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Log from 2008-07-25:
--- Day changed Fri Jul 25 2008
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00:50 <Flex> Lucifer, http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?t=18566
00:51 <Lucifer> Flex: I hope you're telling me about that thread because you actually want me to ask you to just update the current tutorials on the wiki
00:51 <epsy> lol
00:51 <Lucifer> where fortress play was covered in depth a year ago or so, but hasn't been updated since
00:52 <Flex> more importantly.. something to end this thing about a tutorial..
00:52 <Flex> brb
00:57 <luke-jr> Pathetique: Flash is utter trash
00:57 <Pathetique> That's nice.
00:57 <Pathetique> ¬.¬
00:57 <Monkey_arma> luke-jr agreed
00:58  * Monkey_arma does not use flash
00:58 <Pathetique>  /admin rename luke-jr Captain Buzzkill
00:58 <luke-jr> Monkey_arma: you're not allowed to agree with me
00:58  * Monkey_arma disagrees with luke-jr 
00:58  * Monkey_arma still does not use flash
00:59 <epsy> /admin ACCESS_LEVEL AGREE_WITH_LUKE 0
00:59 <Pathetique> I suggested flash because of the fact that almost every browser comes with it now and the fact that it is easy to animate things in
01:00 <Pathetique> Often times I've found myself playing against other teenagers, and nothing explains a concept like a picture
01:00 <Monkey_arma> Pathetique no not every browser comes with it
01:00 <Pathetique> I know
01:00 <Monkey_arma> its a separate plugin
01:00 <Pathetique> That's why I said almost
01:00 <Monkey_arma> im talking about firefox
01:00 <Monkey_arma> and probably others
01:00 <Pathetique> yes
01:00 <Pathetique> well
01:00 <Pathetique> lets not nitpick
01:00 <Pathetique> <.<
01:01 <Lucifer> if you don't want to nitpick, don't talk to luke-jr (hi there!)
01:01 <Pathetique> I wasn't...lol
01:01 <epsy> lol
01:01 <Monkey_arma> Pathetique> I suggested flash because of the fact that almost every browser comes with it no <--- NO that is NOT correct (dBd style btw)
01:01 <epsy> Liza, :O !
01:01 <Pathetique> -.-
01:01 <Pathetique> Back on track.
01:02 <Monkey_arma> i dont think ANY browsers come with it
01:02 <epsy> Track on back!
01:02 <Liza> ?
01:02 <luke-jr> Monkey_arma: not afaik
01:02 <Pathetique> Monkey, I get the point.
01:02 <luke-jr> Pathetique: you get that you're 100% wrong?
01:02 <Pathetique> I don't think there's any need to beat a dead horse, yaddamean?
01:02 <luke-jr> are you dead yet?
01:02 <Pathetique> ...
01:02 <luke-jr> if not, we can keep beating you
01:02 <luke-jr> :D
01:02 <Pathetique> Anyways.
01:03 <StickyNoob> Pathetique: on a side note i seem to remember that the jvm has better penetration than flash
01:03 <Pathetique> Flash is easy enough to animate with, and allows for step by step demonstrations of Fortress tactics that cannot be shown as such in the game.
01:03 <epsy> :O
01:03 <epsy> Liza, :O !
01:03 <Monkey_arma> jvm = java virtual machine?
01:03 <Pathetique> yes
01:03 <StickyNoob> yeah
01:04 <epsy> jerking virtual motherfucker!
01:04 <Monkey_arma> oh noes java vs flash
01:04 <Monkey_arma> java ftL
01:04 <Monkey_arma> flash ftL
01:04 <StickyNoob> fd
01:04 <StickyNoob> oops
01:04 <StickyNoob> fair enough
01:04 <epsy> yeah but Liza ftw tho
01:04 <StickyNoob> each to his own
01:05 <luke-jr> Java at least isn't abused like Flash
01:05 <epsy> /admin ACCESS_LEVEL AGREE_WITH_LUKE 25
01:05 <Pathetique> But Java can be a huge resource whore.
01:05 <epsy> agreed
01:05 <StickyNoob> myth
01:05 <Pathetique> Poorly written java?
01:06 <Monkey_arma> java = c++ - speed + memory-waste -freedom_to_do_non_compatible_things_if_you_want_to
01:06 <luke-jr> StickyNoob: no, Java is a huge resource hog
01:06 <epsy> sun is about to free java
01:06 <luke-jr> epsy: about to?
01:06 <epsy> ..trough they didn't do it yet
01:06 <luke-jr> I thought they did
01:06 <StickyNoob> luke-jr: its a huge ram hog for small programs due to jvm
01:06 <luke-jr> months ago
01:06 <StickyNoob> for cpu its very competative
01:06 <epsy> no, they still have to rewrite some sound stuff or w/e
01:06 <Pathetique> This is true, Sticky.
01:06 <Monkey_arma> more importantly...who cares....java is not worth caring about
01:06 <luke-jr> StickyNoob: CPU isn't a matter of resources
01:07 <StickyNoob> p
01:07 <Pathetique> idk
01:07 <StickyNoob> cpu cycles are a resource
01:07 <Monkey_arma> java < c++
01:07 <luke-jr> C++ < C
01:07 <epsy> xD
01:07 <Pathetique> TI-BASIC ftw.
01:07 <StickyNoob> well if you define resources as ram yes java is a hog
01:07 <Pathetique> lolz
01:07 <luke-jr> anyhow, neither C nor C++ are browser-embeddable
01:07 <Monkey_arma> c < visual basic
01:07 <Monkey_arma> (j/k)
01:07 <luke-jr> Monkey_arma wants to be hung
01:07 <epsy> luke-jr, are you sure? :P
01:07 <Pathetique> C < FORTRAN?
01:08 <epsy> Pathetique, Exactly!
01:08 <Pathetique> LOL!
01:08 <luke-jr> ECMAScript > Java > Flash
01:08 <StickyNoob> micro code ftw
01:08 <epsy> C < B
01:08 <Monkey_arma> > D
01:08 <Pathetique> lol epsy
01:08 <epsy> Motherfucker < Bitch
01:08 <epsy> Zomfg!
01:08 <Monkey_arma> luke-jr agreed
01:09  * Monkey_arma agrees in a disagreeing fashion just to please luke
01:09 <Pathetique> anyways, flash can be pretty, most everyone has it now (better? XP)
01:09 <Monkey_arma> if that guy in the forums can make tron in javascript..
01:09 <Monkey_arma> enough said
01:09 <luke-jr> Pathetique: Flash must die
01:10 <luke-jr> Monkey_arma: it was buggy
01:10 <Pathetique> That's nice.
01:10 <Monkey_arma> but it was technical
01:10 <StickyNoob> it would probably be quite easy to do tron in java script
01:10 <Pathetique> At this point, luke, IDGAF.
01:10 <epsy> StickyNoob, it's already done
01:10 <luke-jr> Pathetique: you're fired
01:10 <luke-jr> StickyNoob: Arma protocol-compatibility would be
01:11 <luke-jr> difficult, that is
01:11 <StickyNoob> well yeah
01:11 <epsy> StickyNoob, http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?t=18165&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=60
01:11 <epsy> there: http://www.jangaron.net/
01:12 <StickyNoob> hmm that site dosent work for me
01:12 <epsy> good start
01:12 <StickyNoob> "enter the grid" does nothing
01:13 <epsy> try the mini version maybe
01:13 <Pathetique> enter the grid takes you to something you can't control very easily
01:14 <luke-jr> StickyNoob: it's buggy
01:14 <luke-jr> it seems to work in Arora tho
01:16 <StickyNoob> think its FF3 it has a problem with
01:17 <StickyNoob> i need to get back into c++, been far too long
01:18 <Monkey_arma> me too
01:18 <Monkey_arma> c++ ftw
01:19 <Monkey_arma> oh and c ftw
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01:22 <StickyNoob> there is far too much language elietism tho... http://xkcd.com/378/ just change all the editor names into languages
01:22 <Pathetique> LOL
01:24 <Monkey_arma> besides vim is faster than butterflies
01:24 <StickyNoob> Monkey_arma clearly misses the point
01:24 <Monkey_arma> no i dont
01:24 <Monkey_arma> u miss the joking im doing
01:25 <Pathetique> lolz
01:25 <Monkey_arma> any way c++ 1z t3h h0nl3y 1337 w4y 2 d0 17
01:26 <luke-jr> StickyNoob: it never worked in Konq 3
01:28 <StickyNoob> hmm
01:32 <StickyNoob> hmm there is an iphone jailbreak
01:33 <StickyNoob> *3g
01:33 <Pathetique> already? o.0
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01:36 <StickyNoob> id still quite like an openmoko tho
01:38 <Pathetique> openmoko?
01:38 <StickyNoob> an open architecture phone
01:39 <Pathetique> ic
01:39 <StickyNoob> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Openmoko
01:40 <epsy> Pathetique, check out the forums, i put a link to an article linking to an article that links it
01:40 <Pathetique> Cool
01:40 <Pathetique> wut
01:40 <epsy> (the iphone jailbreak)
01:40 <Pathetique> oh
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01:42 <Lizmatic> I ordered the iPhone 3G :)
01:42 <Lizmatic> cant wait till it comes :|
01:43  * Pathetique turns off his brain for a few moments to avoid becoming jealous
01:44  * Pathetique reactivates
01:44  * epsy hopes Lizmatic hasnt made a bad deal
01:45 <StickyNoob> Pathetique: if you need to feel superior just look at your bank balance http://voices.allthingsd.com/files/2008/07/1125.jpg
01:46 <Pathetique> LMAO
01:47 <epsy> :D
01:47 <Pathetique> Is that true, though?
01:48 <epsy> that you will be millionnaire if you dont buy an iphone?
01:48  * Pathetique was going to get the 16 GB iPhone 3G :S
01:49 <Pathetique> No, that's a possible outcome from not getting it.
01:49 <Pathetique> And also they don't say how much you'd have to invest.
01:49 <Pathetique> Probably the amount you'd pay out in order to have the iPhone
01:49 <epsy> it's not meant to be accurate you know
01:49 <Pathetique> Sticky, that made my day.
01:49 <Pathetique> :D
01:50 <StickyNoob> it ignores the time value of money
01:50 <StickyNoob> when you retire 1000000 will be worth alot less than it is today
01:50 <Pathetique> Indeed.
01:50 <Pathetique> I was just about to say, "You mean inflation?"
01:51 <Pathetique> #roulette
01:51 <armabot> Pathetique: *click*
01:51 <epsy> #roulotte
01:51 <epsy> :O
01:52 <epsy> #alias ass roulotte echo $who: *click*
01:52 <epsy> #alias add roulotte echo $who: *click*
01:52 <armabot> epsy: The operation succeeded.
01:52 <epsy> that's a COMMON typo
01:52 <epsy> #roulotte
01:52 <armabot> epsy: *click*
01:52 <StickyNoob> also at 10% interest it would take almost 50 years for 10000 to turn into 1 million
01:54 <Pathetique> lol
01:54 <Pathetique> Exactly, by the time you retire.
01:54 <Pathetique> And that's assuming you don't have any money crisees
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01:54 <StickyNoob> only if you are 15
01:54 <Pathetique> ugh god AT&T is so fucking pushy
01:55 <Lucifer> well, if it's USD, then you'll actually lose 3/4 of it's value
01:55 <epsy> what did you think exactly
01:55 <Lucifer> so you're better off putting the same money into assets
01:55 <Pathetique> Indeed
01:55 <Lucifer> like a car that will be a classic in that time :)
01:55 <StickyNoob> Lucifer: what is us inflation atm?
01:55 <Pathetique> LOL
01:55 <Lucifer> StickyNoob: pretty high
01:55 <Pathetique> 1 Euro  = something like $1.70
01:55 <epsy> nice comparison
01:55 <Pathetique> mhm
01:56 <Pathetique> raep
01:56 <Pathetique> is what its called
01:56 <Pathetique> there needs to be less "lets trade paper" and more "lets develop wealth through resources that are available to us" in this country ><
01:56 <StickyNoob> UK is doing ok since the banks are desperate for cash the banks are offering great interest rates on their accounts
01:57 <Pathetique> The key interest rate in the US is something like 2.75%, I think...so interest rates are down here, too...
01:57 <Pathetique> Which is bad, because my parents are going to be redoing the house soon
01:57 <Pathetique> and they have money left to them by my grandfather that is effected by the stock market
01:58 <StickyNoob> naa nows the time to sell, wait for the housing market to crash then buy again
01:58 <Pathetique> They already have a zoning variance...now they're just waiting on the architect.
01:58 <Pathetique> There's nothing within their price range in our town, and they really wanna stay here
01:59 <Pathetique> A house that would probabl go for $125k in a place like oklahoma or something would go for around $250k in my town
01:59 <Pathetique> Time to go make dinner. Bbl.
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02:00 <StickyNoob> well thats just property, the place i rent is probably worth 100k maby, in london it would probably be near 3-400
02:09 <epsy> sigh
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02:41 <Flex> only 100k? pff
02:43 <Flex> mines only on the 200k range..
02:43 <Flex> considering the location
02:43 <Flex> pretty poor
02:44 <Flex> Lucifer, on that subject.. i'm not saying update the wiki or give me some sort of credit..
02:45 <Flex> i'm talking about a proper FAQ guide/tutorial
02:45 <Flex> read the thread..
02:50 <Flex> anyway.. i don't think there's anybody stepping up to do this.. i'm not prepared to write the whole thing.. i wanted people to contribute to the information
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02:57 <Monkey_arma> Lucifer basically, the wiki sucks
02:57 <Monkey_arma> thats his point
02:57 <Monkey_arma> which i agree with
02:58 <Lucifer> but neither one of you can be bothered to write good, well-informed articles on the wiki
02:58 <Lucifer> I don't get it
02:58 <Flex> no, the wiki don't suck Monkey_arma! the wiki isn't visible..
02:58 <Monkey_arma> i hate the wiki and wikis in general
02:58 <Flex> Lucifer, just like the screenshot section
02:58 <Lucifer> the whole point of having a wiki is that you people who complain there's no docs and want to make some can have a place to do so
02:58 <Flex> needs to be in a position where people can read it
02:58 <Flex> notice the "official stamp"
02:58 <Monkey_arma> when i do some docs they wont be going on the wiki thats for sure
02:58 <Flex> the part where the developers get involved..
02:59 <Lucifer> of course not, you're not likely to contribute anything useful
02:59 <Lucifer>  /ignore Monkey_arma
02:59 <Monkey_arma> if you wrote that wiki then fuck me
02:59 <Monkey_arma> back to your hole
02:59 <Flex> like i said Lucifer, there's no point to this if it just goes on the wiki.. it needs to have it's section like the screenshots page on the main site..
02:59 <Lucifer> so, Flex, are you saying you don't want to edit the wiki because it looks too official?
02:59 <Lucifer> er, no
03:00 <Lucifer> if FOrtress was the only type of game, then yes, I'd agree with you
03:00 <Lucifer> there are plenty of ways to make it possible for people to slice the wiki and find what they're looking for
03:00 <Lucifer> but since that requires work, I guess it's not happening
03:00 <Monkey_arma> i will write better docs than you thx
03:00  * Lucifer goes back to reading about rockets, that's more interesting than more of "the wiki sucks, but I'm too lazy to do anything about it" conversation
03:01 <Monkey_arma> gl with that...maybe you can get one to fly u to the moon
03:01 <Flex> Monkey_arma, my thread is there
03:01 <Monkey_arma> where?
03:01 <Flex> contribute to the information..
03:01 <Monkey_arma> flex at some point im gonna do complete doccs
03:01 <Flex> http://forums.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?p=198002#198002
03:01 <Monkey_arma> i seen it
03:02 <Flex> so we need parts to that..
03:02 <Monkey_arma> i dont work well mixed with other people
03:02 <Flex> haven't had the time to read
03:02 <Flex> LukeSky
03:02 <Monkey_arma> i will do my own docs
03:02 <Monkey_arma> others can do what they liek
03:02 <Flex> 's guide.. but that's pretty much what needs to be worked on
03:03 <Flex> see that's the problem.. there's no hope to this if people keep writing the same guides with different explainations everywhere
03:03 <Flex> but whatever.. GL to that
03:03 <Monkey_arma> thx
03:03 <Monkey_arma> my guides will be complete
03:04 <Lucifer> there's no hope to this if people keep writing the same guides with different explainations everywhere  <--- then why won't you update the guide that's already on the wiki?
03:04 <Lucifer> [20:06] [Ignore] Added Flex!* to your ignore list.
03:04 <Flex> that's what i'm planning on you crackface
03:05 <Flex> is he retarded..
03:05 <Monkey_arma> yes he is
03:05 <Monkey_arma> he makes luke-jr look just about acceptable
03:06 <StickyNoob> i think all these documentation efforts are misguided. i dont think anyone has entered Fort by reading a tutorial and thinking "yeah ill give it a go". the problem is people see a full server so wander in to take a look, then get shouted at and kicked
03:06 <StickyNoob> that is why there are almost no new players
03:07 <Monkey_arma> no thats not why
03:07 <Monkey_arma> people come to tron and either can see its for them or not
03:07 <Monkey_arma> just not many find out about tron
03:07 <Monkey_arma> the website need a severe overhaul for a start
03:07 <StickyNoob> are you talking about tron or fort here?
03:07 <Monkey_arma> both
03:08 <luke-jr> iPhone sux
03:08 <StickyNoob> ggod change of subject, but i agree
03:08 <StickyNoob> *good
03:09 <luke-jr> StickyNoob: usury is a sin
03:10 <StickyNoob> heh to those who believe in sin, yes
03:10 <luke-jr> and like Lucifer already pointed out, by the time you have a million, that million will be worthless :D
03:11 <StickyNoob> are you just summerising discussion with an hours lag?
03:11 <luke-jr> yes
03:23 <Flex> StickyNoob
03:23 <Flex> http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080723-telco-wont-install-fiber-sues-to-keep-city-from-doing-it.html
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03:38 <luke-jr> Flex: FIOS is mostly marketting anyhow
03:39 <Flex> it's not that. i'm mostly interested in that they're suing because the local area is taking their "market"
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--- Log closed Fri Jul 25 09:06:04 2008
--- Log opened Fri Jul 25 09:11:22 2008
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13:04 <kidanger> #sd deaths
13:04 <armabot> kidanger: (Auth-Sty) Avoid The Deaths Zones: Players (0/6):
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15:38 <Pathetique> lol@two Lizas
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15:41 <Liza> :D
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20:26 <madmax> #ls madmax
20:26 <armabot> madmax: madmax has last been seen on WILDCAT 3 hours 12 minutes ago.
20:27 <madmax> pff
20:36 <epsy> :D
20:36 <epsy> #ls epsy
20:36 <armabot> epsy: ¦×¦epsy has last been seen on Crazy Tronners Ladle Fortress 1 minute ago.
20:36 <epsy> Booo!
20:37 <epsy> #ls -g epsy@x
20:37 <armabot> epsy: SomeGuywithanam has last been seen on ¦×¦.4.Teams.Fortress.Server 30 days 6 hours 43 minutes ago.
20:37 <epsy> lol
20:37 <madmax> so café isn't coming back?
20:38 <epsy> ask wrtl's machine
20:38 <epsy> or it's owner
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22:07 <wrtlprnft_> epsy: i'm still waiting for any clue on what could be wrong
22:07 -!- You're now known as wrtlprnft
22:10 <epsy> hrm :/
22:11 <wrtlprnft> the interesting thing is, i tried installing another gentoo on the other harddrive
22:11 <wrtlprnft> it worked fine with 2007.x
22:11 <wrtlprnft> but failed with 2008.0
22:11 <epsy> did you give a go to the gentoo guys?
22:12 <wrtlprnft> well, i asked in #gentoo and noone answered
22:13 <epsy> how come i was sure you would say that
22:13 <epsy> forums?
22:14 <wrtlprnft> too lazy x_X
22:15 <epsy> that's the only way you will get them to speak
22:15 <wrtlprnft> i also have no explanation as to why the rescue system runs my binaries just fine
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22:16 <epsy> you can easly guess that i dont have any better clue on that
22:17 <wrtlprnft> i don't really have a lot of time for this crap right now is the real problem
22:17 <epsy> hm
22:18 <epsy> guess that will be your last kernel update for a while
22:18 <wrtlprnft> well, the problem doesn't appear to be the kernel itself
22:18 <wrtlprnft> as my old kernels refuse to run as well
22:19 <wrtlprnft> or, they run, but init traps
22:19 <epsy> are you able to see any error message?
22:19 <epsy> hm :|
22:20 <wrtlprnft> invalid instruction in ld-x.so
22:20 <Monkey_arma> *cough* gentoo ftl *cough*
22:20 <wrtlprnft> gentoo is getting *really* sucky, you've got a point there
22:20 <epsy> did you try using the interactive mode (of init) when it would boot?
22:20 <wrtlprnft> err
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22:21 <wrtlprnft> init=/bin/echo traps
22:21 <epsy> eh
22:21 <wrtlprnft> init doesn't ever get to run
22:23 <epsy> at that point i would try a full reinstall
22:23 <epsy> the problem with full reinstalls is that you only figure out you forgot to backup something when you just deleted everything :P
22:24 <wrtlprnft> that's no problem, the second HD is free
22:24 <wrtlprnft> but a vanilla gentoo stage3 has the same problem for me
22:25 <epsy> do you own the machine or..?
22:25 <wrtlprnft> i don't own the machine, no
22:25 <epsy> may be a material fuckup
22:26 <epsy> :X
22:26 <wrtlprnft> and all the tests i can do is reboot it and see if it comes back up or boot it in qemu and see what happens there
22:27 <epsy> maybe you should ask hetzner to check it up
22:27 <wrtlprnft> hmm
22:27 <wrtlprnft> maybe i'll try installing one of their os images
22:27 <epsy> good idea, if these doesnt work you have a strong point
22:28 <wrtlprnft> but right now i'll go to bed
22:28 <epsy> good idea too :) gn
22:28 <wrtlprnft> #night
22:28 <armabot> Good night wrtlprnft!
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22:55 <z-man> Haha, my wife was just declared 59 by Wii Sports :)
22:57 <epsy> :O
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23:22 <akira_arma> ahy not fedora?
23:22 <akira_arma> why*
23:36 <luke-jr> cuz it sucks?
23:36 <ct|kyle> because it is a pig
23:36 <xfroggy> lol
23:52 -!- joda_bot [n=anonymou@dslb-084-061-041-204.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit ["Leaving."]
23:54 <Lizmatic> boh
23:55 <xfroggy> Oo
23:57  * P4 doh
23:57 <ct|kyle> P4: spams
23:57  * xfroggy agrees
23:58 <luke-jr> ct|kyle: are you seconding my motion to +q p4?
23:58 <ct|kyle> no luke-jr
23:59 <luke-jr> then stfu
23:59 -!- akira_arma [n=chatzill@] has quit ["To hell with you."]

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Logs from 2006-2009 pulled from wrtlprnft
Format changes at: 2015-08-25, 2017-02-20, and 2020-03-23. Times (2015 and later) should be Eastern.

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