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Log from 2019-03-01:
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Log from 2019-03-02:
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[21:57:34] <tjohnw> Hey, anyone happen to have the download for the classic moviepack? The second one on this list http://wiki.armagetronad.org/index.php?title=Moviepacks_list. The download on the wiki seems broken :(
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Log from 2019-03-03:
[05:39:22] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1078 As far as I am aware, compiling 2.9 sty+ct+ap was incredibly...
[14:14:36] <Lucifer_arma> suddenly, rewriting my alarm clock as an android app is teasing my mental health in a good way
[14:15:04] <Lucifer_arma> anybody got an ios device they could use to test it when it's ready for testing?  Supposedly the toolkit I'm using is cross-platform enough that it includes ios support
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[18:09:55] <Z-Man> We have a reaaaaaly old IPhone (4?), but I don't feel competent installing anything on it. It was a gift and may still be half-locked to the previous owner.
[18:21:44] <Z-Man> tjohnw: Lucifer_arma created the package according to the wiki logs, I don't even know what it contains. But the very very old data files it must have contained are all in the old versions here:https://sourceforge.net/projects/armagetron/files/OldFiles/
[18:22:59] <Z-Man> And to answer your private query rudely in public: eDual is a typical bad C++ inheritance idea :)
[18:24:17] <Z-Man> The grid datastructures are known as half-edge mesh data structures. They consist of fixed size data elements for points, half-edges and faces.
[18:25:16] <Z-Man> A half-edge is an oriented edge pointing from one point to the other. Each half edge (except the outer ones) have a corresponding half-edge going the other direction; these two are linked.
[18:26:16] <Z-Man> Each half-edge also has a pointer to the origin point (no need to store the destination), the face it borders, and the next half-edge that borders that face.
[18:26:52] <Z-Man> A face merely stores a pointer to an arbitrarily assigned first half edge of its border.
[18:27:24] <Z-Man> A point also merely stores a pointer to the first half edge going out from it, and its coordinates of course.
[18:28:08] <Z-Man> Data structure wise, point and face are related in that they store a single edge pointer.
[18:29:07] <Z-Man> Mathematically/topologically, they're similarily related. Hence I gave them the common base class.
[18:29:41] <Z-Man> http://www.flipcode.com/archives/The_Half-Edge_Data_Structure.shtml <- helpful better explanation of the ideas with pictures
[18:30:50] <Z-Man> And the math isn't that complex. It's just regular plane euclidean geometry, mostly.
[18:32:27] <Z-Man> Of course, I had to nerd it up by using the fact that complex numbers can also be arranged in a plane; eCoord.Turn is essentially complex number multiplication. It's also euclidean rotation/scaling, so only half as scary as it sounds.
[18:33:52] <Z-Man> Holy moly, flipcode still exists?
[19:00:03] <tjohnw> Thats good news! I've been nerding out about half edge structures the last few days. (Via a crappy renderer I wrote to try and understand the concepts https://i.gyazo.com/7a30bc8f4659e92afac44541c19cf1c6.png lol)
[19:03:07] <tjohnw> I have an idea of how it works regarding tron, but this could be way off: Is the gist that, by using this structure, collision detection is simplified to "Am I intersecting with an edge of the face I am on/in? If so, does that half-edge have a player wall on it.."
[19:03:40] <tjohnw> Compared to something like: "Check every other wall on the grid to see if I
[19:03:51] <tjohnw> Will collide with it" lol
[19:12:22] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-armagetronad-sty+ct+ap] r1078 Adding spaces after *DEAD* and *SPEC* messages || [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1079 - Fixed *DEAD* and *SPEC*, previously there was no space bet...
[20:12:35] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1081 Merge from 1079 sty+ct+ap || [0.2.9-armagetronad-sty+ct+ap] r1080 Merge in revisions 1079 and 1080 of lp:~swag/armagetronad/0.... || [0.2.9-armagetronad-sty+ct+ap] r1079 Merge in revisions 1488 to 1505 || [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1080 - Renamed the previous player_random_color to player_unique_...
[20:42:38] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-armagetronad-sty+ct+ap] r1082 Missed a couple of instances of the British spelling of colo... || [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1082 Undesired change from merge || [0.2.9-armagetronad-sty+ct+ap] r1081 Removing spaces from dead messages as they're now in languag...
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[22:41:14] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: yeah, the only thing an iPhone 4 will prove is "Hello, World!", no matter how big the app.  Although, theoretically, if it works completely on such an old phone, it *should* work completely on something newer
[22:44:07] <Lucifer_arma> it's ok, though, because android is kicking ios's butt all over the market
[22:44:19] <Lucifer_arma> and I have android, and that's where it absolutely *needs* to run
[22:52:23] <tjohnw> Lucifer_arma: Out of curiosity, what toolkit are you using, is it like expo (React native)?
[22:54:47] <ct|kyle> It's gotta be Xamarin
[22:55:10] <ct|kyle> (in reality I kow Lucifer_arma would never touch Xamarin)

Log from 2019-03-04:
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[02:16:54] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: nope, not a chance
[02:17:29] <Lucifer_arma> tjohnw: kivy.  It uses pygame for its backend on desktop/laptop computers, so apps can be a bit weak there
[02:20:32] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: xamarin's actually interesting.  It's disappointing they completely left Linux out of the marketing page, but it should run via mono.
[02:20:53] <Lucifer_arma> mono's founder and one of the big GNOME guys founded Xamarin, too.  Miguel De Icaza.
[02:23:42] <Lucifer_arma> whoah, nevermind
[02:23:52] <Lucifer_arma> pyqt5 works in android.  I'll just use that.  :)
[02:23:58] * Lucifer_arma tosses kivy out the window.
[04:32:04] <Lucifer_arma> tjohnw: I wouldn't use expo, either.  I don't like javascript, and I still haven't seen a fast enough javascript app that could convince me to use javascript for an app.
[04:32:36] <Lucifer_arma> and yes, I use firefox every day.  It has serious performance and memory issues, but it's more generally useful than Chrome, which I only use when I need high performance
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[16:09:06] <Armanelgtron> tjohnw: pseudo-random question: do you have intentions to improve vectron in the future?
[16:24:06] <tjohnw> Hm, I haven't really thought about it much. I wrote it when I had a very naive understanding of modern javascript (does anyone _actually_ fully understand js tooling lets be honest).
[16:24:28] <tjohnw> Are there any big missing features or bugs that you want updated/fixed?
[16:38:28] <Armanelgtron> tjohnw: the ability to edit walls would be nice - right now I believe you have to remove walls or create each line as its own segment
[17:19:49] <tjohnw> Yeah thatd be pretty cool, like a point editor tool where you can pick a point of an already placed wall / drag it around or delete it to split the wall
[17:50:03] <Lucifer_arma> I'm having the urge to write a new armabell, heh.
[17:50:14] * Lucifer_arma wonders if he can find an old repo that has armabell in it
[17:51:30] <Lucifer_arma> nvm.  That's not the one I was thinking about.  It was ACME that I was thinking about.
[17:54:09] <Lucifer_arma> well, that was easy.  ACME still exists.
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[22:44:49] <Lucifer_arma> I am going to make ACME work tonight, I swear
[22:44:58] <Lucifer_arma> at least as well as it did before, no promises on new features ;)
[22:48:48] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1083 - Removed old player_random_color command....
[23:23:09] <tjohnw> Lucifer_arma: I'll try it out locally, I don't think I've used it before :) Is it more blue than armabell was hehe?

Log from 2019-03-05:
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[02:15:28] <Lucifer_arma> blue?
[02:49:51] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1085 Oops. Forgot these.. || [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1084 - Ported toggle from 0.4. Seems kind of hacky. Had to add an...
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[09:54:40] <tjohnw> Yeah on windows, at least from when I remember using it (It might have been someone elses version idk), something like https://i.gyazo.com/310631fc3e5edbd08b914e6af44acc00.png
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[15:12:37] <Lucifer_arma> tjohnw: that's not it, I don't think.  ACME is a desktop app, so your screenshot should have the window decorations and stuff.  It's not a web app at all.
[15:13:30] <Lucifer_arma> it's supposed to be our "official" resource editor.  It got it's name back when it was only going to be a map editor.  It could load a map and display it, and I was working on being able to edit the xml, with the intention of adding wysiwyg controls to it later.
[16:12:50] <Armanelgtron> armabell was also a desktop application, but IIRC it forces itself into fullscreen
[16:13:00] <Armanelgtron> and escape exits the application immediately, without asking to save
[16:30:12] <Z-Man> tjohnw: you got that right. Every game object (cycles and raycasting sensors) know which face they currently are on and when they move, they only have to check collisions with its surrounding edges.
[16:31:01] <Z-Man> Well, in the easy cases at least. There is complication when the grid gets modified (the game objects then have to find the new face they're on)
[16:31:40] <Z-Man> and not all collision relevant walls are in the grid datastructure. There are also temporary walls, the ones currently attached to cycles with one end.
[16:32:20] <Z-Man> I didn't know how to 100% dynamically integrate them into the grid tesselation, so I didn't.
[16:36:25] <Z-Man> Also, when the walls are inserted into the grid, it sometimes splits faces and adds extra vertices. That, too, could be avoided. Tesselation with constraints is well researched.
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Log from 2019-03-06:
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[17:39:46] <Lucifer_arma> good morning!
[17:39:58] <Lucifer_arma> ok, not really morning, but I haven't been awake long, so it still counts
[17:46:45] <Z-Man> Good morning, Lucifer_arma! And thanks for giving me my cue to finally go to bed!
[17:47:08] <Lucifer_arma> 'night!
[17:47:19] <Z-Man> Even though I'm not done fiddling with the new TV receiver card. Oh well.
[17:48:01] <Lucifer_arma> hey, I forced myself to go to bed last night even with dave's stupid alarm clock staring in my face
[18:30:12] <Lucifer_arma> ok, that's cool.  Google has a feature where you can get notified whenever your name gets mentioned somewhere on the web.
[19:59:00] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1087 Adding this so I don't need to close the server modules ever... || [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1086 Forgot these .nsi files.
[20:29:55] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/47695/how-to-write-startup-script-for-systemd  <-- basic way to plug in the existing initscript to systemd
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Log from 2019-03-07:
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[14:56:52] <Lucifer_arma> woo-hoo!  Gotta love addict thinking, heh.  My brain is trying to convince me I've been sober "long enough" and that "one night isn't going to hurt you"
[14:57:08] <Lucifer_arma> I knew this was coming, I just didn't know when ;)
[15:48:56] <Z-Man> Go wetware!
[17:43:56] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: https://wiki.qt.io/Using_3D_engines_with_Qt
[17:44:20] <Lucifer_arma> I'm currently researching (procrastinating) how to make an android port of arma during a prospective from-scratch rewrite
[17:48:11] <Lucifer_arma> https://discourse.panda3d.org/t/panda-in-pyqt/3964/27  <--- gets us to cross-platform desktops with PyQt5 as the widget library
[17:48:55] <Lucifer_arma> the client would have panda3d, PyQt5, and the python standard library as dependencies.  The server *could* have PyQt5 as a dependency, but doesn't have to, since everything *it* needs is in the python standard library
[17:49:31] <Lucifer_arma> the android/ios clients would need their own 3d engine, but could still use PyQt5 and the python standard library
[17:49:57] <Lucifer_arma> so, my tentative vote for a rewrite is Panda3d + PyQt5, arma code is pure python
[17:50:38] <Lucifer_arma> (it's only a tentative vote until someone actually tests this combination and clears it for the level of performance we need)
[17:53:00] <Lucifer_arma> of course, if we can find a way to get panda3d on android using the python interpreter that gets built for pyqt5 during deployment, then we're golden in all possible ways
[17:53:14] <Lucifer_arma> panda3d "works" on android as-is, but requires a fair amount of work
[17:53:59] <Lucifer_arma> but if we figure it out, we could contribute those changes upstream and let the panda3d team worry about maintaining them :)
[18:09:08] <Lucifer_arma> aaaand, with this:  https://doc.qt.io/qt-5/qt3d-index.html  <--- we can stick with C++ and switch to Qt5, which will eliminate pretty much every dependency we have and replace them with one massive dependency that, nevertheless, simplifies building
[18:09:36] <Lucifer_arma> if we do that, we get automatic android and ios support.  So, if we stick with C++, Qt5 gets my enthusiastic support.
[19:49:30] <Lucifer_arma> I am uncomfortable with the amount of banging I hear from my upstairs neighbor.  It's a bit unusual to hear that much banging being done legitimately, but it's not completely unheard of.
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[21:59:36] <Armanelgtron> will armagetron pick up multithreading along the way? IIRC Qt has built in threading
[21:59:44] <Armanelgtron> would
[22:40:59] <Lucifer_arma> Armanelgtron: last I checked, it already had multithreading
[22:55:02] <Armanelgtron> only for authentication, right? 
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Log from 2019-03-08:
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[00:58:08] <Lucifer_arma> Armanelgtron: I thought we moved the entire network layer to its own thread, as a part of unbuckling the client's ping from its framerate
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[12:39:52] <Lucifer_arma> gotta love it when you're in kubuntu, and you install a printer driver, and it shows the GNU GPL and asks you if you accept the license
[12:39:59] <Lucifer_arma> OF COURSE I ACCEPT THE FUCKING LICENSE!
[12:40:27] <Lucifer_arma> also, it was a printer driver that initially motivated RMS to create the GNU project.  So, ultimately, he won, right?
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[16:30:34] <Z-Man> Lucifer_arma: What exactly would QT give us here? The window management? Or would the ingame UI be built using it? On the link you gave (just checked Ogre and Panda), the example is just "show engine output in QT widget".
[16:35:08] <Z-Man> Huh, hadn't read that before: https://www.panda3d.org/blog/sdk-1-10-0-release/
[16:35:27] <Z-Man> "...and there is even a third-party development environment available on the Play Store for developing Python games on your Android device."
[16:35:46] <Z-Man> I COULD NOT FIND IT, THOUGH, BECAUSE THERE ARE TOO MANY PANDAS.
[16:47:41] <Armanelgtron> Ye man... pandas need to go extinct, right?
[16:47:59] <Armanelgtron> :P
[16:48:47] <Z-Man> They're freaks. Pee while making a handstand so they appear bigger to the females sniffing the trees.
[16:49:21] <Z-Man> Originally carnivorous bears, switched over to eat the least nutritious plants in existence.
[16:49:41] <Z-Man> Well, better than Koalas, eating posion all day, but still.
[16:50:30] <Z-Man> To get them to reproduce in Zoos, they have to show them Panda Porn videos, otherwise they're just too lethargic.
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[21:36:18] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: Qt gives us the ingame GUI, and Android/iOS support.  Panda3d gives us a high performance 3d engine for nice visuals.  The main issue with Panda3d is that it doesn't really run on android.
[21:37:34] <Lucifer_arma> interesting.  Now panda3d had android support, too.  :)  Maybe the PyQt5 android deployment stuff will work for panda3d, too?
[21:38:41] <Lucifer_arma> um, that python ide isn't named panda or panda3d.  I had it for awhile.  I forgot what it's called, though, but search for python on the google play store and you'll find it.
[21:38:49] <Lucifer_arma> It also supports kivy, if it's the one I'm thinking about.
[21:42:45] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: it also reduces dependencies down to PyQt5 and Qt5, since the Qt library has everything else that we need.  If we do the rewrite using davenetgame (which still doesn't work), then we add that as a dependency, but it currently uses only the python standard library
[21:42:57] <Lucifer_arma> I'll probably want a qt backend for it, if that's possible.  ;)

Log from 2019-03-09:
[00:25:03] <Lucifer_arma> so, given that you're limited to 35mph, and it's texas where everybody speeds, is it safe to ride on a 45mph speed limit road?
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[13:40:20] <Z-Man> Humm, the two IDEs for Python on Android I find are QPython and Pydroid 3, none of which prominently advertises Panda.
[13:43:13] <Z-Man> Is there a demo app for QT widgets inside Panda3d?
[13:48:54] <Z-Man> Lucifer_arma: Have you checked out Godot? That would just be ONE dependency, and not as huge as QT. They have their own UI widgets and networking and really everything you need.
[13:49:49] <Z-Man> They're about to release version 3.1, the first RC just went out. Android support is already mature there, though you can't develop on Android itself.
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[23:53:33] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: well, my primary problem with Godot before was that it used its own scripting language, and I didn't want to learn a new one, but apparently there's now a python add-on

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[16:30:53] <Z-Man> Lucifer_arma: Oh, I got to have a look at that, then. The main problem with non-GDScript is debuggability, though. The integrated engine debugger only supports GDScript; to debug the C++ side, you can obviously just run a debug build of the engine in gdb, but I don't know whether it's possible to attach a debugger to python or .NET (C# being officially supported now, Python probably is a third party extension)
[16:51:34] <Z-Man> Python debugging seems to be possible: https://medium.com/@prokopst/debugging-godot-python-with-pycharm-b5f9dd2cf769
[18:03:02] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: I think I want to evaluate Godot by siccing my son on it.  He's still a new enough programmer that if he can make gdscript do something useful, then I'd be more open to godot :)
[18:03:33] <Lucifer_arma> I'll still want something like a python-only server, most likely.  Does godot make non-gui dedicated server-type apps, too?
[18:04:05] <Lucifer_arma> my vision for the server is that it'll be strictly limited to the python standard library, and any third-party modules we use get incorporated into the source tree so that we're not inflicting more dependencies
[18:04:39] <Lucifer_arma> I'm ok with the client having a few dependencies, but I want a toolkit that has both opengles and openAL support out of the box (or at least a solid 3d sound engine)
[18:05:59] <Lucifer_arma> also, is it possible to support python and gdscript in the client?  What i want most from python is third-party extendibility of the client.  That would be a good thing to know, too.  ;)
[18:06:53] <Lucifer_arma> naturally, I'm a ways off from starting any of this work, but it is one of the mental health tasks on my todo list for the future.  After 0.4.0 gets a solid release.  I'd be interested in trying an 0.5.0 release with a rewritten core roundabout when 0.4.1 gets released.  So, maybe another decade or so?
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[22:13:07] <ct|kyle> Version 1.0 coming in 2100 +- 1 centery  :)
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[15:34:11] <Armanelgtron> Center Y
[18:55:04] <Z-Man> Lucifer_arma: As I understand it, as long as you register your classes and methods and properties with Godot (and you have to do, otherwise you won't get timestep updates and such), all the scripting languages can be mixed without too much trouble.
[18:55:48] <Z-Man> Of course, you have the friction, performance wise, of translating calls and parameters to godot format and back where a direct interop would only have to do it once.
[18:58:27] <Z-Man> I don't think a pure <X> dedicated server is a worthwile goal. It would mean that you can't use any special engine features for the gameplay itself, like collision detection or map loading.
[18:58:52] <Z-Man> Of course, that also means not being married to an engine, so it's not all negative.
[18:59:58] <Z-Man> And yes, Godot has headless and server distributions. Don't ask me what the difference is.
[19:00:52] <Z-Man> Even the regular full featured engine can run in headless mode, AFAIK. It certainly can run individual .gd-scripts.
[19:02:29] <Z-Man> Might be relevant: Last time I checked, GDScript was about a factor 2 slower than Python for a simple test, not even calculating prime numbers. Might be relevant.
[19:03:21] <Z-Man> Neither should be put togehter with C(++/#), or Java on a non-logarithmic performance chart, naturally.
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[17:03:23] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: I'm open to using a physics engine that includes things like collision detection and stuff, and for simplicity, using a headless version of whatever engine the client uses.
[17:04:01] <Lucifer_arma> I'm also open to retaining the C++ dedicated server in a prospective 0.6 release, since the vast majority of dependencies are all on the client side.
[17:04:15] <Lucifer_arma> Then focusing the 0.5 series solely on the client.
[17:05:26] <Lucifer_arma> Which brings us to the main disadvantage of pyqt5 is that it explicitly *does not* include anything resembling a physics engine.  The main reason I'm not terribly concerned about it is because a) we don't use any newtonian physics outside of simple kinematics, and b) I'm convinced that the collision detection in the server is already better for our purposes than anything in an engine
[17:06:03] <Lucifer_arma> that part b) represents code I don't want to lose in a rewrite, but it would be well worth considering the overall goals and structuring the collision detection differently/possibly better
[17:06:43] <Lucifer_arma> so a pyqt5 dependency actually becomes two dependencies, I believe.  One for the widgets and other cross-platform stuff, and one for a good 3d renderer
[17:07:37] <Lucifer_arma> most of the cross-platform goodness we get from qt5, specifically, can also be achieved from the python standard library, and any remaining stuff we generally get from any reasonable engine (HORDE, Panda, Godot, etc)
[17:08:30] <Lucifer_arma> Finally, I'm open to saying "fuck it" on the 0.4 series, going into beta with what we have, and moving on, but since I'm not (yet) in a position to break ground on any 0.5 series, and I assume neither are you, we're not actually in a position to do that (yet)
[17:08:49] <Lucifer_arma> (other than the obvious need to fix the cycle engine sound, that distortion is terrible)
[17:09:20] <Lucifer_arma> heh, maybe we should be having this conversation on the forums ;)
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[23:04:42] <Lucifer_arma> it's not a good sign when the test script that comes with the library you're trying to use doesn't work
[23:06:28] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: that always means you are in for a lot of fun :)
[23:09:19] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: or I'm looking for a different library :)
[23:09:36] <Lucifer_arma> but you know what makes it the absolute worst?
[23:09:47] <ct|kyle> tyically my case it's also the only one
[23:09:49] <Lucifer_arma> it's the Official Alsa Python API that didn't work
[23:10:15] <Lucifer_arma> now I'm backing up a step and trying a PortAudio-based python package
[23:11:49] <Lucifer_arma> but then, the big question here is this:  Why in the fuck is it 2019 and Python still has no decent basic cross-platform audio API in the standard library?
[23:12:20] <ct|kyle> heh, sinewav was looking for that years ago
[23:12:29] <Lucifer_arma> we have fucking JSON parsers/encoders, and a cvs parser we don't fucking need, and pickling that nobody actually uses unless they're writing a tutorial on pickling
[23:12:53] <ct|kyle> there is also nothing good for python yo use BLE
[23:13:05] <Lucifer_arma> there's ossaudiodev, for an audio interface that isn't just deprecated, it's removed completely
[23:13:09] <Lucifer_arma> and some windows interface
[23:13:16] <Lucifer_arma> not even a basic Mac OS X interface!
[23:14:11] <Lucifer_arma> but what do you expect when their default GUI is still the most primitive GUI available?
[23:14:31] <Lucifer_arma> so here's an even bigger question: Why doesn't Qt5 provide any sort of serious interface to the sound card?
[23:15:10] <Lucifer_arma> if the geniuses over at PortAudio can figure it out, why can't the Qt people?

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Log from 2019-03-16:
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[14:48:04] <Lucifer_arma> this is both gratifying and frustrating.  I'm porting code from pyqt3 to pyqt5, but the catch is that there's code in here that I wrote back when I first started learning python,
[14:48:21] <Lucifer_arma> and I was coming from a C++ background, and suffice it to say, there's a lot of not-pretty code to revisit
[14:48:34] <Lucifer_arma> I'm surprised any of it actually worked
[14:48:56] <Lucifer_arma> but I'm getting my alarm clock modernized, and I should get an android version out of it :)
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Log from 2019-03-17:
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Log from 2019-03-18:
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[02:31:38] <Lucifer_arma> how offensive is it to use a toolbar as the selector widget for a widget stack?  Like, instead of using the tabs in a tabwidget, I'd use the toolbar
[02:32:00] <Lucifer_arma> that solves several UI issues I have, but there's a voice in my head saying not to do that, but I can't for the life of me figure out why not
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[19:29:15] * luke-jr glances at his backups and sees it getting the Armagetron CVS->Svn migration data <.<
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[23:02:36] <Lucifer_arma> well, I'm not sure I should be going to SMART Recovery meetings :/
[23:12:51] <Lucifer_arma> what is the point of telling google maps to avoid highways if it's just going to put me on the highway anyway?

Log from 2019-03-19:
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[03:52:34] * Lucifer_arma wants to release his alarm clock and be able to say that it works in ReactOS
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[14:27:47] <Lucifer_arma> I love looking at old code and wondering how in the hell it ever worked, and then realizing it was written for python 2.3
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[16:04:23] <Lucifer_arma> I think I had too much coffee, or the coffee I had was stronger than usual
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Log from 2019-03-20:
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[14:45:49] <Lucifer_arma> Good authors of fiction can't be trusted, for they are skilled at telling stories that aren't true
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[16:10:10] <Z-Man> But aren't thy only good ones telling stories that MIGHT be true given the circumstances? It's much harder to take a bit of reality and tell a lie from it that still sounds like it might me true.
[16:10:27] <Z-Man> Unless you're Trump and just don't care how believable whatever you say is.
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[23:27:00] <Lucifer_arma> actually, the first rule of lying is to stick to the truth
[23:27:25] <Lucifer_arma> see, the second rule of lying is to believe it when you say it, and it's much easier to do that when there's a fair amount of verifiable truth in what you say
[23:28:32] <Lucifer_arma> it's also easier to keep the story cohesive the more truth is in it
[23:29:26] <Lucifer_arma> now, on a different note, I have a lot of different ways I can take this UI, and I'm having difficulty distinguishing between what can be done vs what should be done
[23:30:15] <Lucifer_arma> example:  I have a list of sound effects for a user to choose to use for their alarm.  If they choose more than one to use, do I always play them randomly?  Do I shuffle them and play them (in which case there are no repeats until the entire list is played)?
[23:30:26] <Lucifer_arma> do I offer a way for the user to sort them into a particular order to be played?
[23:30:59] <Lucifer_arma> ultimately, I want to have an "expert" mode where a user could potentially chain various actions in particular orders, but right now I want something that works reasonably well and can be built for android
[23:31:36] <Lucifer_arma> I think I'm going to go with shuffle for now, because that's the quickest and easiest thing to do
[23:31:53] <Lucifer_arma> next up: how do I present to the user that this is, in fact, what will be happening?

Log from 2019-03-21:
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[16:49:14] <Armanelgtron> Z-Man: https://code.launchpad.net/~z-man/armagetronad/0.2.9-armagetronad-sty+ct+ap/+activereviews
[17:02:52] <Lucifer_arma> humans are the only animals that look at a sunny day and think "I'd like to sit in a cold, dark room and watch still photos rapidly flashed in front of me while listening to a variety of sounds, music, and talking"
[17:55:01] <Lucifer_arma> if "guns don't kill people, people kill people", then who killed this guy?  https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/country-singer-justin-carter-dead-at-35-after-accidental-shooting
[17:56:16] <Armanelgtron> immediate question comes to mind: how does a gun "accidently fire"
[18:17:13] <Lucifer_arma> yeah, I noticed that the article explicitly didn't place blame on any person for the gun going off
[18:17:25] <Lucifer_arma> it's basically the gun's fault.  It went off by itself.  That's what I got from it.
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Log from 2019-03-22:
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[01:56:22] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: accidents happen with more than just guns
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[17:10:40] <Z-Man> "Gun in his pocket" sounds like it was not kept very safe.
[17:10:58] <Z-Man> I continue to be amazed that you have to manually merge lp merge requests.
[17:11:36] <ct|kyle> wow
[17:11:56] <Z-Man> Well, maybe I'm just not finding the right button.
[17:13:05] <ct|kyle> I feel like it's been a while since I've had to do a manual merge for a PR
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Log from 2019-03-23:
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Log from 2019-03-24:
[01:34:30] *** Joins: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets)
[02:12:24] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1088 Allowed show_position to be used made it more accurate. Was ...
[02:42:27] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1089 Meant to add this on the last commit. If se_bugColorOverflow...
[03:12:40] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1090 Not sure if this matters but changing *player to *p to match...
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[18:46:28] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1091 Added some stuff to english_base so it can be customized. ...
[20:16:48] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1092 Previously only the silence menu utilized the GetColoredName...
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Log from 2019-03-25:
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Log from 2019-03-26:
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[01:41:55] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1093 Edited /rgb a bit...
[04:42:34] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1094 Dark colors can now utilized se_MakeColorValid which was pre...
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[23:01:51] *** Quits: Guest21370 (~Z-Man@p4FE3EA0E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Killed (tepper.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services)))
[23:01:51] *** Z-Man- is now known as Z-Man

Log from 2019-03-27:
[00:52:31] *** Joins: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets)
[02:20:06] *** Joins: Armanelgtron (~AmarokNel@unaffiliated/amaroknelg)
[02:20:06] *** Server sets mode: +cnrt 
[18:56:07] *** Joins: Armanelgtron (~AmarokNel@unaffiliated/amaroknelg)
[18:56:08] *** Server sets mode: +cnrt 
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[22:59:53] *** Z-Man is now known as Guest40601
[22:59:53] *** Z-Man- is now known as Z-Man
[23:01:36] *** Quits: Guest40601 (~Z-Man@p4FE3EF92.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)

Log from 2019-03-28:
[01:15:21] *** Joins: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets)
[12:46:16] *** Quits: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets) (Quit: physkets)
[13:40:38] *** Joins: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets)
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[14:35:55] *** Server sets mode: +cnrt 
[14:38:43] *** Quits: Armanelgtron (~AmarokNel@unaffiliated/amaroknelg) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[14:40:30] *** AmarokNelg is now known as Armanelgtron
[15:49:23] *** Quits: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets) (Quit: physkets)
[20:17:48] *** Joins: Lucifer_arma (~dave@cpe-66-68-59-243.austin.res.rr.com)
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[22:56:31] *** Quits: Z-Man (~Z-Man@p5B326D4D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Killed (orwell.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services)))
[22:56:31] *** Z-Man- is now known as Z-Man

Log from 2019-03-29:
[00:59:18] *** Joins: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets)
[05:34:13] *** Quits: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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[10:04:07] *** Quits: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets) (Quit: physkets)
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[11:25:13] *** Quits: luke-jr (~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
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[20:00:22] *** Quits: theocrite (~Jean-Mari@april/member/theocrite) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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[22:25:42] *** Quits: Lucifer_arma (~dave@cpe-66-68-59-243.austin.res.rr.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[22:27:18] *** Joins: Lucifer_arma (~dave@cpe-66-68-59-243.austin.res.rr.com)
[22:55:48] *** Joins: zmanuel (~Z-Man@p4FE3E2BB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
[22:55:49] *** Z-Man is now known as Guest21775
[22:55:49] *** Quits: Guest21775 (~Z-Man@p4FE3E24A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Killed (tepper.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services)))
[22:55:49] *** zmanuel is now known as Z-Man

Log from 2019-03-30:
[01:25:57] *** Joins: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets)
[07:16:42] *** Quits: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets) (*.net *.split)
[07:16:42] *** Quits: luke-jr (~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr) (*.net *.split)
[07:16:43] *** Quits: danar_ (~danar@botters/staff/adran) (*.net *.split)
[07:16:43] *** Quits: ct|kyle (~kyle@107.191.99.98) (*.net *.split)
[07:17:24] *** Joins: luke-jr (~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr)
[07:24:09] *** Joins: danar (~danar@botters/staff/adran)
[11:55:33] *** Joins: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets)
[17:09:02] *** Quits: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets) (Quit: physkets)
[20:37:38] <ljrbot> New news from bzr: [0.2.9-sty+ct+ap-fork] r1095 Simple solution to disable local chat commands if a script u...
[21:32:50] *** Joins: Z-Man- (~Z-Man@p4FE3EDE5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
[21:32:50] *** Z-Man is now known as Guest63838
[21:32:50] *** Quits: Guest63838 (~Z-Man@p4FE3E2BB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Killed (weber.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services)))
[21:32:50] *** Z-Man- is now known as Z-Man

Log from 2019-03-31:
[00:24:50] *** Quits: luke-jr (~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
[00:29:43] *** Joins: luke-jr (~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr)
[01:16:53] *** Joins: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets)
[14:36:12] *** Quits: physkets (~physkets@unaffiliated/physkets) (Quit: physkets)
[21:32:02] *** Joins: zmanuel (~Z-Man@p4FE3E974.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
[21:32:02] *** Z-Man is now known as Guest91246
[21:32:02] *** zmanuel is now known as Z-Man
[21:35:02] *** Quits: Guest91246 (~Z-Man@p4FE3EDE5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
[22:57:27] <Lucifer_arma> at what point does an AI become intelligent enough that it's discoveries qualify it for a Nobel Prize?


DISCLAIMER: These logs of public chat may contain some content which may not be appropriate for all audiences. Use at your own risk.
Logs from 2006-2009 pulled from wrtlprnft
Format changes at: 2015-08-25, 2017-02-20, and 2020-03-23. Times (2015 and later) should be Eastern.


 
 
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