtlprnft> :P
21:22 <guru3> :ED
21:22 <guru3> -E
21:23 * wrtlprnft doesn't think the smiley with the E looks like something nice
21:23 <guru3> haha yeah
21:23 <guru3> typo\
21:23 <guru3> trying to press shift and d
21:23 <wrtlprnft> yeah, of course
21:23 <guru3> without cantilevering my keyboard off the desk
21:23 <wrtlprnft> grrrr
21:24 <wrtlprnft> always right after i start opera and reload the forums the index page appears with all the unread forums marked
21:24 <wrtlprnft> then a second later it reloads and everything's marked red
21:25 <guru3> :/
21:25 <wrtlprnft> *read, of course
21:26 <guru3> maybe make it so that you can manually set the last time you logged into the forums
21:27 <wrtlprnft> would be an idea
22:07 <Luke-Jr_> wrtlprnft: check your non-backlogs
--- Log closed Sat Nov 04 23:02:53 2006
--- Log opened Sat Nov 04 23:02:58 2006
23:02 -!- wrtlprnft [n=wrtlprnf@85.233.38.240] has joined #armagetron
23:02 -!- Irssi: #armagetron: Total of 17 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 17 normal]
23:03 -!- Irssi: Join to #armagetron was synced in 10 secs
23:03 <wrtlprnft> duh
23:03 <wrtlprnft> don't press ctrl-s in irssi in a screen and then wonder why noone's writing anything in any channel
23:05 <wrtlprnft> Luke-Jr_: what am i supposed to see there? I was offline for the better part of today.
23:05 <wrtlprnft> and i didn't miss a turn, i think
23:10 <Luke-Jr_> wrtlprnft: you seem to like advertising for me, and besides I'm almost going out of biz
23:10 <Luke-Jr_> wrtlprnft: so if someone you refer to me buys hosting, I'll send you $2 =p
23:11 <Lucifer_arma> why going out of business?
23:11 <Luke-Jr_> just email/CC me whenever you post/email someone about it ;p
23:11 * Lucifer_arma notes that the right plunger makes the difference between a flowing toilet and a bathroom covered in shit
23:11 <Luke-Jr_> Lucifer_arma: not enough business?
23:12 <Luke-Jr_> only hosting 2 people now, 1 of which is considering closing their server
23:12 <Lucifer_arma> Luke-Jr_: it takes a minimum of 1 year to get established. i.e. most businesses fail in the first year. Can't expect to become profitable until pretty much the 7th quarter
23:12 <Lucifer_arma> so if you give up now, it's either you didn't have enough cash or you didn't give it enough time
23:12 <Luke-Jr_> for a month-to-month service, 0 customers = out of business more or less....
23:13 <Lucifer_arma> that's why it's called capitalism. You need capital to start a business. :)
23:13 <Lucifer_arma> you need enough money to operate continuously for 2 years without any revenue at all
23:13 <Luke-Jr_> Lucifer_arma: does DEDICATED_FPS really matter (you say so on the wiki)?
23:13 <Lucifer_arma> where it comes from doesn't matter. If it's a big pile you start with, or if you get regular cash payments from somewhere or something
23:13 <Luke-Jr_> what's to operate w/o a customer, when you just provide service?
23:13 <Lucifer_arma> it makes a difference in CPU load
23:14 <Luke-Jr_> Lucifer_arma: I mean for latency
23:14 <Lucifer_arma> Luke-Jr_: that's assuming worst case you get no customers
23:14 <Luke-Jr_> the NEWS file says it's irrelevant now
23:14 <Luke-Jr_> Lucifer_arma: w/o customers, there's no business when it's just hosting...
23:14 <Luke-Jr_> there's no expenses or anything to run
23:14 <Lucifer_arma> well, for latency it's a collateral effect. If you have too many clients for your CPU to handle, sometimes decreasing DEDICATED_FPS makes a difference
23:14 <Luke-Jr_> hm
23:15 <Lucifer_arma> Luke-Jr_: then you should stay with it for a lot longer. If you can afford to operate without customers, then you should keep going for at least another 7-9 months and keep doing what you're doing
23:15 <Lucifer_arma> you see, a business doesn't survive on the customers it makes today. It survives ont he customers it made *yesterday*. By establishing relationships with them and so forth.
23:15 <Luke-Jr_> ...
23:16 <Lucifer_arma> so you have to be in business long enough to establish enough of those relationships. Your growth comes from your repeat customers.
23:16 <Luke-Jr_> there's *nothing to operate*
23:16 <Luke-Jr_> without customers
23:16 <Lucifer_arma> how long have you been operating so far?
23:16 <Luke-Jr_> between 3 and 4 months
23:16 <Lucifer_arma> can you afford to operate for 9-12 more months?
23:16 <Lucifer_arma> without any customers?
23:17 <Luke-Jr_> there's nothing to operate...
23:17 <wrtlprnft> Luke-Jr_: i'm not actually trying to advertise you
23:17 <spidey> lol
23:17 <Lucifer_arma> so you don't pay any money if you don't have any customers?
23:17 <Luke-Jr_> wrtlprnft: well, you refer ppl to me =p
23:17 <Luke-Jr_> Lucifer_arma: not if I cancel my server rentals
23:17 <wrtlprnft> i just want to have them stop asking stupid questions about how to set up a winXP box to host an arma server
23:17 <Lucifer_arma> then you don't have any business to offer anybody...
23:17 <spidey> wrtlprnft, eh?
23:17 <spidey> it's simple
23:17 <Luke-Jr_> wrtlprnft: so why not make $2 doing it? :p
23:17 <spidey> click the .exe
23:17 <spidey> der
23:18 <spidey> xD
23:18 <Luke-Jr_> Lucifer_arma: sure I do
23:18 <Luke-Jr_> Lucifer_arma: I can rent a new box within a day
23:18 <Luke-Jr_> spidey: they don't want to leave their box turned on 24/7
23:18 <spidey> mine has been on 24/7 for the last 4 years
23:18 <spidey> except for 3-4hours here and there
23:18 <Luke-Jr_> they don't want to =p
23:18 <spidey> repares, moving, etc
23:18 <spidey> repairs to
23:18 <Luke-Jr_> but they definately want their arma game to be on 24/7
23:19 <Luke-Jr_> I found that funny ;p
23:19 <spidey> ....
23:19 <wrtlprnft> Luke-Jr_: trouble is, for $32/month you can almost get a full-blown Hetzner server w/ an amd64, unlimited traffic and a gigabit connection
23:19 <Luke-Jr_> they want to host their own 24/7 arma server, but don't know how and don't want their computer on 24/7
23:19 <Luke-Jr_> wrtlprnft: where?
23:19 <wrtlprnft> http://www.hetzner.de/rootserver.html
23:19 <wrtlprnft> that's a root server
23:20 <Luke-Jr_> which is?
23:20 <wrtlprnft> Luke-Jr_: http://www.hetzner.de/rootserver_en.html
23:20 <wrtlprnft> that might be better :P
23:20 <spidey> #g 29 euros in USD
23:20 <armabot> spidey: 29 Euros = 36.9953 U.S. dollars
23:20 <spidey> not bad
23:20 <Luke-Jr_> #g 49 euros in USD
23:20 <armabot> Luke-Jr_: 49 Euros = 62.5093 U.S. dollars
23:20 <Luke-Jr_> 49 euro is the cheapest on that page =p
23:20 <Luke-Jr_> o
23:20 <wrtlprnft> and they have an excellent connection
23:20 <Luke-Jr_> eww, high setup fee
23:21 <wrtlprnft> setup fee doesn't matter, at least to me
23:21 <spidey> Monatlicher Grundpreis
23:21 <spidey> what's that mean?
23:21 <Lucifer_arma> well, actually, if you've got 1 loyal customer in 3-4 months, for your business, that's actually good
23:21 <wrtlprnft> i'm actually thinking about getting one of those
23:21 <Luke-Jr_> wrtlprnft: but it's non-managed
23:21 <wrtlprnft> spidey: use the second link
23:21 <spidey> oh
23:21 <Luke-Jr_> lol
23:22 <spidey> for $36
23:22 <spidey> that isn't bad
23:22 <wrtlprnft> i like the second one there for 39€
23:22 <Vanhayes> Luke-Jr_: how much money were you expecting from server hosting?
23:22 <wrtlprnft> 1gBit connection, and I know their hosting is excellent
23:22 <Luke-Jr_> Vanhayes: not much
23:22 <spidey> hmm
23:22 <spidey> i'll have to look into that later :D
23:22 <spidey> #g 39 EUROS in USD
23:22 <armabot> spidey: Google's calculator didn't come up with anything.
23:22 <spidey> ...
23:23 <wrtlprnft> CTWF is hosted on a server by that company, the one that's one notch weaker than the lowest one on that list
23:23 <spidey> #g 39 euros in USD
23:23 <armabot> spidey: 39 Euros = 49.7523 U.S. dollars
23:23 <spidey> not bad at all
23:23 <spidey> concidering i'm paying $50 for what i got now xD
23:23 <spidey> well...really $30 the rest has been donations o.O
23:23 <Luke-Jr_> the catch w/ those servers are bandwidth
23:23 <wrtlprnft> spidey: what have you got?
23:23 <wrtlprnft> Luke-Jr_: 1 GBit is enough, really
23:24 <Luke-Jr_> wrtlprnft: 200 GB/mo isn't
23:24 <Luke-Jr_> not for more than a few arma servers
23:24 <wrtlprnft> Luke-Jr_: talking about the second one
23:24 <wrtlprnft> the DS 3000
23:24 <Luke-Jr_> ah
23:24 <wrtlprnft> unlimited
23:24 <wrtlprnft> just need to click a button after you hit TB
23:24 <Luke-Jr_> well, before I could afford that, I'd need at least a few more Europe customers
23:24 <wrtlprnft> *hit 1TB
23:24 <Luke-Jr_> especially if I were to drop prices
23:25 <wrtlprnft> Luke-Jr_: we could share a server?
23:25 <Luke-Jr_> wrtlprnft: we who?
23:25 <Luke-Jr_> maybe
23:25 <wrtlprnft> I'd host some ct server on there and other crap
23:25 <Luke-Jr_> you're CT now?
23:25 <wrtlprnft> there isn't any bandwidth to worry about
23:25 <wrtlprnft> no, not in the clan
23:25 <Luke-Jr_> sounds good
23:25 <wrtlprnft> but admin on the servers
23:25 <Luke-Jr_> I'll bbiab tho
23:25 <wrtlprnft> ok
23:25 <Luke-Jr_> see who else might be interested
23:25 <Luke-Jr_> maybe
23:26 <Luke-Jr_> the setup fee is annoying tho
23:26 <wrtlprnft> well, they don't want you to get the server and quit after a month
23:26 <wrtlprnft> i like that more than being bound to some contract for 12 months or so
23:26 <wrtlprnft> that exists as well
23:27 <Luke-Jr_> my US host is month-by-month w/o a setup fee =p
23:27 <Luke-Jr_> and all the plans are unmetered
23:27 <Luke-Jr_> but, bbiab
23:27 <Luke-Jr_> :)
23:27 <Lucifer_arma> well, the perceived quality isn't terribly good right now
23:27 <wrtlprnft> anyways, the CT server is hosted there, so you can be sure that the quality is OK
23:28 <Luke-Jr_> Lucifer_arma: seems fine for me, and the customer hosted on it
23:28 <wrtlprnft> and they do have a manual on how to install gentoo on their machines
23:28 <Luke-Jr_> wrtlprnft: I never get good pings at CT =p
23:28 <Lucifer_arma> the pings are good, but there are pretty nasty lag slides
23:28 <Luke-Jr_> I use Debian for my hosting ATM
23:28 <Luke-Jr_> BBIAB!!
23:28 <Luke-Jr_> :p
23:28 <wrtlprnft> yeah, go!
23:28 <Lucifer_arma> when I'm playing in one that you're hosting (either as an ad or whathaveyou), people there complain about the lag slides
23:28 <wrtlprnft> Lucifer_arma: not bad at all for me, and hasn't been too bad from canada
23:28 <Vanhayes> Ct ping is good for me its the fps, but thats probly the size of the maps
23:29 <wrtlprnft> well, they aren't square maps
23:29 <spidey> wrtlprnft, win2k vps
23:29 <wrtlprnft> ?
23:29 <spidey> 10gigs space, 50gb bandwith
23:29 <Vanhayes> ya, that one chico hourglass is the worst for fps
23:29 <spidey> that's $25
23:29 <spidey> then webhosting with ssh for whatever i want
23:29 <spidey> $9
23:30 <spidey> then the soldat server $14.99
23:30 <wrtlprnft> 50gb bandwidth = nothing
23:30 <wrtlprnft> not for an arma server, anyways
23:30 <spidey> it hosts the website and a soldatserver
23:30 <wrtlprnft> ctwf is consuming some 7GB a day
23:31 * spidey doesn't do armahosting
23:31 <spidey> =p
23:31 <spidey> that's Luke-Jr_ 's thing
23:31 <spidey> i'ma be doing webhosting whenever i get unlazy
23:31 <Vanhayes> well hes trying to make it his thing
23:31 <spidey> lol
23:31 <Lucifer_arma> no, he's trying to give up
23:31 <wrtlprnft> no, can't be 7GB/month
23:32 <Vanhayes> right, he was trying to make it his thing yesturday
23:32 <wrtlprnft> but close to 100GB/month
23:32 <Vanhayes> #g 100/ 28
23:32 <armabot> Vanhayes: 100 / 28 = 3.57142857
23:32 <wrtlprnft> 3.5GB/month in february
23:32 <spidey> #g 99 euros in USD
23:32 <armabot> spidey: 99 Euros = 126.2943 U.S. dollars
23:33 <spidey> if it wasn't for that damned setup fee =(
23:33 <Vanhayes> well I consider 4 weeks a month, as in day->week->month->year etc
23:34 <wrtlprnft> spidey: if you're gonna keep the server for a year it's some 10$/month, though
23:34 <wrtlprnft> and i'd probably keep it longer
23:34 <spidey> o.O
23:34 <spidey> 10euros?
23:34 <wrtlprnft> dollars
23:34 <wrtlprnft> 126/12 is about 10 :P
23:34 <spidey> hmm
23:35 <spidey> 126 = setup fee
23:35 <spidey> =p
23:35 <wrtlprnft> yep
23:35 <wrtlprnft> and if you're gonna keep it for a year it's 10/month
23:35 <spidey> hmm
23:35 <spidey> i COULD
23:35 <spidey> get 2 of those
23:35 <spidey> but not till feburary or may
23:36 <Vanhayes> why not untill then?
23:36 <spidey> i can't afford even that on my own =p
23:36 <spidey> my brother will help
23:36 <spidey> so not untill then
23:36 <spidey> and he's in kid-prision right now , rofl
23:37 <Vanhayes> how old is he?
23:37 <spidey> 15
23:38 -!- Legit [n=48c9461e@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has joined #armagetron
23:39 <Legit> hey luke, u ehrE?
23:39 <Vanhayes> too legit to quit
23:39 <spidey> 2 x 160 GB SATA HDD does that mean you get 2 160gb sata drives, or 2 that = 160
23:39 <spidey> Legit, don't wake him up, please =/
23:39 <Legit> sorry spidey... lol
23:39 <wrtlprnft> spidey: two of them
23:39 <spidey> sweet o.O
23:39 <Vanhayes> he said biab about 20 min ago
23:40 <spidey> so lets see
23:40 <spidey> hmm
23:40 <wrtlprnft> gonna play a wormux game, so i won't be here
23:40 <spidey> what's that?
23:40 <wrtlprnft> /join #wormux
23:41 <spidey> they got a windows port?
23:42 <wrtlprnft> no
23:42 <wrtlprnft> not yet, anyways
23:42 <wrtlprnft> it's very beta
23:42 <spidey> k
23:43 <wrtlprnft> until recently it all crashed if someone left the game
23:43 -!- Super [n=1805f2ec@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has joined #armagetron
23:43 <Vanhayes> ha
23:43 <Super> Hello
23:43 <Super> where can i buy a armagetron server?
23:43 <wrtlprnft> http://lightfoot.hashjr.org/
23:43 <wrtlprnft> Luke-Jr_: Luke-Jr_
23:44 <Super> how much does it cost
23:44 <Super> i want to buy a year of service
23:44 <Super> 16 players
23:44 <wrtlprnft> it's printed on the page...
23:44 <Legit> 20 a month
23:44 <Super> ok
23:44 <Legit> for 16
23:44 <wrtlprnft> #g 20*12
23:44 <armabot> wrtlprnft: 20 * 12 = 240
23:44 <Super> how can i trust that i won't be ripped off once he makes server
23:44 <wrtlprnft> $240
23:44 <Super> once i pay him*
23:44 <Legit> super? he wont refund u either
23:45 <wrtlprnft> ask him, he's gonna be back in a bit
23:45 <wrtlprnft> Luke-Jr_, that is
23:45 <Super> luke-jr?
23:45 <Super> whos that?
23:45 <Super> my name isn't luke jr
23:45 <Legit> how do i leave a message again?
23:45 <wrtlprnft> arma developer and once in a while player
23:45 <Super> and why would i ask him?
23:45 <wrtlprnft> Legit: #later tell nick message
23:46 <Legit> thank
23:46 <Legit> s
23:46 <wrtlprnft> because he's offering it
23:46 <Super> i see
23:46 <wrtlprnft> and his real name is somewhere
23:46 <Legit> #later tell luke-jr_ hey luke let me kno when u egt back cause the server isnt working... it wont elt me put it up
23:46 <armabot> Legit: The operation succeeded.
23:46 <Super> his server won't work?
23:47 <wrtlprnft> hmm, it's not in the AUTHORS file
23:47 <Legit> is there any one else who hsots besides lukejr?
23:47 <wrtlprnft> well, i suggest you wait for him to return and sort it out
23:47 <wrtlprnft> not commercially, i think
23:47 <Super> i don't really like the sound of luke-jr
23:47 <Super> his servers don't work
23:48 <Vanhayes> ?
23:48 <Vanhayes> they work pretty good
23:48 <Super> legit just say that the server isn't up
23:48 <Super> and it wont let him put it back up
23:49 <Super> are you all luke's buisness partners
23:49 <wrtlprnft> not really
23:49 <[dlh]> haha, no.
23:49 <Super> not really? you are partly his partners?
23:49 <Super> ok
23:49 <wrtlprnft> err, i'm not
23:49 <spidey> never
23:49 <spidey> i'd kill him and take over
23:49 <spidey> bwahaha
23:49 <Super> calm down buddy
23:49 <Legit> lol spidey
23:50 <Super> don't cream your paernts
23:50 <wrtlprnft> you could rent some vserver, though, you'd just need to figure out how to use it :P
23:50 <spidey> ....
23:50 <spidey> lol
23:50 <Super> vps hosting
23:50 <Super> correct?
23:50 <spidey> Super, do what?
23:50 <Super> cream your parents.
23:50 <Super> pants*
23:50 <spidey> ....
23:51 <Super> spidey hasn't discovered the use of his penis yet i'm guessing
23:51 <Super> or hasn't had the oportunity to use it
23:51 <Lucifer_arma> anybody ever use CentOS?
23:51 <wrtlprnft> not me
23:51 <Super> why would we?
23:51 <Super> this is a server room, for hosting
23:51 <wrtlprnft> err, now
23:51 <wrtlprnft> *no
23:51 <Super> for armagetron server hosting
23:51 <wrtlprnft> this ais a general armagetron room
23:52 <wrtlprnft> *is
23:52 <Lucifer_arma> I'm luke's partner, I make him wear a rubber, he hates it
23:52 <spidey> lol
23:52 <Super> ok, well i would liek to order a year of hosting
23:52 <Super> the 2 circle type
23:53 <spidey> luke's giving up on hosting! xD
23:53 <Super> i wish to preview his service for a month before paying, because i'm not sure if he will stop service once i pay
23:53 <spidey> ...
23:53 <Super> he is? i was going to pay up to 800 dollars for armagetron hosting of 3 servers
23:53 <spidey> nah, lol
23:54 <wrtlprnft> he's considering it for the lack of customers
23:54 <Super> i don't like this
23:54 <Super> i can't even contact him
23:54 <Super> right now, i'm stuck with your munchkins
23:54 <spidey> o.O
23:54 <Super> his*
23:54 * spidey minimizes for Luke-Jr_ 's sake
23:54 <wrtlprnft> Super: don't expect him to answer within a few minutes at any time of the day
23:54 <spidey> xD
23:54 <Super> well, he isn't a good person to buy from then
23:55 <wrtlprnft> holy crap
23:55 <Super> if i buy a ipod at all, i'd expect to walk into the store and get service
23:55 <Super> within the first 15 minutes
23:55 <spidey> ...
23:55 <wrtlprnft> even at night?
23:55 <wrtlprnft> on sunday?
23:55 <wrtlprnft> i wanna see that store
23:55 <spidey> rofl
23:55 <Super> on sunday
23:55 <Super> at 3 pm yes.
23:55 <Super> actually on saturday at 3 pm*
23:55 <wrtlprnft> well, it would be sunday here
23:56 <wrtlprnft> almost at least
23:56 <Super> well, your retarded
23:56 <spidey> he's fro mthe future
23:56 <Super> from the future of losers
23:56 * spidey loves the ignore button
23:56 <spidey> =)
23:56 <Super> ok well i don't think i'm going to be buying hosting now
23:56 <Super> since his little partners are jerk bags
23:56 <Super> bye.
23:56 -!- Super [n=1805f2ec@h10487.serverkompetenz.net] has quit ["CGI:IRC"]
23:56 <wrtlprnft> o_O
23:57 <[dlh]> Nice joke. We've been punked.
23:57 <spidey> he's kidding...right?
23:57 <wrtlprnft> yeah
23:57 <wrtlprnft> i guess so, too
23:57 <wrtlprnft> never heard of that guy, anyways
23:58 <Vanhayes> wow, glad I missed most of that
23:58 <Lucifer_arma> that was probably luke testing us to see if he'd support his server for him
23:58 <spidey> lol
23:58 <Vanhayes> love how he thought this room was for amagetron hosting only
23:58 <Lucifer_arma> well, if he was a real legitimate customer, then we just learned something
23:59 <spidey> isn't that jodas webbased irc thing?
23:59 <Lucifer_arma> not sure what, though
23:59 <spidey> the ip
23:59 <spidey> Lucifer_arma, he was a bigger retard than me? =p
23:59 <Vanhayes> that everyone has the right to refuse service is what I learned
23:59 <Lucifer_arma> er
View entire month
is a site that has tools, maps, and other various items. It orignally only existed as a server control panel, but I slowly began adding stuff such as a homepage and tools.
----
This is an LLM-free zone. In general, I am unwilling to use (fight with) any form of "GenAI" to write code for me. So, for the forseeable future, everything on this site will continue to be written by a very silly goose (wait that's me honk honk) with some parts written by other humans as well (silly hu-mon) rather than any plausible-series-of-words token-eating machine. Even my libraries are out of date, and suddenly that's a good thing!
(Although the style has changed several times and content has been added and changed, the base of this site has barely been updated since 2015. But it Ain't Broke!)
This site is also occasionally tested with older browsers, but compatibility is not guarenteed. Although, if you have an old obscure browser and something isn't working that previously did, I guess you can tell me (nelg) about it...
Gridder
.