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[14:35:15] <AmarokNelg> I apoligize if I am spamming this server with leaving and entering
[14:35:25] <AmarokNelg> I'm having some server issues lol
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[16:18:04] <Lucifer_arma> AmarokNelg_: it's ok.  ct|kyle and I are the only ones who are going to notice.  ;)
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Log from 2018-04-04:
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[20:08:12] <Lucifer_arma_> all this ID-assignment stuff is driving my thoughts in a circle
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Log from 2018-04-05:
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[05:05:10] <testman> Sup duds
[05:05:19] <testman> anything new in the world of armagetron?
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[16:37:05] <Lucifer_arma> what is it about python references that I'm not understanding?
[17:00:16] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: they always forget to put what the imports should be :P
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[18:40:09] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: no, I mean object references.  In some contexts, when you do something with an object, it happens to the instance of the object, while in others, it's basically copy-on-write
[18:40:38] <Lucifer_arma> like, in a for loop.  If you do for a in alist:
[18:40:53] <Lucifer_arma> if you do a.append() in the loop, you modify the list inside the loop
[18:41:03] <Lucifer_arma> er, no, that's not what I mean
[18:41:05] <Lucifer_arma> grrr
[18:41:16] <AmarokNelg> CONVERSATION IN ACTION!!!! :P
[18:41:30] <Lucifer_arma> if you do a.someMethodThatChangesA(changeit), then the element referenced by a is changed
[18:41:47] <Lucifer_arma> but if you do a = 2, then the local variable a in the loop becomes an int(2)
[18:42:10] <Lucifer_arma> so what happens if a happens to be a dict, or a list?
[18:42:34] <Lucifer_arma> I checked, and if you do something like a[someitem] = 2, then you get a local dict for a that has only the one item in it
[18:43:16] <Lucifer_arma> but I *think* that if you do a.__setattribute__(sometime, 2), then it changes the item in the list over which you're iterating
[18:43:47] <Lucifer_arma> not sure, I'd have to double check it, but I figured out what I need to know for what I'm doing, which is to use setters on my object so I can change them inside the loop
[18:44:13] <Lucifer_arma> basically, treat it as copy on write, but don't call any setters unless you want the side effects
[18:44:17] <Lucifer_arma> hi AmarokNelg
[18:44:25] <Lucifer_arma> isn't Amarok unmaintained/abandoned now?
[18:44:47] <AmarokNelg> ohi Lucifer_arma - I actually have nothing to do with the amarok project lol and I use clemontine as my media player
[18:45:02] <AmarokNelg> clementine*
[18:45:29] <Lucifer_arma> heh, I'm using vlc, mostly because when I listen to music, I give the song my full attention.  No background music for me!
[18:46:00] <Lucifer_arma> also, I'm disappointed.  I'd always hoped (but never bothered to ask) that you were with Amarok, and using it in your name to indicate so, the same way I use _arma to say I'm with armagetron
[18:46:51] <AmarokNelg> I named myself after various KDE projects for some reason such as Konqueror, Konquest
[18:47:31] <AmarokNelg> I could use armanelgtron like I do elsewhere
[18:47:35] *** AmarokNelg is now known as Armanelgtron
[18:51:01] <Armanelgtron> I don't know how good of an idea that is though :P
[18:52:01] <Lucifer_arma> makes it a little harder to spot you
[18:52:12] <Lucifer_arma> damn, I just found out that whoever took over Lucifer is still using it :(
[18:52:34] <Lucifer_arma> all because I forgot my password with nickserv, and never bothered to fix it
[18:53:13] <Armanelgtron> hmm, almost like how I'm aP|Nelg on the forums :P
[18:55:42] <Lucifer_arma> you lost the Nelg account?
[18:56:59] <Lucifer_arma> I should quit being lazy and register Lucifer_arma, and link Lucifer_original to it, just to indicate that the current owner of Lucifer took it from me
[19:03:22] <Lucifer_arma> ok, I need to take a step back and quit trying to create Player objects for now
[19:03:47] <Lucifer_arma> I need to test the connection maintenance stuff and make sure it can timeout connections properly
[19:03:56] <Lucifer_arma> I don't need Player objects for that.
[19:10:57] <Armanelgtron> So are the passwords on the forums stored seperately for armaauth than the forums itself or something?
[19:11:17] <Armanelgtron> And that would explain why it's possible for a password ingame to be different than the password on the forums?
[19:14:42] <Lucifer_arma> I thought they were stored in the same place.
[19:15:08] <Lucifer_arma> the idea, that I thought we did, is that your forum account can be used to login ingame using the @forums authority
[19:16:09] <Lucifer_arma> but arma never stored your actual password on-disk, just a hash, which is why we support md5sum hashes in the first place
[19:16:21] <Lucifer_arma> because that's what phpbb uses in its database
[19:16:53] <Armanelgtron> Well, for example... nelg@forums (original 2012 account) has a weak password which everybody knows - glen12345 - but it doesn't allow me to login on the forums with that password
[19:17:09] <Armanelgtron> Yet I can login ingame with that pw
[19:17:52] <Armanelgtron> btw this 2013 post might be of SOME help on the subject http://forums3.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=23215
[19:17:53] <Lucifer_arma> the account is probably disabled on the forums
[19:18:20] <Lucifer_arma> armathentication doesn't check whether or not the forum account is active, and if the password was compromised, guru3 would have disabled the forum account
[19:18:27] <Lucifer_arma> at least, that's how I understand it.
[19:18:43] <Armanelgtron> Well it definitely was compromised :P
[19:18:46] <Lucifer_arma> or there's a bug somewhere in the system
[19:18:58] <Armanelgtron> What about the PRECONDITION_FAILED ?
[19:19:02] <Lucifer_arma> iirc, guru3 and you decided it was better to disable the account
[19:19:13] <Lucifer_arma> I don't know, I don't know a lot about the internals of any of this
[19:19:23] <Armanelgtron> When you first register an account, you must login on the forums before you can login in the game, else you get a PRECONDITION_FAILED
[19:19:26] <Lucifer_arma> I only participated in design discussions.  z-man handled the implementation.
[19:19:48] <Armanelgtron> Ah
[19:20:11] <Lucifer_arma> good luck catching him, these days.  He apparently has the worst possible internet service imaginable.
[19:23:14] <Lucifer_arma> I don't understand Plasma 5 at all
[19:24:18] <Lucifer_arma> haha, nvm.  I'm just dumb.
[19:24:34] <Armanelgtron> I don't consider KDE5 that much different from KDE4
[19:24:35] <ct|kyle> starlink should help change the internet in a few years :)
[19:25:00] <Armanelgtron> Of course the obvious: the switch from Qt4 to Qt5
[19:25:11] <ct|kyle> I know that CT uses a differnt database for forum passwords / auth, but thye synck when you change it
[19:25:15] <Armanelgtron> Otherwise, it's a lot less of an adjustment than from kde 3 to kde 4 was
[19:25:15] <Lucifer_arma> Armanelgtron: I'm trying to get back to my old workflow, where I have most of the apps I use forced to particular virtual desktops
[19:25:38] <ct|kyle> (I manually changed it so my CT forum password was differnt that my auth :P
[19:25:50] <Lucifer_arma> and I set Firefox to have a 10% opacity when it's not in focus, leading to it nearly disappearing when I have something on top of it in focus
[19:26:13] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: that's a smooth move.  I remember trying to authenticate in-game and I forgot to specify @forums, and I sent over my forum password
[19:26:25] <Lucifer_arma> took me an hour or so to figure out I had just compromised my forum account, heh
[19:26:26] <ct|kyle> heh
[19:26:30] <Armanelgtron> Lucifer_arma: You could also try using "Activities" which would allow you to have different wallpapers...otherwise not dissimilar from virtual desktops
[19:26:47] <Armanelgtron> Which kind of makes me wonder why the functionality is basically duplicated into two seperate things
[19:26:50] <Lucifer_arma> They say that, but I couldn't find the button to let me configure wallpapers for activities
[19:27:02] <ct|kyle> I actually forget my ingame password, but it's not like that serer is up
[19:27:17] <Lucifer_arma> virtual desktops should have evolved into activities, instead of becoming different things
[19:27:29] <ct|kyle> the database got fucked, and I have yet to fix it :P + we lost crazy-tronners.com
[19:27:33] <Lucifer_arma> but activating an activity doesn't result in any apps being brought into focus
[19:27:40] <Lucifer_arma> awww, that's sad
[19:27:56] <Lucifer_arma> did you forget to renew it?  Or did it come up for renewal and nobody had any money?
[19:27:57] <Armanelgtron> I dunno, Aix_ is the KDE expert here :P
[19:28:12] <ct|kyle> i have ctwf.club and armatourney.net though :P
[19:28:22] <ct|kyle> need to put shit there :P
[19:28:34] <Lucifer_arma> I've managed to keep davefancella.com, even though I let it lapse one year
[19:28:50] <Lucifer_arma> there's a grace period where it's protected from vultures, and I renewed during that grace period
[19:28:57] <Armanelgtron> They both redirect to crazy-tronners.com @ct|kyle
[19:29:08] <Armanelgtron> Which you probably already knew :P
[19:30:25] <Lucifer_arma> I appear to be timing out on crazy-tronners.com
[19:30:32] <Lucifer_arma> does that mean it hasn't been vultured?
[19:31:08] <Lucifer_arma> it resolves to: 66.221.245.15
[19:31:12] <Lucifer_arma> but doesn't respond to pings
[19:32:33] <Lucifer_arma> says it's on a CoreSpace machine
[19:32:42] <Lucifer_arma> a geoIP service says that, I mean
[19:32:48] <Lucifer_arma> in Dallas
[19:32:51] <ct|kyle> actually ctwf.club, points to old CT server and that must do the redirect
[19:33:25] <ct|kyle> 107.161.23.76
[19:33:34] <Lucifer_arma> dave@Herman:~/Projects/davenetgame$ ping ctwf.club
[19:33:34] <Lucifer_arma> PING ctwf.club (107.161.23.76) 56(84) bytes of data.
[19:33:34] <Lucifer_arma> 64 bytes from webchat.irc.gy (107.161.23.76): icmp_seq=1 ttl=51 time=69.4 ms
[19:33:57] <Lucifer_arma> that hostname isn't what you get when you ping crazy-tronners.com
[19:34:12] <ct|kyle> crazy-tronners.com is not longer mine
[19:34:14] <Lucifer_arma> dave@Herman:~/Projects/davenetgame$ ping crazy-tronners.com
[19:34:14] <Lucifer_arma> PING crazy-tronners.com (66.221.245.15) 56(84) bytes of data.
[19:34:14] <Lucifer_arma> ^C
[19:34:25] <Lucifer_arma> it looks like it's nobody's
[19:35:58] <Lucifer_arma> rather, some japanese company nabbed it
[19:36:04] <Lucifer_arma> it expires in October of this year
[19:36:20] <ct|kyle> yes, I noticed that
[19:36:39] <ct|kyle> I may try to nab it back then
[19:38:14] <Lucifer_arma> I could email the address in the whois lookup and ask why they registered this domain, which they're clearly not using and have no interest in
[19:38:36] <Armanelgtron> Better than registering a domain and pointing to 127.0.0.1?
[19:38:40] <Lucifer_arma> I know why they have it, because they want to charge you extra to get it back, but I'm curious what they'd say to me
[19:38:49] <Lucifer_arma> Armanelgtron: that just sounds like fun
[19:38:55] * Lucifer_arma wishes sex.com was still available, now
[19:39:52] <ct|kyle> that is a great IP, all domains should point to it
[19:40:05] <Armanelgtron> lol!
[19:42:11] <ct|kyle> I wonder how luke-jr is taking the crpto selloff
[19:42:56] <ct|kyle> oh shit now they are up, stock market will be red tomorrow
[19:46:39] <Lucifer_arma> if he actually got any bitcoins, he should've already sold out of them
[19:47:01] <Lucifer_arma> in a lot of ways, the bottom is falling out of the cryptocurrency market
[19:48:04] * Lucifer_arma still thinks cryptocurrency is a silly idea.
[19:48:22] <Lucifer_arma> I mean, it's worthless until you sell it back into a currency that you're trying to replace
[19:48:43] <Lucifer_arma> it's like, I could buy an electric car, but I can't drive it unless I install a gas-powered generator
[19:49:46] <Lucifer_arma> and then I need a pack of horses to kickstart the generator
[19:50:01] <Lucifer_arma> but I can't buy those, I have to go get some wild horses and tame them
[19:50:25] <Lucifer_arma> but wild horses are protected, so I can't legally get them, so I have to wait for a new horse species to evolve that isn't protected
[19:50:44] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: other currencies are just as worthless..
[19:50:55] <Lucifer_arma> it's like dating a chimpanzee, hoping her kids will evolve into humans
[19:51:07] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: tell that to my electric company, or my landlord.
[19:51:18] <Lucifer_arma> "I didn't have to pay rent, because this currency is worthless.  Here, have a cookie, instead."
[19:52:17] <Lucifer_arma> shit, you can't even pay in gold anymore, even if you have it
[19:52:28] <Lucifer_arma> "Look, this pound of gold is worth my rent."
[19:52:33] <Lucifer_arma> "That's not the contract you signed."
[19:53:23] <Lucifer_arma> "how about this rare Beatles vinyl that was signed by all four of them?"
[19:53:28] <Lucifer_arma> "Nope, USD only."
[19:53:50] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: found an employer who pays in bitcoin?
[19:54:13] <Lucifer_arma> although, now that I think about it, that shouldn't be too hard, as long as you're willing to run drugs or weapons
[19:54:21] <Lucifer_arma> or be a kiddie fucker pimp
[19:54:26] <ct|kyle> I'd take the lbs of gold for a months rent :P
[19:54:37] <Lucifer_arma> since, you know, that's what 90% of what people actually BUY with bitcoin
[19:55:03] <Lucifer_arma> "Your honor, I didn't so much as murder the clerk as I paid in bullets."
[19:55:51] <ct|kyle> isent 1 pound of gold approximently a years worth of rent (give or take depending on location)
[19:56:07] <Lucifer_arma> idk.  Maybe you're thinking of copper ;)
[19:56:49] <Lucifer_arma> "I didn't rape her, I hired her and paid in semen."
[19:57:20] <Lucifer_arma> "Currency is supposed to be a limited resource of value."
[19:57:26] <Lucifer_arma> "I'm the only one who produces my semen."
[19:57:37] <Lucifer_arma> "OF VALUE."
[19:57:37] <ct|kyle> We need to start using moon rocks
[19:58:02] <ct|kyle> luke-jr: you wanna go harvest some moon rocks :P
[19:58:03] <Lucifer_arma> heh, I'll file Chapter 11 under the basis of "I don't own any moon rocks, adn that's my preferred form of currency."
[19:58:23] <Lucifer_arma> I mean, shit, if we could just PICK our own currency, I'd be fucking rich
[19:58:27] <ct|kyle> chapter 14.5 is better
[19:58:42] <Lucifer_arma> is that the one that lets me choose my own currency?
[19:59:06] <ct|kyle> https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/980566101124722688
[20:00:06] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: I don't do employment.
[20:00:19] <luke-jr> but there's at least one company that hooks up to direct deposits and converts to bitcoins
[20:00:20] <Lucifer_arma> so you're unemployed?
[20:00:37] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: I missed that one.  It's hilarious how many people fell for it in the comments.
[20:00:58] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: I do work on a simple contractual basis
[20:01:08] <ct|kyle> the news was speaking of tesla going bankrupt for the whole week before it too
[20:01:15] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: do you have your clients pay you in bitcoin?
[20:01:32] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: yeah, Tesla was trying to score more capital
[20:01:53] <Lucifer_arma> a lot of pundits took that to mean Tesla was threatening bankruptcy, which is pretty silly
[20:02:26] <ct|kyle> ya, I got the stock last Friday, fell 15 bucks on Monday after that
[20:02:35] <Lucifer_arma> I mean, they're just about done working out the bugs in the Model 3 production.  There's no way elon musk is going to let the company go bankrupt.
[20:02:41] <ct|kyle> then skyrocketed the rest of the week
[20:02:53] <ct|kyle> exactly
[20:03:14] <Lucifer_arma> and SpaceX is not only profitable right now, they're on track for something like 27 launches this year
[20:03:31] <ct|kyle> 28
[20:03:38] <Lucifer_arma> elon musk could take a loan using his SpaceX shares as collateral, heh
[20:03:48] <ct|kyle> Exactly
[20:03:50] <Lucifer_arma> last I read was 27, but I suck at remembering numbers.
[20:04:09] <ct|kyle> Spacex can take out bounds or something with tesla, like the did with solar city
[20:04:12] <Lucifer_arma> but with SpaceX riding as high as they are right now, there's no way Tesla is going to go bankrupt
[20:04:29] <Lucifer_arma> ah, there's actually a problem with the Solar City takeover.
[20:04:37] *** Joins: Z-Man (~Z-Man@x59cc9ac4.dyn.telefonica.de)
[20:04:38] <ct|kyle> spacex needs tesla now, for thier fleet of sats, I'm sure they will use thier solar panels
[20:04:57] <Lucifer_arma> depending on how the SEC accepts certain definitions, that could be a criminal offense for musk
[20:05:08] <Lucifer_arma> if someone actually calls him on it and takes him to court, that is
[20:05:12] <ct|kyle> musk did not vote on it at all
[20:05:28] <ct|kyle> and all common board members
[20:05:41] <Lucifer_arma> it has to do with his leadership style, and how he led the board to the purchase without looking at other companies that did the same thing.
[20:06:02] <ct|kyle> It went to shareholders to vote on it
[20:06:20] <Lucifer_arma> yeah, he crossed his i's and dotted his t's, I know ;)
[20:06:38] <Lucifer_arma> the key phrase, though, is "controlling interest", or something like that
[20:06:43] <ct|kyle> But when they basically were already working together, it did not make sence to go to another solar company
[20:07:12] <Lucifer_arma> right, and they were working together because elon musk (or his friend, I think it was a friend of his) owned Solar City at the time
[20:07:23] <ct|kyle> buying solar city stock befoer the merge, was the best deal too
[20:07:43] <ct|kyle> you were getting tesla stock at a then $20 discount
[20:07:44] <Lucifer_arma> so the question, in the article I read about it, anyway, is whether or not Musk's control of Tesla constitutes a controlling interest, even if he doesn't own enough shares to have a controlling interest on paper
[20:08:11] <Lucifer_arma> no case like that has been brought to the SEC, so there's no ruling on it
[20:09:05] <ct|kyle> except they chared a $50 fee per account for the merge
[20:09:20] <Lucifer_arma> also, the article I read made a point of pointing out who Elon Musk's enemies might be, and the writer seemed more concerned about ULA going after him than someone like Ford
[20:09:55] <ct|kyle> this was around the pad file time too wasen't it
[20:10:01] <Lucifer_arma> but I don't see SpaceX suddenly locking up with him in jail
[20:10:05] <Lucifer_arma> this was a couple of weeks ago
[20:10:06] <ct|kyle> when they wanted to earch ULA's building
[20:10:18] <Lucifer_arma> it was a highly speculative article
[20:10:48] <Lucifer_arma> but with the competition over the next manned stuff, with SpaceX on an even field with ULA (except, of course, that ULA has launched manned flights in the past)
[20:10:58] <Lucifer_arma> ULA has an interest in stopping SpaceX however they can
[20:11:17] <Lucifer_arma> I mean, $90million for a launch on the Falcon 9 vs ULA charging $300million for the same payload
[20:11:36] <ct|kyle> I know
[20:11:50] <ct|kyle> Although I think tory corrected that to ~250 million
[20:11:53] <Lucifer_arma> at this point, ULA is only surviving because of their history with NASA.  If the congress told NASA they had to cut costs, NASA would have no choice but to cut off ULA
[20:12:14] <Lucifer_arma> it's the same number, just different significant figures :)
[20:12:35] <ct|kyle> there was a big twitter war about it
[20:13:02] <ct|kyle> but exactly, I was like still costs more, who cares that they are off by a bit
[20:13:02] <Lucifer_arma> about ULA launch costs?
[20:13:07] <ct|kyle> yes
[20:13:16] <Lucifer_arma> I'm glad I'm not on twitter
[20:13:20] <ct|kyle> when musk brought it up after heavy launch
[20:13:37] <Lucifer_arma> oh, right, I saw someone like snopes do a fact-check on that
[20:14:19] <Lucifer_arma> why would ULA fight that?  Why not just say "Well, technically, it's $250million worth of demonstrated reliability, vs your one heavy launch"
[20:14:46] <Lucifer_arma> hey, did you see that they just docked the first re-used Dragon capsule to the ISS?
[20:15:21] <ct|kyle> that's the 3rd reused one
[20:15:23] <Lucifer_arma> it really feels like they should be close to launching a man-capable Dragon
[20:15:38] <Lucifer_arma> first to be sent back up.  Maybe they've recovered three.  :)
[20:15:49] <Lucifer_arma> or maybe it's the first one that was reused twice?
[20:15:53] <ct|kyle> no, that is the 3rd reused and redocked
[20:16:48] <Lucifer_arma> hmmm, that's what I get for reading mainstream stuff
[20:17:00] <Lucifer_arma> I usually try to read Space.com or the other one, the one that focuses on space travel
[20:17:18] <ct|kyle> that is the 2nd
[20:17:37] <ct|kyle> crs 13 was reused
[20:18:05] <ct|kyle> Err 11, 13 and 14
[20:18:27] <ct|kyle> 13 and 14 both had reused boosters also
[20:19:33] <Lucifer_arma> yeah, they're up to like 7 reused boosters or something like that
[20:19:59] <ct|kyle> 9
[20:20:21] <Lucifer_arma> yeah, something like that.  :)  Didn't the heavy launch have a reused booster on it?
[20:20:34] <Lucifer_arma> I seem to recall one of its first stages being a reused falcon 9
[20:20:52] <Lucifer_arma> idk, I haven't been following in that much detail :)
[20:20:54] <ct|kyle> I've watched every launch live since, first landing
[20:21:03] <ct|kyle> both outer cores were reused on heavy
[20:21:22] <Lucifer_arma> I saw that the X Prize is re-upping the Lunar X Prize, but currently there's no cash prize since google pulled out
[20:21:43] <ct|kyle> although they were upgraded to hige titanium gridfins, the only part that they really planned on salvaging
[20:22:07] <Lucifer_arma> the heavy is still experimental, though
[20:23:41] <ct|kyle> heavy was one of those days at work, everyone was watching it :P even my company's CEO
[20:26:45] <Lucifer_arma> heh, I haven't gotten excited about a rocket launch since the original X Prize launches
[20:27:16] <Lucifer_arma> I mean, I read about them after they happen, because I'm interested
[20:27:39] <Lucifer_arma> and for particularly interested missions (like SpaceX's qualifying run to dock with the ISS), I'll watch the archived video
[20:34:29] <ct|kyle> I remember those 2 weeks of X prize
[20:35:43] <ct|kyle> what did we use for revisioning back then?
[20:36:36] <Lucifer_arma> I think we were still on cvs
[20:37:00] <Lucifer_arma> actually, I don't think I was part of the project then, just a regular ol' server operator
[20:38:59] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: you set it up, it was on your server
[20:39:16] <Lucifer_arma> huh?  set what up?
[20:39:34] <ct|kyle> whatever we used to stach files
[20:39:41] <ct|kyle> for X-prize
[20:39:44] <Lucifer_arma> both armagetron and armagetron advanced were on sourceforge cvs servers
[20:39:54] <Lucifer_arma> oh, wait, you're talking about the lunar x prize
[20:40:01] <ct|kyle> yes
[20:40:13] <Lucifer_arma> I was talking about the SpaceShipOne winning the original Ansari X Prize :)
[20:40:30] <Lucifer_arma> ummm, we were probably using svn at the time, then.
[20:40:30] <ct|kyle> lol
[20:40:45] <Lucifer_arma> we'd have won the google lunar x prize if I hadn't gotten divorced
[20:41:11] <Lucifer_arma> or rather, *I* would have.  :)  When I advanced the project far enough to get people to work on it.
[20:41:13] <ct|kyle> Yes, we cannot prove it otherwise :P
[20:41:35] <Lucifer_arma> well, we can demonstrably prove that the project fell apart when I didn't have time to work on it, because that's what happened
[20:42:38] <ct|kyle> I remember trying to get into physics class at college, and professer turned me down because i had nott aken a math class
[20:42:56] <ct|kyle> later on, I had him as a professror and he vaguely remembered me
[20:43:33] <Lucifer_arma> I remember having enough smart and talented people, covering all the skills needed, signed on to the project
[20:43:52] <Lucifer_arma> but nobody actually having any time to work on anything, or else they were waiting to see what everybody else did before jumping in
[20:43:53] <ct|kyle> we had a pretty good group
[20:43:57] <Lucifer_arma> it was a frustrating time for me, heh
[20:44:37] <Lucifer_arma> I still have all the files from then
[20:44:48] <ct|kyle> I think code ise we were wiating for you a bit
[20:45:20] <ct|kyle> I probaboly have the files somewhere, just have no clue where
[20:46:01] <ct|kyle> that was back at the end of 2007?
[20:46:03] <Lucifer_arma> you probably were waiting for me
[20:46:22] <Lucifer_arma> there were other people that were supposed to be working on physically building something
[20:46:35] <Lucifer_arma> yeah,we formed the project after I went to the XPRizeCup in 2007
[20:46:42] <Lucifer_arma> I got divorced in late 2008
[20:46:52] <Lucifer_arma> so it was really just that one spring semester where we had a project
[20:47:18] <ct|kyle> I only remember it being for a month or so
[20:47:20] <Lucifer_arma> my son wants to restart that project
[20:47:29] <Lucifer_arma> I worked on it continuously until my divorce
[20:47:42] <ct|kyle> how old is he now?
[20:47:46] <Lucifer_arma> 17
[20:48:12] <Lucifer_arma> he's got enough programming chops to work on it, too
[20:48:52] <ct|kyle> nice
[20:50:11] <Aix_> On that plasma 5 desktop thing: I don't think you can configure different wallpapers for different activities but since the wallpaper has become a plasma widget anyways in plasma 5 you could write your own slideshow/video wallpaper using the kdevelop wallpaper template with a lil bit of qtquick  and make it behave like you want it to
[20:50:14] <ct|kyle> I still have to say, my best thing was working on tron while learning to program. so many other people just went to classes and did the classwork and nothing outside of it
[20:51:29] <Lucifer_arma> you could have another best thing and build a lunar rover :)
[20:52:17] <ct|kyle> I know, with that tron server on it :)
[20:52:33] <ct|kyle> (although that would have violated the rules a bit
[20:52:51] <Lucifer_arma> I don't remember there being a rule against having a game server on a lunar rover
[20:53:01] <Lucifer_arma> we'd still do the same plan, though
[20:53:20] <Lucifer_arma> 1.  Write the rover control software to run in a simulator, with a control program networking to it.
[20:53:39] <Lucifer_arma> 2.  Build a physical rover that can operate in earth environment using cheaply availabe x86 gear
[20:53:49] <Lucifer_arma> 3.  Find someone to fund developing the rover to a moon-capable unit
[20:53:55] <Lucifer_arma> 4.  Launch it and win it
[20:54:08] <ct|kyle> with what I know now, damn it makes that a lot easier to do
[20:54:18] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: I let my clients choose what currency to pay me in
[20:54:19] <Lucifer_arma> no kidding.
[20:54:37] <luke-jr> so long as it's USD or bitcoins :P
[20:54:41] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: even if it's "worthless" currency?  Why accept worthless currency?
[20:54:45] <luke-jr> or silver or gold I guess, but nobody has ever done that
[20:55:11] <Lucifer_arma> well, my ultima iv character has 9000gp.  How much work would that get me?
[20:55:23] <ct|kyle> luke-jr: that's the way i would have paied you if i needed your tron seerver :P
[20:55:43] <Lucifer_arma> I'll pay you in a unique blend of copper, tin, and nickel
[20:56:40] <ct|kyle> luke-jr: how many mining rigs do you have now? and have you ventured into the others
[20:57:05] <Lucifer_arma> yeah, there's like so many different cryptocurrencies now, you could own a fortune in bits you can't understand
[20:57:14] <Lucifer_arma> *bytes
[20:57:29] <Lucifer_arma> you could make your own, even
[20:57:38] <Lucifer_arma> you should do that.  I'd buy a luke-jr.
[20:57:45] <ct|kyle> ETH is what I hear will be better than bitcoin
[20:58:09] <ct|kyle> you mean a luke-jr_isanasshat
[20:58:17] <Lucifer_arma> screw that.  I luke-jr creates his own cryptocurrency called 'luke-jr', I'll make all of my computers mine that shit
[20:58:23] <Lucifer_arma> I'll be the richest person in the world
[20:58:40] <Lucifer_arma> my tablet, my phone, my tv, my laptop, all will be mining luke-jrs
[20:59:03] <Lucifer_arma> I'll start taking over other people's computers just so I could mine luke-jrs
[20:59:25] <ct|kyle> a botnet of luke-jr miners
[20:59:29] <Lucifer_arma> then, when I'm rich, I'll go onto the dark web and spend it on weapons
[20:59:35] <Lucifer_arma> ALL OF IT
[20:59:46] <Lucifer_arma> I'll hire my own private army, and I'll pay them in luke-jrs
[21:00:29] <Lucifer_arma> then I'll stage a coup in Uganda, and declare the luke-jr the official currency of the African Union
[21:00:42] <Lucifer_arma> then the world will have to take luke-jr seriously!
[21:00:55] <ct|kyle> We can tax the churches in luke-jr's
[21:01:12] <Lucifer_arma> yeah, especially the false roman catholics!  I mean, fuck those guys!
[21:01:47] <Lucifer_arma> we'll tax everything they do.  Had a baby?  Tax!  Went to church?  tax!  Ate a grap?  Jizz!  I mean, Tax!
[21:01:56] <Lucifer_arma> *grape
[21:02:18] <Lucifer_arma> hell, taxing catholic babies seems like a surefire way to get rich
[21:02:47] <Lucifer_arma> I change my mind.  Fuck luke-jr currency.  I'm going to become the first mobster that beats up churches until they pay us for every baby born to a member of their congregation.
[21:03:00] <Lucifer_arma> it'll be the ultimate racket
[21:03:06] <Lucifer_arma> I'll get the LDS too
[21:03:31] <Aix_> you could also want to help fix armagetron performance on xwayland before all that
[21:03:46] <Lucifer_arma> in fact, forget about having strongmen doing the hard work.  I'll just make a lightning-bolt shooter, and threaten them with the wrath of god.
[21:03:56] <ct|kyle> Aix_: we need some way to fund that
[21:04:05] <Lucifer_arma> Aix_: quit interfering with my plan for world domination!
[21:04:26] <Lucifer_arma> what's wrong with armagetron performance on xwayland, anyway?
[21:04:37] <Lucifer_arma> I thought wayland was supposed to make everything better without any code changes
[21:04:50] <Aix_> ct|kyle: on plasma mobile I'm getting 5 fps xwayland :/ been trying to port it
[21:05:04] <Lucifer_arma> maybe I'll tax wayland and threaten THEM with my lightning-bolt gun
[21:05:19] <Lucifer_arma> plasma mobile?  What OS?
[21:05:45] <Aix_> Plasma mobile - Linux OS a full KDE neon distro on Nexus 5x
[21:06:01] <Lucifer_arma> wait, so the currently supported targets aren't affected?
[21:06:15] <Lucifer_arma> did you try using an OpenGLES compatibility library?
[21:06:15] <ct|kyle> they changed the name again, wasen't that plasma active before?
[21:07:00] <Aix_> Plasma Mobile is a new thing plasma active was really old
[21:07:33] <Aix_> It's the same plasma desktop on the phone just a converged shell
[21:07:42] <Lucifer_arma> did you try using an OpenGLES compatibility library?
[21:09:15] <Aix_> Do I need to set any specific configure flags for it ?
[21:09:58] <Lucifer_arma> you need to modify the build system to use it, I think
[21:10:04] <Lucifer_arma> you might be able to use environment variables
[21:10:22] <Lucifer_arma> the point is, you need that, because your device doesn't support OpenGL the way armagetron uses it
[21:10:37] <Lucifer_arma> that's one of the reasons we can't just port to Android.  We have to rewrite the entire renderer.
[21:10:57] <Lucifer_arma> the best you can do is to find something like Regal (an Nvidia library) to run as a compatibility layer
[21:11:00] <Aix_> I Just used the normal compile and set a xwayland wrapper in the desktop file to launch it with xwayland
[21:11:02] <Lucifer_arma> it's like Wine, but for openGL
[21:11:25] <Lucifer_arma> that's aprt of your problem, then, using the X protocol on a limited resource device
[21:12:47] <Aix_> Could just be xwayland having bad performance atm but turning everything down to low does give 30fps
[21:12:59] <Lucifer_arma> https://github.com/p3/regal
[21:13:14] <Lucifer_arma> that sounds like your openGL implementation
[21:13:32] <Aix_> Looking into it thx
[21:13:39] <Lucifer_arma> theoretically, you should be able to improve performance with Regal
[21:14:33] <ct|kyle> now back to world domintion before luke-jr steals the idea
[21:14:45] <Lucifer_arma> nah, he doesn't steal my ideas, he hates them too much
[21:14:57] <Lucifer_arma> but he'd probably enjoy seeing me lightning-bolt the fuck out of some catholic buildings
[21:15:06] <Lucifer_arma> you know, until they pay me for their recent births
[21:15:41] <ct|kyle> reamember there are only a few "real" chuches
[21:15:48] <Lucifer_arma> Aix_: if it works, and you have a patch for build scripts, we might appreciate having those
[21:15:59] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: that's why he'd enjoy it if I hit the ones ruled over by the antipope
[21:16:16] <Lucifer_arma> I wonder what happens to his particular sect if they were to elect the current pope as their own?
[21:16:27] <Lucifer_arma> do they rejoin the mainstream catholics?
[21:16:36] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: what happens then?
[21:17:30] <ct|kyle> is that what the difference was, I never really figured out why only a select few were "real" churches
[21:17:47] <Lucifer_arma> yeah, they were protesting the previous pope
[21:18:00] <Lucifer_arma> I think.  They might have split off before him.
[21:18:24] <Lucifer_arma> basically, they excommunicated themselves from the real catholic church when they lost an election
[21:18:33] <ct|kyle> I think we make have pissed luke-jr off too much to get a response
[21:18:47] <Lucifer_arma> nah, he's just working.
[21:18:54] <Aix_> Lucifer_arma: I'll put them in a repo over git and share them, will even add the touch screen controller bit I've been trying to get working
[21:19:09] <Lucifer_arma> or lost interest in hanging out here but hasn't bothered to remove this channel from his client
[21:19:16] <Lucifer_arma> Aix_: does sdl2 support touch screens?
[21:19:23] <ct|kyle> Aix_: yay git
[21:19:25] <Aix_> Yes
[21:19:37] <Aix_> SDL doesn't tho
[21:19:38] * Lucifer_arma has been considering switching to git, but is still using bzr out of habit.
[21:19:48] <Lucifer_arma> we've switched to sdl2, afaik
[21:19:57] <ct|kyle> make the switch, soo much better
[21:20:23] <Lucifer_arma> I know there's a mostly functional sdl2 branch.  That much I know.
[21:20:26] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: sdl2?
[21:20:49] <Lucifer_arma> should be early morning for him, he might respond :)
[21:20:53] <ct|kyle> it was voodoo's branch right?
[21:21:29] <Lucifer_arma> voodoo had an sdl2 branch, but iirc, quit working on it when sdl2 got dropped.  But then someone else picked up sdl2, and Z-man worked on it.
[21:21:36] <Lucifer_arma> no, wait, that's not it.
[21:21:50] <Lucifer_arma> voodoo had an sdl2 branch, z-man looked at it and found it incomplete, and worked on it himself
[21:22:14] <Lucifer_arma> that's why I'm thinking we made the switch, because I think we did.  :)  I thought Z-Man finished what he found incomplete in voodoo's branch.
[21:22:30] <Lucifer_arma> it was unicode support, mostly
[21:22:34] <ct|kyle> https://code.launchpad.net/~armagetronad-dev/armagetronad/0.4-armagetronad-sdl2
[21:22:52] <Lucifer_arma> so, did it get merged back to 0.4?
[21:23:02] * Lucifer_arma is vaguely remembering it getting merged back to 0.4.
[21:23:14] <Lucifer_arma> I guess I could do a pull and search the logs
[21:23:38] <Lucifer_arma> heh, no, wait, I can't.  I lost my ssh keys in the computer upgrade, and I haven't gotten around to updating Launchpad on it.
[21:23:50] <ct|kyle> lol
[21:24:14] <ct|kyle> github, would show it a lot better
[21:24:21] <Lucifer_arma> well, it's pulling right now.  I think I just can't push.  :)
[21:24:34] <ct|kyle> ya, usually that way
[21:25:26] <Lucifer_arma> revno: 1574 [merge]
[21:25:26] <Lucifer_arma> committer: Manuel Moos <z-man@users.sf.net>
[21:25:26] <Lucifer_arma> branch nick: armagetronad
[21:25:26] <Lucifer_arma> timestamp: Wed 2015-08-12 19:29:14 +0200
[21:25:26] <Lucifer_arma> message:
[21:25:28] <Lucifer_arma>   Merging sdl2 support.
[21:25:39] <ct|kyle> I just found that too :P
[21:25:42] <Lucifer_arma> that's in 0.4.armagetronad-work
[21:26:15] <ct|kyle> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~armagetronad-dev/armagetronad/0.4-armagetronad-work/revision/1574
[21:26:19] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: nvm.  Turns out I still know how to use grep
[21:26:20] <ct|kyle> that is 0.4 though
[21:26:37] <Lucifer_arma> voodoo's branch was off 0.4, wasn't it?
[21:27:21] <ct|kyle> maybe, for some reason i thougth most of his code was 0.2.8 based
[21:27:55] <ct|kyle> no prior to scripting it was, then me and him both decided to try to focus on 0.4
[21:30:51] <Lucifer_arma> well, I'm still somewhat interested in moving on to 0.5 with panda3d :)
[21:30:55] <ct|kyle> https://code.launchpad.net/~armagetronad-ct/armagetronad/0.4-sdl2
[21:31:58] <Lucifer_arma> considering that z-man's sdl2 merge was about a year later, I'm guessing he started with that
[21:32:11] <ct|kyle> that would be my guess
[21:32:31] <Lucifer_arma> I remember him starting with that, but I was pretty heavy-drinking at the time
[21:33:19] <ct|kyle> hmm, did not realize z-man touched sty and sty+ct last year
[21:33:27] <ct|kyle> for gcc6
[21:33:34] <Armanelgtron> +ap needs those fixes lol
[21:33:43] <ct|kyle> lol
[21:35:52] <ct|kyle> All I can say is github, makes all the merging / branching / forking a lot smoother
[21:35:59] <Armanelgtron> lol yes
[21:36:27] <Lucifer_arma> that's why I'm interested in github
[21:36:37] <Lucifer_arma> I've been watching other projects use it, and have been fairly impressed
[21:36:43] <ct|kyle> I need to do some small open source thing again
[21:36:55] <Lucifer_arma> I realize bzr can do the same stuff with launchpad, though
[21:36:55] <ct|kyle> trying to do at least 1 open source contribute a year
[21:37:03] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: work on my game network library :)
[21:37:12] <Armanelgtron> I did put a little thing here: https://github.com/armagetronad-xtw/0.4-armagetronad-xtw/
[21:37:16] <Lucifer_arma> which reminds me, I should get back to work on it
[21:37:28] <Lucifer_arma> I'm trying to get back to coding again, just coding in general for me, really
[21:38:14] <Aix_> maybe look at Mycroft ai - open-source digital assistant for Linux :)
[21:38:16] <Lucifer_arma> Armanelgtron: were you able to retain all the history when you did that?
[21:38:22] <ct|kyle> ya, I spend all day not coding at a coding job :P
[21:38:40] <Lucifer_arma> heh, for me it's more about this recovery-from-depression thing I'm working on
[21:38:49] <Lucifer_arma> you know, getting back to doing things that used to make you happy
[21:38:53] <Armanelgtron> I don't think I imported anything properly
[21:40:22] <ct|kyle> Lucfer_arma: I basically have 6 weeks, but first i need to make a super simple android app in kotlin
[21:40:24] <Lucifer_arma> Armanelgtron: that's one of the things stopping us from moving to git, and me from moving existing non-armagetron work to git
[21:40:40] <Lucifer_arma> 6 weeks in which you *can* contribute?
[21:40:54] <Lucifer_arma> do they pay you for it, or are you figuring in six weeks you'll be covered up in work at work?
[21:41:16] <ct|kyle> I have 6 weeks sarting now, (nights only) ,but I have that android app first
[21:41:54] <ct|kyle> in 6 weeks or so my night job starts up :P
[21:42:01] <Lucifer_arma> well, then, I'll try to have something in my game network library that's useful asap, if you're interested in working with it
[21:42:07] <Lucifer_arma> night job?  are you about to work two jobs?
[21:42:14] <ct|kyle> yes
[21:42:21] <Lucifer_arma> what's the job?
[21:42:46] <ct|kyle> maintining comunity swimming pools
[21:42:55] <Armanelgtron> Sounds...fun...
[21:42:58] <ct|kyle> Literally an every night job for 101 days
[21:43:12] <Lucifer_arma> sounds like it was a sentence handed down by a judge
[21:43:21] <Lucifer_arma> DWI?
[21:43:33] <ct|kyle> no, easy money
[21:43:45] <Lucifer_arma> it's *not* community service?
[21:43:50] <ct|kyle> nope
[21:44:07] <Lucifer_arma> do you do this every year when the swimming pools open?
[21:44:23] <Lucifer_arma> also, I'm surprised you have open swimming pools that far north.  Aren't you like covered in snow all year?
[21:44:25] <ct|kyle> I have for 6 years now
[21:44:40] <Armanelgtron> North? I thought he lived in the same state I did
[21:44:43] <Armanelgtron> Indiana
[21:45:01] <Lucifer_arma> hey, from where I'm sitting, that's pretty fucking north.  That's almost in Canada.
[21:45:18] <ct|kyle> almost, but not up to nsh22
[21:45:37] <Lucifer_arma> true dat.  He still in Canada?
[21:45:45] <ct|kyle> although he's not in canada anymore (at least lask i knew)
[21:45:45] <Lucifer_arma> I know he had an offer to go back to the UK...
[21:46:25] <Lucifer_arma> I talked to him a couple months ago, last, and he was talking about going back to the UK, but was having VISA problems.
[21:46:58] <ct|kyle> the last I knew was he had a 2 year job shadow over there?
[21:47:32] <Lucifer_arma> well, he spent awhile over there.  But his visa expired and he had to go back, and was back in toronto near the end of last year.
[21:47:44] <ct|kyle> ah
[21:48:04] <Lucifer_arma> he told me all about it right when I was telling him why my substance abuse group was shit and I quit it
[21:48:31] <Lucifer_arma> and that happened right before christmas
[21:49:16] <ct|kyle> ah, I haven't heard from him in ages, but I still got his blog on my RSS feed
[21:49:29] <Lucifer_arma> ah.  I have his number.  :)
[21:50:07] <Lucifer_arma> he's on my "mental illness" call list.  I'm supposed to call him before I call 911.
[21:50:34] <ct|kyle> so the number right before 911?
[21:50:51] <Lucifer_arma> no, before whatever's happening gets bad enough that I feel like I need to call 911
[21:51:07] <Lucifer_arma> nothing like that's happened for awhile, but I did spend Halloween last year in a mental hospital
[21:51:17] <Lucifer_arma> I'm doing better now.  :)
[21:51:34] <Lucifer_arma> but I finally got a formal Depression diagnosis
[21:51:42] <ct|kyle> btw how's the runaway
[21:51:48] <Lucifer_arma> still ranaway
[21:52:22] <ct|kyle> do you still know where she is?
[21:52:26] <Lucifer_arma> she's still doing all the same shit, but she's apparently gotten herself declared disabled and is collecting SSI (which is an improvement)
[21:52:28] <Lucifer_arma> Alice, TX
[21:52:59] <Lucifer_arma> I don't know where she's staying, I just know that she's still in-and-out of hospitals
[21:53:01] <ct|kyle> remind me not to drink the water in TX :P
[21:53:11] <Lucifer_arma> heh, wish I could blame the water
[21:53:16] <Lucifer_arma> this one's all genetics
[21:53:38] <Lucifer_arma> if you met the rest of my family, you'd be all "they're all batshit nuts"
[21:53:41] <ct|kyle> mutated genetics from the water :P
[21:53:52] <Lucifer_arma> family isn't from Texas, heh
[21:54:42] <Lucifer_arma> but you probably still shouldn't drink the water here.  one party state, and it's the GOP
[21:54:51] <Lucifer_arma> so our water quality isn't great.
[21:55:15] <ct|kyle> probbaoly better than flint
[21:55:36] <Lucifer_arma> only officially.  I wouldn't be surprised if we have water problems that haven't been exposed yet.
[21:58:09] <Lucifer_arma> it's disappointing there's no ada support for protocol buffers
[21:58:23] <Lucifer_arma> now I'm thinking about that lunar rover again, and wishing I could write it in ada
[21:58:32] <ct|kyle> I was suprised to see C# support
[21:58:34] <Lucifer_arma> but I feel like the tools for using ada just aren't there
[21:58:42] <Lucifer_arma> I wasn't, C# is pretty popular
[21:58:53] <Lucifer_arma> 99% of the people that use ada are in the DoD
[21:59:01] <ct|kyle> but semi supported javascript
[21:59:39] <Lucifer_arma> again, not surprising.  Javascript is mostly used in web apps and uses json and other http-based rpc messages
[22:00:25] <ct|kyle> not as much anymore though, hell you can make mobile apps with it now
[22:03:10] <Lucifer_arma> they still use json over http/https for getting data
[22:03:16] <Lucifer_arma> I was just googling on that, heh
[22:03:34] <Lucifer_arma> you can do push notifications with it, by installing a notifier inside of chrome
[22:03:43] <ct|kyle> yes, json is still used
[22:04:17] <Lucifer_arma> https://developers.google.com/web/progressive-web-apps/
[22:04:25] <Lucifer_arma> service worker is the buzzword I was looking for, not notifier
[22:05:06] <Lucifer_arma> on my todo list: convert my website into a progressive web app
[22:05:14] <Armanelgtron> "Work reliably, no matter the network conditions" Even with NO network? 
[22:05:21] <Armanelgtron> Also, shouldn't work have an s?
[22:05:24] <Lucifer_arma> you know, since I still have to get it working with html5
[22:05:34] <Lucifer_arma> yes and no
[22:05:54] <Lucifer_arma> the idea is that the service workers would download content when they are connected to the network so that you can view/use/consume the content even when there's no network
[22:05:59] <Armanelgtron> Ah
[22:06:28] <Armanelgtron> I guess I should have uh read more of the page lol
[22:06:46] <Lucifer_arma> it'll alleviate the need to create separate apps for stuff that usually has a web app to support it anyway, like online banking, news sites, etc.
[22:07:13] <Lucifer_arma> instead of installing a special app to see your bank account, you'd have one of these service workers installed and you'd get a button to push to open it
[22:07:35] <Lucifer_arma> by using standards-compliant html5 and javascript, you basically develop the same web app for desktop browsers and mobile browsers.
[22:08:11] <Lucifer_arma> that's what's happening when you're browsing a web site and you get the dialog that says "This stupid website would like to send you notifications.  Allow?"
[22:08:19] <Lucifer_arma> they're asking if you want to install a service worker for their site.
[22:08:38] <ct|kyle> and I always say no :P
[22:08:56] <Lucifer_arma> I do, too, but apparently enough people do it that you could see a 100% increase in traffic
[22:09:24] <Lucifer_arma> so I could go from one or two monthly human visitors to a whopping 3 or 4!
[22:09:32] <Lucifer_arma> I'd do better if I just drew more comics, heh.
[22:10:34] <ct|kyle> don't you get about 60 robots a day too
[22:10:52] <Lucifer_arma> dunno.  I installed awstats so I wouldn't have to look at the bots anymore.
[22:11:13] <ct|kyle> So I'm 50% of your visitors
[22:11:29] <Lucifer_arma> heh, you really visit my website once a month?  I haven't updated it in several years...
[22:11:36] <Lucifer_arma> did you buy my book?
[22:11:54] <ct|kyle> I did go to it recently, and no
[22:12:09] <ct|kyle> I never find time to read books
[22:12:12] <Lucifer_arma> well, I have a really hilarious comic waiting to be scanned
[22:12:49] <Lucifer_arma> it was one of those that I was laughing otu loud while drawing it, so I'm probably the only person who finds it funny.
[22:13:06] <Lucifer_arma> I have to fix the software, though, because it doesn't add comics properly.  It adds them all to the same day.
[22:13:24] <Lucifer_arma> I'll do that after I have a working game network library.  I'll make that my reward for getting the network library to work.  :)
[22:13:47] <Lucifer_arma> of course, I'm sucking at rewards right now.  I have a bulldozer kit to build that I used as a reward for cleaning the living room.
[22:13:52] <Lucifer_arma> Clean living room: check.
[22:13:57] <Lucifer_arma> Assembled bulldozer: nope.
[22:14:11] <ct|kyle> lol
[22:14:53] <Lucifer_arma> I guess if the reward works, it doesn't matter if you claim it?
[22:15:18] <ct|kyle> I guess
[22:15:20] <Lucifer_arma> well, I'm a run to the store.  bbiab
[22:27:53] <Lucifer_arma> back!
[22:29:51] <Armanelgtron> in black!
[22:39:04] <Lucifer_arma> actually, I am wearing mostly black
[22:39:41] <Armanelgtron> heh
[22:46:04] <Lucifer_arma> I love writing code that should work, and then when I run it for the first time, there's 100 syntax errors
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[23:07:17] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: non-Catholics aren't eligible to become pope
[23:09:28] <luke-jr> ct|kyle: building a new PC
[23:09:42] <luke-jr> any idea if this needs an "indium pad" (whatever that is)? https://photos.app.goo.gl/ortJichXxSNo730Q2
[23:10:26] <Armanelgtron> Oh, heat sink surface? Is that for the CPU?
[23:10:38] <Armanelgtron> If so, you can just use normal thermal paste
[23:10:55] <luke-jr> don't know if I have any
[23:11:02] <luke-jr> but RAM doesn't arrive until Monday anyway
[23:11:22] <luke-jr> either way, they say "indium pad", so if that's what I need, that's what I'll get
[23:11:40] <luke-jr> no clue if anyone's ever tried paste on these
[23:12:21] <luke-jr> manual says "If no indium pad is present on the bottom of the heatsink assembly, carefully center an indium pad on top of the CPU."
[23:12:32] <luke-jr> so that's the question..
[23:14:36] <Lucifer_arma> the question is "What is an indium pad?"
[23:14:57] <Lucifer_arma> also, why do people continue to believe it was Galileo's scientific theory of heliocentrism that got him in trouble with the church?
[23:14:59] <luke-jr> yeah, DDG and NewEgg didn't answer that for me either
[23:15:08] <Lucifer_arma> it wasn't, it was his direct criticism of the pope
[23:15:11] <Armanelgtron> I think it's one of those thermal things which come on stock CPU coolers, but I'm not positive
[23:15:19] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: that's what schools indoctrinate with
[23:16:32] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: yeah, I know.  Just like that whole "The US won WWII and beat the Nazis"
[23:16:43] <Lucifer_arma> anyway, Indium is a brand name
[23:16:54] <Lucifer_arma> the pad itself is a thermal conductor made out of metal
[23:17:07] <Lucifer_arma> basically, it has higher therman conductivity than the thermal paste you'd use
[23:17:14] <Lucifer_arma> the question I have is why don't you still need the paste?
[23:17:34] <Lucifer_arma> the paste is just to fill in the microscopic gaps between the CPU and the heatsink
[23:17:44] <Lucifer_arma> does the pad manage to do that as well, so you no longer need the paste?
[23:17:52] <Armanelgtron> So I'm thinking that when the pad heats up, it spreads like thermal paste would
[23:17:56] <Lucifer_arma> if that's true, and the Indium website seems to indicate that it is, then I'd go for the pad
[23:20:42] <Lucifer_arma> http://www.overclock.net/forum/246-air-cooling/1054484-indium-sheets-instead-thermal-paste.html
[23:21:03] <Lucifer_arma> according to that and the wikipedia page it links, the indium foil you'd use partially melts, which is why it replaces thermal paste
[23:21:11] <Lucifer_arma> so, bsically what Armanelgtron suggested
[23:21:44] <Lucifer_arma> and, finally, apparently Indium is an element
[23:21:45] <Lucifer_arma> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indium
[23:21:56] <Lucifer_arma> now, here's a question:  Why am I doing luke-jr's research for him?
[23:22:22] <luke-jr> cuz DDG apparently sucks
[23:22:23] <Armanelgtron> Same reason I did your PCI 64bit slot research for you on the forums :P
[23:22:24] <Lucifer_arma> so, Indium is both a metal and a corporation, heh
[23:22:42] <Lucifer_arma> oh, wait, that means you were paying it forward, and you just saw the payoff!  ;)
[23:23:48] <Lucifer_arma> now it's luke-jr's turn to do someone else's research
[23:24:47] <Lucifer_arma> ok, I'm also getting tired of the period from 500AD-1500AD being called the Dark Ages
[23:25:03] <Armanelgtron> Yea, who turned the sun off during that period anyway! :D
[23:25:13] <Lucifer_arma> the only "Dark" age that happened is about 500AD-900AD, and it's called "dark" because of a lack of written records of what happened during that time
[23:25:49] <Lucifer_arma> there was a lot of technological advancement that happened in those thousand years we call the "Dark Ages", with plenty of social, philosophical, and religious advancement
[23:26:11] <Lucifer_arma> we just don't give enough credit to *how much* work was done because we went from horses to landing on the moon in less than 200 years
[23:26:16] <Lucifer_arma> grrrr
[23:26:38] <Lucifer_arma> this guy writes well-researched video game articles when he's talking about the video games, but seems to have little education outside that world
[23:26:48] <Lucifer_arma> https://www.filfre.net/
[23:27:38] <Lucifer_arma> for the record, Stargate SG-1 did the same thing, but managed to not fuck up the whole show with it
[23:30:00] <Lucifer_arma> "One could thus say that every American citizen, this one included, is indoctrinated in the narrative of progress before reaching adulthood."  Yep, I just called him out on it in this channel.
[23:30:05] <Lucifer_arma> I'll quit ranting now.
[23:32:59] <Lucifer_arma> how about an MMO blend of civiliztion and simcity?
[23:33:13] <Lucifer_arma> you know, where a few people would play at the civilization level, but most would play at the city level
[23:33:41] <Lucifer_arma> well, might as well add county and state to all of that, too
[23:33:44] <Lucifer_arma> or at least state
[23:33:53] <Lucifer_arma> then they could all argue with each other :)
[23:34:02] <luke-jr> you still play freeciv?
[23:37:56] <Lucifer_arma> is the sky still blue?
[23:38:10] <Lucifer_arma> are you still waiting for your balls to drop?
[23:38:14] <Lucifer_arma> ;)
[23:38:24] <Lucifer_arma> my kids are playing it now, too
[23:38:37] <Lucifer_arma> I went after my 14yo a few months ago because he insisted on nuking the ais
[23:38:44] <Lucifer_arma> so I built up quickly and invaded him
[23:38:48] <Lucifer_arma> he apologized :)
[23:38:56] <luke-jr> I use nukes sometimes
[23:39:04] <luke-jr> usually when the AIs are global warming the heck out of me
[23:39:17] <Lucifer_arma> how the hell do you get AIs global warming you?
[23:39:21] <luke-jr> (nukes restore the land quickly, which can then be defrosted by their warming)
[23:39:28] <luke-jr> dunno
[23:39:41] <Lucifer_arma> I barely encounter them using fighters
[23:39:49] <Lucifer_arma> maybe you're playing a newer version?
[23:39:56] <luke-jr> don't need to encounter them to be global warm'd
[23:39:59] <Lucifer_arma> I just upgraded to ubuntu 17.10
[23:40:06] <luke-jr> but I play with a small crowded map usually
[23:40:08] <Lucifer_arma> I mean, they don't even build factories
[23:40:21] <Lucifer_arma> they don't create any pollution at all for me
[23:40:27] <luke-jr> weird
[23:40:30] <luke-jr> even on Hard?
[23:40:41] <Lucifer_arma> hmmm, been awhile since I tried hard ais
[23:40:52] <luke-jr> I do use a custom ruleset, but I didn't tweak any of the pollution stuff
[23:40:58] <Lucifer_arma> guess I got used to using Easy/Normal, since there didn't used to be a difference
[23:41:29] <luke-jr> (I get cannons before muskets)
[23:43:17] <Lucifer_arma> how do you get cannons before muskets?
[23:43:23] <Lucifer_arma> did you change the ruleset that much?
[23:45:57] <luke-jr> http://luke.dashjr.org/tmp/code/ljr_ruleset.tbz2
[23:47:24] <luke-jr> or a diff from 2.5's multiplayer rules: http://dpaste.com/2GZRTBV
[23:52:53] <Lucifer_arma> I would remove the bitcoin building if I were going to play it
[23:53:12] <luke-jr> I don't think I've ever actually built it XD
[23:53:51] <Lucifer_arma> I went ahead and downloaded it.  What version is it for?
[23:54:43] <luke-jr> 2.5.x
[23:55:09] <luke-jr> (also, keep in mind before you can build Bitcoin, you take a penalty from P2P)
[23:55:50] <Armanelgtron> Say, luke-jr, COMPLETELY off-topic, but are you the maintainer of http://beta.armagetronad.net/ ?
[23:56:10] <luke-jr> not since 2009 I guess?
[23:56:19] * luke-jr wonders where that's even hosted
[23:57:15] <Armanelgtron> It could *cough* do with an update LOL
[23:57:43] <Armanelgtron> I like some of the jokes "make you play GLTron" hmmm :P
[23:58:13] <Lucifer_arma> apparently 2.5.9 is what's in the repos for me right now
[23:58:38] <Lucifer_arma> I was previously using 2.5.3
[23:58:53] * Lucifer_arma thinks Light might be running the beta site these days
[23:59:08] <Lucifer_arma> not sure.  We keep asking him to formally join the team, and he keeps saying no.
[23:59:14] <Lucifer_arma> so I, for one, have quit asking.
[23:59:40] <Armanelgtron> I have more download versions :P https://www.armanelgtron.tk/download/
[23:59:44] <Lucifer_arma> on that subject, Armanelgtron: I had a PM from Z-man at one point wanting to add you to the team, but I was going through that mental health shit I mentioned earlier
[23:59:52] <Lucifer_arma> and he couldn't reach guru3 at the time, I don't think
[23:59:55] <Lucifer_arma> did he add you?

Log from 2018-04-06:
[00:00:34] <Armanelgtron> He approved me yes
[00:00:50] <Lucifer_arma> ok, so you have all the write permissions and shit?
[00:01:02] <Lucifer_arma> I would have said yes, had I actually been available at the time
[00:01:16] <Armanelgtron> I guess? I can bzr push :P
[00:01:51] <Lucifer_arma> ok, so when Aix_ comes asking more questions of me, I can tell him to ask you?  ;)
[00:02:32] <Lucifer_arma> hey, do you know python?  Does my "rewrite with panda3d" idea sound fun to you?
[00:06:00] <Armanelgtron> I guess I know python? I've made some pyqt stuff even though it was through that qt designer .ui py thing
[00:07:23] <Lucifer_arma> eh, python's pretty easy, really
[00:07:40] <Lucifer_arma> I remember you saying your C++ was pretty weak (I think "nonexistent" was the word you used)
[00:08:02] <Lucifer_arma> what is your language background?  (My approval of Z-man's decision was predicated on your interest, not skill level :)  )
[00:13:50] <Armanelgtron> Lucifer_arma: Well I know PHP/HTML/CSS/JS
[00:14:03] <Lucifer_arma> that's what I'm remembering
[00:14:19] <Lucifer_arma> you know PHP as an object-oriented language, or as primarily a procedural web-page building language?
[00:14:30] <Lucifer_arma> i.e. if you were to use php-cli, could you build an app with it?
[00:14:52] <Armanelgtron> Well I've used PHP in armagetron server scripting...does that help? LOL
[00:15:11] <Lucifer_arma> I ask because last time I did pro programming work, it was php as an object-oriented language, and i had to work with a guy who only knew it as a procedural language
[00:15:44] <Lucifer_arma> so he gave me a BS api that, frankly, didn't work, and I had to connect objects (complete with inheritance, and what passed for polymorphism in php4) to his crap
[00:16:07] <Lucifer_arma> so, when I use words like inheritance and polymorphism, do they have meaning for you?
[00:16:39] <Armanelgtron> Other than looking up the definition? I'm feeling like an idiot now lol
[00:16:46] <Lucifer_arma> don't worry about it
[00:17:15] <Lucifer_arma> when a certain character came along and gave us bar gauges for the HUD, I posed my "cockpit" idea to him
[00:17:35] <Lucifer_arma> he previously only had php scripting, with no OOP experience.  Then wrtlprnft wrote the cockpit that's in 0.4.
[00:17:48] <Lucifer_arma> so I'm not judging, just trying to get a gauge on what you know :)
[00:21:19] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: reading these articles about the development of Sid Meier's Civilization, I'm tempted to fire up the emulator and play the original
[00:21:55] <Lucifer_arma> Armanelgtron: I may have a way to introduce you to more complex OOP concepts
[00:21:59] <Lucifer_arma> interested?
[00:22:04] <Armanelgtron> Sure I guess
[00:22:06] <Lucifer_arma> (yes, it'll be my game network library)
[00:22:38] <Lucifer_arma> I'll need a public key from you that you'll use to ssh into something
[00:22:46] <Lucifer_arma> and a promise that you won't sudo shit on this machine
[00:26:40] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: it's kind of entertaining to read about how the original civ had "diplomacy".  I don't recall negotiating treaties with the AIs...
[00:31:30] <Lucifer_arma> This is the kind of shit on the forums that I'm moderating these days:  Working Dating For Random Sexual congress or perfectly find someone Spot but at:
[00:31:43] <Lucifer_arma> I almost wish we could have someone attack us again just to relieve the monotony
[00:32:59] <Armanelgtron> I find it funny that spambots are the only users who seem to completely fill out their profiles...is it supposed to make them look more genuine or something?
[00:33:18] <Armanelgtron> And before even the first post?
[00:33:43] <Armanelgtron> Anyway, I'm probably going to go to bed soon
[00:39:11] <Armanelgtron> Say, why not get a better recaptcha?
[00:40:24] <Lucifer_arma> ask guru3 about that one
[00:40:41] <Lucifer_arma> you should still give me a public key that you can use with ssh
[00:40:47] <Lucifer_arma> PM it here or on the forums
[00:41:30] <Lucifer_arma> protip: ctrl-f10 in dosbox gives you back your mouse
[00:48:30] <Armanelgtron> Looks like my timezone on the forums is an hour behind now
[00:49:05] <Armanelgtron> Anyway, sent
[00:49:08] <Armanelgtron> @Lucifer_arma
[00:57:10] <Armanelgtron> So much for waiting until tomorrow; I went ahead and sent another one
[00:57:32] <Armanelgtron> Sorry lol
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[16:40:32] <wrtlprnft> wow. I think this may be more conversation in one day than this channel has seen in the year before
[16:41:02] <Armanelgtron> Would you like MORE?!! :D
[16:42:23] <wrtlprnft> sure, why not? but I was about to go to bed, so it will have to happen without me ;-)
[18:56:37] <Lucifer_arma> 'twould be nice if this channel were a guaranteed conversation source again :)
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[20:00:37] <luke-jr> wrtlprnft: what happens when I show up :p

Log from 2018-04-07:
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[09:08:54] <Aix_> Who says yea for dbus control of player voice control my cycle haha .. too many libdbus dependencies screw that fun project will put up the source anyways ;) - "hey Mycroft turn right or double bind left" :p
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[14:16:37] <ct|kyle> Aix_: dbus is fun to work with
[14:23:35] <Lucifer_arma> it would take longer to say "double bind left" than it would to just say "left left"
[14:31:40] <ct|kyle> just use the wizard hat https://waitbutwhy.com/2017/04/neuralink.html
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[16:24:25] <Armanelgtron> triple left!
[16:24:33] <Armanelgtron> quadruple left!
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[23:02:36] <Lucifer_arma> Well, I broke the computer running my quassel-core
[23:30:17] <Armanelgtron> Lucifer_arma: Hmm, is quassel better than ZNC? ZNC and MSGing people isn't exactly ideal; I sometimes have to look at logs manually to make sure nobody's sent me a new MSG
[23:31:22] <Armanelgtron> I might try Quassel

Log from 2018-04-08:
[00:20:14] <Lucifer_arma> Quassel has the advantage of letting me have one computer sit on the network and just be there
[00:20:26] <Lucifer_arma> then I can connect my various other devices to it and see what's been happening
[00:20:47] <Lucifer_arma> my last logout from here was because I shut down the computer hosting my quassel-core, and then it broke
[00:21:07] <Lucifer_arma> so now I'm using Konversation just in this channel (all the other channels I was in are gone for now)
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[02:10:36] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: ZNC does the same, but more hacky since it uses the IRC protocol for the client
[02:11:00] <luke-jr> I'd love to use Konversation with a Quassel BNC
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[03:02:18] <Z-Man> Quassel's practical advantage over ZNC is that all connected clients see all of the chat quasselcore recorded. ZNC only shows the stuff you missed to ONE client. That said, I'm using quasselcore which connects to ZNC which then connects to real IRC. I can't remember exactly why, possibly ZNC is better at reconnecting and keeping my identity logged in. Possibly just because I started with a pure ZNC setup.
[03:03:56] <Z-Man> Annoyingly, Quasseldroid is not really all that good at automatically reconnecting to quasselcore or at keeping running in the background. Dunno which.
[03:05:09] <Z-Man> And while I'm typing, going back a day, yeah, git and github make decentral collaboration a breeze. It's quite possible to have a main repository that nobody ever directly pushes to and handle everything with pull requests.
[03:28:26] <Z-Man> It's just really easy to make a mess with your local/personal branches, I imagine.
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[13:49:29] <Lucifer_arma> the whole reason I was running quassel (besides it becoming the default irc client for kubuntu in place of Konversation) was so I could have the core running on one computer,
[13:49:39] <Lucifer_arma> and my tablet could run quasseldroid
[13:50:03] <Lucifer_arma> at the time, I had a really shitty laptop that was getting steadily worse in how well it ran, so I was doing more and more stuff with my tablet
[13:50:49] <Lucifer_arma> but I have ordered a mobo/cpu combo to replace the computer that broke.  I think I'll retire the name Dead-Parrot and name it something else.
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[14:59:22] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: "something else" is a great name
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[15:33:28] <luke-jr> lol
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[17:20:09] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: doesn't really fit with the Monty Python theme we've got going :)
[17:21:07] <Lucifer_arma> well, I just ordered a case for the new motherboard.  It turns out that the two OEM cases I own won't take non-OEM parts.  One case doesn't have the ATX hole, and the other has the ATX hole, but the power supply hole is specific to its own
[17:21:15] <Lucifer_arma> and its own is so old it doesn't have sata power connectors
[17:21:43] <Lucifer_arma> but I should be able to reuse my Dell power supply, which was made after the early-00's Dell PSU shenanigans
[17:21:56] <Lucifer_arma> and therefore should (hopefully) have a standard ATX power connector
[17:22:29] <Lucifer_arma> do cases still come standard with PSUs?  I haven't bought a case in like 15 years...
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[19:02:07] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: a lot of them do, higher end cases don't tend to
[19:02:33] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: power supply at the bottom is the way to go
[19:03:07] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: you sugest that name, not me :)
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[05:53:37] <zmanuel> OUR INTERNET IS BACK!!! hi Z-Man
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[07:05:15] <hang3r> Hi, it's been a while, probably over 7 years, would anyone like to jump in to mud puddle and have a crack at playing? ^^
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[13:03:54] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: well, I'm hoping this really lower-end case comes with a power supply.  :)  I have one I can use if it doesn't, as long as it fits in the case, though.
[13:04:49] <Lucifer_arma> my tv computer is finally toast, so I'm having to put together a new computer on a shoestring budget, and all of my spare parts are so obsolete, it's cheaper to build from scratch with all new parts than it would be to cherry-pick new parts to use with my spare parts
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[21:12:45] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: I'm thinking they may have gotten rid of them now (been 3 years since I got my last case)
[21:14:10] <ct|kyle> only around 1% of all cases on newegg have one now
[21:14:27] <ct|kyle> Most of them look to be some odd forms
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Log from 2018-04-10:
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[12:18:51] <Z-Man> Odd, I don't remember cases with power supplies being a frequent thing. Only for highly compact cases where only a certain nonstandard form factor of PSU would fit.
[12:20:35] <Z-Man> Then again, I only ever bought four cases, three standard tower cases where it makes sense to give the user the flexibility to pick the maximum power output they want.
[12:41:05] <Lucifer_arma> the reviews on amazon are mixed about it, too, where some talk about the PSU that came with the case and others mentioning that the case didn't come with one
[12:42:07] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: I guess we'll find out tomorrow.  It's in Ft Worth tomorrow.  :)
[12:42:25] <Lucifer_arma> Mobo today, case tomorrow (also, my new paprika and NM green chile powder)
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[16:48:13] <ct|kyle> I remember getting a PSU, that i could not use with a case, saved it for a while and my neibor ended up buying it from me, but my recent cases I've purposefully gotted w/o, but got a discount for buing both together
[16:57:17] <Lucifer_arma> they didn't sell this case with a PSU option, so either it's empty or it has a PSU in it?
[16:57:33] <Lucifer_arma> they offered a case in the same series, but a different model, with a PSU bundled option
[16:57:43] <Lucifer_arma> which is what's leading me to think that the case doesn't have one
[16:58:04] <Lucifer_arma> not that it matters right now, because I can't determine if I have to buy a PSU until I've tried to use the one I have
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[17:45:58] <luke-jr> I'm not too happy with my new case (XL R2)
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[19:53:08] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: what's wrong with it?
[20:23:38] <ct|kyle> mine is the antec 900 v2
[20:24:26] <ct|kyle> Like it, except the dust screens on the front are a pain to clean
[20:28:48] <ct|kyle> actually got the 1200, (full tower)
[21:23:55] <Armanelgtron> I went cheap; I have a rosewill case
[21:25:16] <ct|kyle> I got good deals at the time, i don't think I paied voer 100 for a case ever
[21:36:32] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: the sides need to be screwed in to stay on, and such
[21:37:04] <luke-jr> also https://twitter.com/LukeDashjr/status/983797453890695168
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Log from 2018-04-11:
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[08:53:33] <zmanuel> Well, either our current water damage is to blame or the technician fixed our internet with spit and bubble gum. it's gone again.
[12:19:18] <Lucifer_arma> sounds like either is equally likely.  At least, that's how it'd be here
[12:19:30] <Lucifer_arma> Armanelgtron: the case I'm waiting for is a rosewill case
[12:19:47] <Lucifer_arma> microatx.  The reviews indicated it would be just about perfect for a media PC case
[12:21:05] <Lucifer_arma> https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ZPWOA6I/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
[12:22:04] <Lucifer_arma> since the pictures don't show a PSU, I suppose it's fair to say it doesn't have one
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[13:01:50] <Lucifer_arma> well, my spices are here, and I think the nm chile powder is different than I ordered last time
[13:01:54] <Lucifer_arma> different in a good way, that is
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[15:50:00] <Lucifer_arma> ok, here's a question :)
[15:50:15] <Lucifer_arma> can I use a USB->PS/2 adapter to plug in a wireless mouse and keyboard combination?
[15:50:30] <Lucifer_arma> it'll be one usb dongle serving both the mouse and keyboard, going into a single PS/2 port
[15:51:56] <AmarokNelg> I kind of doubt it, although I have had success plugging a device into the wrong PS/2 port (it worked in Linux but not the BIOS)
[15:52:24] <AmarokNelg> I would try it myself, but I have no idea where my USB to PS/2 adapter is
[15:56:38] <Lucifer_arma> from what I'm reading, it's not possible with the passive adapter I have
[15:56:58] <Lucifer_arma> apparently those passive adapters only work for devices that support the ps/2 interface already but only have a usb connector
[15:57:11] <Lucifer_arma> I doubt they'd put that sort of functionality into a wireless keyboard+mouse setup
[15:57:30] <Lucifer_arma> I guess I'll just have to wait and see if I have a usb problem, and if so, pickup a usb hub for some of the devices
[15:58:36] <Lucifer_arma> the adapters they *do* sell, however, have to have a microprocessor that acts like a usb host to the keyboard+mouse and interpret the received signals to PS/2 to give to the PC, and vice versa
[15:58:57] <Lucifer_arma> so they're non-trivial, meaning my PS/2->USB adapter probably only goes the one way
[16:02:26] <Lucifer_arma> i just counted.  I'm losing a usb device since I'm gaining an HDMI port on the motherboard.
[16:02:51] <Lucifer_arma> I had one of those VGA->HDMI adapters on the old computer, since the TV doesn't have a VGA plug.  It needed a usb power source.
[16:03:01] <Lucifer_arma> so, I'll be down to three usb devices.  :)
[16:03:18] * Lucifer_arma is anxiously awaiting his new case so he can finally build the damn computer.
[16:04:35] <AmarokNelg> I wonder why they didn't put some kind of passthrough on the USB port of the HDMI adapter if all it's stealing is power
[16:05:52] <Lucifer_arma> it was cheap, is my guess
[16:06:08] <Lucifer_arma> or maybe it needs all the power so passing through just a data channel would be useless?
[16:07:25] <Lucifer_arma> there's enough usb ports on the front that I should be able to plug in our xbox360 controllers without running out of usb ports
[16:08:23] <Lucifer_arma> now, if I could just get the wii to use my PC as a USB filesystem....
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[19:59:16] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: I was able to repalce ps/2 end on a mouse to use USB, so it may be posible that that will work
[19:59:40] <ct|kyle> it's basically same wires, different form factor
[20:32:22] <AmarokNelg> @ct|kyle I think it would fall under this: [15:56:58] <Lucifer_arma> apparently those passive adapters only work for devices that support the ps/2 interface already but only have a usb connector
[20:33:24] <AmarokNelg> A passive adapter should be the same thing as cutting the wires and putting a ps/2 port on the end
[20:33:45] <AmarokNelg> The latter being more hacky :P
[21:06:18] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: yeah, that's not quite what I was wanting to do.  :)  Run a wireless keyboard+mouse combo that use the same usb dongle through a single ps/2 port
[21:06:38] <Lucifer_arma> trying to conserve onboard usb ports, basically.  Problem is solved, but I have another problem.
[21:08:17] <Lucifer_arma> new mobo won't post
[21:08:24] <Lucifer_arma> no nothing, not even the memory test
[21:09:53] <Lucifer_arma> no bios screen, just the fan turns on and the screen says it's not getting a signal
[21:10:15] <Lucifer_arma> or, you know, the complete opposite of what you expect to happen with a new motherboard
[21:13:10] <Lucifer_arma> ok, so, I wrote some text messages with KDE connect, and they're not showing up on my phone
[21:13:21] <Lucifer_arma> how does KDE connect send them in such a way that they don't appear on my phone?
[21:14:59] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: are you sure you got the CPU in correctly
[21:18:01] <Lucifer_arma> I sure hope so, since it came soldered.
[21:18:12] <Lucifer_arma> it's a ASRock Q1900m
[21:18:59] <Lucifer_arma> wooo, these tacos are going to be quite a bit spicier than I was targetting
[21:19:08] <Lucifer_arma> nice, but I can hear the step-kid whining already, and she's not even home
[21:19:33] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: the memory is Known Good, in that it worked when we took it out of a functioning computer
[21:19:52] <Lucifer_arma> it's a supported speed, non-ecc non-buffered stick
[21:20:03] <Lucifer_arma> the PSU is the only thing kept over from the old computer, the one that stopped working
[21:20:13] <Lucifer_arma> so, if a PSU weren't supplying enough power, would that cause this symptom?
[21:21:11] <Lucifer_arma> also, the fan doesn't always turn on, leading me to think that it is a worn-out PSU
[21:21:20] <Lucifer_arma> obviously the final verdict was that the case didn't come with a PSU ;)
[21:21:58] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: which fan, case or PSU?
[21:22:18] <Lucifer_arma> case.  PSU fan seems to be working, but feels underpowered.
[21:22:31] <ct|kyle> that would be my guess then
[21:22:43] <Lucifer_arma> the case came with a cheesy fan, so I plugged in a good one, and it runs "better", but still feels slow
[21:22:59] <Lucifer_arma> the whole thing just feels underpowered
[21:23:11] <Lucifer_arma> my wife's headed to Frye's to see if they have a cheap PSU she can bring home tonight
[21:24:20] <Lucifer_arma> the case is pretty neat, though.  One hard drive screws on sideways
[21:24:40] <Lucifer_arma> there's only room for one optical drive, which is fine because I don't have *any* sata optical drives right now anyway
[21:25:14] <Lucifer_arma> the whole case is plastic, looks like it may have been 3d printed.  :)
[21:26:43] <Lucifer_arma> well, back to dinner.  Can't do anything 'till the wife gets home, and she'll be home late enough that I need dinner ready when she gets home
[21:26:57] <ct|kyle> I think that was my issue with my first PC, PSU that came with case was not compadable with parts I got (ended up getting one locally)
[22:07:43] <Lucifer_arma> this one wasn't a compatibility problem
[22:07:51] <Lucifer_arma> I don't think
[22:08:02] <Lucifer_arma> I think it's a case of the 14yo power supply not putting out 230W anymore
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Log from 2018-04-12:
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[20:42:40] <Lucifer_arma> wow.  In every country except for the US, more men than women are online

Log from 2018-04-13:
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Log from 2018-04-15:
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[12:17:30] <Armanelgtron> Has anyone pointed out that armagetronad.org is down?
[12:17:35] <Armanelgtron> Because it is
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[13:58:03] <Lucifer_arma> guru3: ?
[13:59:38] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: ?
[13:59:51] <Lucifer_arma> Armanelgtron: a whois lookup shows that it doesn't even expire until november
[16:54:35] <Z-Man> neat, quasseldroid crashes now whenever I activate/deactivate the wireless keyboard. The keyboard has a 10 min auto-powersave shutdown... gonna be fun in the long run.
[16:54:45] <Z-Man> .org is mine, isn't it?
[16:59:12] <Z-Man> Lucifer_arma: Modern boards for some CPUs have an extra power socket near the CPU that you have to plug something from the PSU in. Symtoms of forgetting that are what you describe.
[17:06:35] <Z-Man> Bah, Internet is still too fucked for me. Can't get into the server admin webpage. I have to try again tomorrow.
[19:14:05] <Lucifer_arma> Z-Man: this isn't one of those boards.  The extra power socket is also incorporated into the ATX power plug, iirc, being the difference between a 20 pin plug and a 24 pin plug
[19:14:25] <Lucifer_arma> also, this is a low power CPU by design.  :)
[19:14:49] <Lucifer_arma> In any case, it turned out the Fry's sold me a defective power supply.  I got my bike running again (minor electrical problem) and exchanged the PSU
[19:14:52] <Lucifer_arma> new computer is working fine
[19:15:07] <Lucifer_arma> we named it TheLarch.  It's replacing Dead-Parrot, which is now an ex-computer, a former computer.
[19:24:37] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: so 3 PSU's later it's working :P
[19:47:01] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: technically, four, but one of them was questionable and the other was (unknown to me at the time) already bad
[19:55:20] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: pretty sure it's the 24-pin plug PLUS another one
[19:55:30] <luke-jr> but maybe yours doesn't require it
[19:55:54] <Lucifer_arma> mine doesn't require it, but I didn't see any extra four pin plugs in the power supply
[19:56:04] <Lucifer_arma> some six pin plugs, though.  Haven't seen those before, either.
[19:56:15] <luke-jr> low end PSU?
[19:56:23] <Lucifer_arma> you know it
[19:56:30] <Lucifer_arma> tr2 430W
[19:56:46] <Lucifer_arma> good reputation...when they're made well.  Also have a solid reputation for manufacturing defects.
[19:59:20] <luke-jr> PSU I just got has: 1 x Main Power (24/20 pins), 2 x CPU (8/4 pins), 12 x PCIe (8/6 pins), 12 x SATA, 5 x Peripheral, 1 x Floppy
[19:59:46] <Lucifer_arma> peripheral?  Like the old molex plugs?
[19:59:51] <luke-jr> yes
[19:59:53] <luke-jr> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151208
[20:00:22] <luke-jr> I'm using one peripheral plug for the case fans
[20:00:37] <Lucifer_arma> I didn't count mine, but based on what you've said, those 6 pin plugs are obviously PCIe plugs, then
[20:00:57] <Lucifer_arma> I honestly don't want a computer that needs a 1300W PSU ;)
[20:00:58] <luke-jr> typically only GPUs need them
[20:01:08] <luke-jr> mine probably doesn't, but I wasn't sure
[20:01:19] <luke-jr> IIRC the CPUs had their wattage reduced a bit
[20:01:33] <luke-jr> no idea what the GPU uses
[20:01:33] <Lucifer_arma> it might have some of those CPU plugs you're talking about.  I didn't really count what I had.  There's a shitload of SATA plugs
[20:01:45] <Lucifer_arma> and it's mind-boggling to me that there are still floppy power plugs
[20:01:57] <luke-jr> the floppy one is just an adapter in mine XD
[20:02:06] <Lucifer_arma> like, what can you possibly fit on a floppy disk that could be useful nowadays?
[20:02:07] <luke-jr> from peripheral IIRC
[20:02:12] <luke-jr> haha
[20:02:29] <luke-jr> when I first saw it, I was thinking it was a fan-connector to peripheral
[20:02:35] <luke-jr> had to look up what it was
[20:02:37] <Lucifer_arma> my case doesn't even have a place for a floppy drive
[20:02:41] <Lucifer_arma> haha
[20:02:45] <Lucifer_arma> had it been that long for you?  ;)
[20:03:14] <luke-jr> mine either
[20:03:19] <Lucifer_arma> it's been many years since I've used a floppy drive for anything other than just filling the hole in the case.  I haven't even plugged them in when I was still installing them.
[20:03:20] <luke-jr> I don't even have DVD drives anymore
[20:03:38] <luke-jr> my old PC has a floppydrive-sized USB thing
[20:03:39] <Lucifer_arma> I'm going to be finally taking the BLU-ray leap
[20:04:00] <luke-jr> I don't see the point. all I've ever done is throw DVDs into archive until they break
[20:04:03] <luke-jr> never read one back
[20:04:04] <Lucifer_arma> since I only have ATAPI DVD drives, and this mobo only has SATA plugs
[20:04:16] <luke-jr> SATA is obsolete nowadays too :x
[20:04:32] <Lucifer_arma> this is a media pc, so it needs to be able to rip from the media that ships movies/tv shows/video games
[20:04:36] <luke-jr> ah
[20:04:45] <luke-jr> I just download those
[20:04:46] <luke-jr> :D
[20:04:51] <Lucifer_arma> I'm going to pick up a WII bar, USB, and see how well Dolphin runs on it.
[20:05:17] <Lucifer_arma> my wife likes to rent stuff every now and then.  It's impulsive when she does it, but it does mean I need to make sure we have a way to play it.
[20:05:28] <Lucifer_arma> otherwise, she'll usually ask me to download instead :)
[20:05:37] <luke-jr> not having a way maybe kill the impulse spending
[20:05:49] <Lucifer_arma> it's like once a year, tops.
[20:06:04] <Lucifer_arma> we're more likely to get DVDs and shit as gifts than we are to rent something
[20:06:26] <Lucifer_arma> hey, speaking of gaming and linux, have you used Kodi?
[20:07:33] <ct|kyle> luke-jr: After my first modular PSU (A replacement for a standard one that went bad) I'd never got back to a non modular one
[20:07:49] <Lucifer_arma> modular PSU?
[20:08:23] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: each cable plugs into the back of the PSU
[20:09:19] <ct|kyle> so no extra mess of cables that are unused
[20:09:51] <Lucifer_arma> I see that.  that's neat, but not what I'd call "modular", heh
[20:10:12] <Lucifer_arma> I was expecting expansion power boards you could put in the case, so you could configure it quite literally for the amount of power you actually need.
[20:10:25] <ct|kyle> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA8H531D0068
[20:10:30] <ct|kyle> that is mine (i think)
[20:10:49] <Lucifer_arma> that would be cool.  Then I could get a mobo power board that's low power for the mobo I actually have, then get the suitable ones for the SATA drives I have.
[20:12:24] <Lucifer_arma> someone outside is making a shit-ton of noise
[20:12:33] <ct|kyle> I really need to look up the price I paid for this computer, Everything I keep looking up in it seams way more expencive than what I actually paied
[20:12:58] <Lucifer_arma> heh
[20:13:07] <Lucifer_arma> this computer ended up being around $130
[20:13:59] <Lucifer_arma> of course, it's still not "finished".  I need to buy more memory and give my youngest his memory back (as long as I don't forget)
[20:14:05] <Lucifer_arma> and that optical drive, of course
[20:14:27] <Lucifer_arma> a 5.1 sound card.  Possibly a PCIe->Sata card (mobo only has two SATA ports)
[20:14:32] <ct|kyle> I don't know if blu-ray is really worth it on linux
[20:14:47] <Lucifer_arma> why not?  Is it not terribly supported?
[20:14:53] <Lucifer_arma> I haven't looked into it that much, tbh
[20:15:17] <ct|kyle> 3 years ago, I had to go through the process of breaking the encryption on the dika
[20:15:21] <ct|kyle> to play them
[20:16:03] <ct|kyle> may have been 4, I have not really tried much since, I don't really watch them anymore
[20:20:02] <Lucifer_arma> well, it looks like it's enough of a crapshoot that I probably should be considering just getting another DVD drive
[20:20:10] <Lucifer_arma> $16 vs $45 on amazon
[20:21:31] <ct|kyle> actually the blu-ray i played was Tron 2
[20:24:24] <Lucifer_arma> I saw that in the theater
[20:24:50] <Lucifer_arma> luckily, I didn't pay for it.  I told my mother-in-law she should get her money back.  She was mildly offended at first, because she liked it, heh.
[20:26:29] <Lucifer_arma> off to the store now
[20:30:28] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: never heard of Kodi
[20:31:06] <luke-jr> ct|kyle: yeah, modular seems must-have now
[20:31:24] <luke-jr> got Seasonic this time for its reliability and 12 year warranty
[20:31:31] <luke-jr> don't want to risk frying a $3000 motherboard
[20:34:51] <ct|kyle> I never used seasonic
[20:42:30] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: it used to be XBMC.  It's like MythTV, only a bit more advanced in a lot of ways.
[20:42:52] <Lucifer_arma> it also has commercial support, because it's used in embedded systems like TVs and shit
[20:43:47] <Lucifer_arma> it used to have netflix and hulu plugins that worked, which is a primary draw for me, so I hope they fix them so they can work again
[20:45:43] <luke-jr> I used Netflix once. When they mailed out DVDs.
[20:48:51] <Lucifer_arma> they're streaming service is quite good nowadays
[20:49:07] <Lucifer_arma> they still mail out DVDs, but we're leaching off my ex-wife's netflix account (and she gets to use our hulu account)
[20:56:06] <luke-jr> their*
[21:12:43] <Lucifer_arma> there providing a surprisingly good selection of new content
[21:13:00] <Lucifer_arma> they're reboot of Lost In Space has got me, it's quite good
[21:13:50] <Lucifer_arma> I still think they should of taken up Dark Matter, though, because that show was wicked awesome
[21:14:17] <Lucifer_arma> but I guess that wasn't in there plans
[21:24:19] <Lucifer_arma> grrr, I need to be identified to join a channel?
[21:55:57] <luke-jr> depends on the channel
[22:15:00] <Lucifer_arma> the kodi channels
[22:15:22] <Lucifer_arma> I ended up registering this nick, which I'd been needing to do for awhile (I lost Lucifer due to inactivity a couple of years ago)
[22:15:34] <ct|kyle> Lucifer_arma: please tell me you were purposfully using the wronh "there" after luke-jr wrongfully corrected yours
[22:15:41] <ct|kyle> wrong*
[22:15:49] <Lucifer_arma> ct|kyle: please tell me that wasn't the only problem you found
[22:25:17] <luke-jr> lol

Log from 2018-04-16:
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[18:02:40] <Lucifer_arma> dammit, I'm acking acks again!  :(
[18:29:48] <luke-jr> ?
[19:16:02] <Lucifer_arma> my stupid game network library
[19:16:25] <Lucifer_arma> if you ack acks, you get an endless loop where the server acks a client's ack and vice versa
[19:16:43] <Lucifer_arma> so you only ack pings and chats and syncs and shit, but never acks
[19:17:50] <Lucifer_arma> I've fixed that, though, so now I'm back to maintaining connections :)
[20:01:42] <ct|kyle> ack
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[22:05:08] <Lucifer_arma> why in the hell would python fail with a print() call, end the loop the call is in, and NOT raise an exception?
[22:05:40] <Lucifer_arma> maybe I have it wrapped in a try: except phrase but I forgot about doing that?  That would be weird....
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Log from 2018-04-17:
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Log from 2018-04-18:
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[08:02:28] <zmanuel> Well. I hope this time, Z-Man stays. Grumble.
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Log from 2018-04-19:
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Log from 2018-04-20:
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Log from 2018-04-21:
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Log from 2018-04-22:
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[00:06:13] *** Server sets mode: +cnt 
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Log from 2018-04-23:
[01:11:19] <Lucifer_arma> Hey, if anybody sees sinewav, tell him to go check his messages on the forums
[01:11:34] <Lucifer_arma> ]later tell sinewav check your messages on the forums
[01:11:34] <ljrbot> Lucifer_arma: The operation succeeded.
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Log from 2018-04-24:
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Log from 2018-04-25:
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[21:44:59] <Armanelgtron> We're up to our 3rd armagetron-specific discord channel...yay...unless you count mine, then 4
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[23:36:16] <Lucifer_arma> discord?
[23:36:21] <Lucifer_arma> is it a team speak thing?
[23:36:43] <Armanelgtron> eh, well it's something which is supposed to make you ditch skype and teamspeak
[23:36:58] <Lucifer_arma> OSS?
[23:37:11] <Armanelgtron> open source software? no
[23:37:55] <luke-jr> Lucifer_arma: it's a stupid IRC web thing, without the standard protocol
[23:38:14] <Armanelgtron> judging by your post here, you should know what it is: http://forums3.armagetronad.net/viewtopic.php?p=298263#p298263
[23:38:18] <Armanelgtron> @Lucifer_arma
[23:38:27] <Armanelgtron> except I didn't read it
[23:38:33] <Armanelgtron> just saw it was on the topic
[23:40:46] <Armanelgtron> reading through...posts with an s
[23:41:18] <Lucifer_arma> yeah, you probably should have read the posts :)
[23:41:33] <Lucifer_arma> they say "Hey, Luci knows about how the technology works" rather than "Luci knows what discord is"
[23:42:16] <Lucifer_arma> here's a wild idea that we're not going to do because of lack of players:
[23:42:27] <Lucifer_arma> in Empty Epsilon, you have the idea of a Captain who doesn't have a bridge console, right?
[23:42:54] <Lucifer_arma> What if arma teams had a Coach, who doesn't play, but just watches a screen showing what the players do, and uses voice-chat to communicate with the team?
[23:43:38] * Lucifer_arma is looking at other games and wondering how the concept of a "main screen" that's in bridge simulators would translate to other games.
[23:52:20] <Lucifer_arma> haha, North Korea didn't "come around to ending their testing program" more that their testing site collapsed, and they're opportunistically using it to buy time before Trump decides to nuke them
[23:52:31] <Lucifer_arma> (note: I don't want Trump to nuke anybody)

Log from 2018-04-26:
[00:03:40] <luke-jr> I heard they just decided their testing was complete, so they had no need for further testing
[00:06:21] <Armanelgtron> by the way, you can apparently use discord with an IRC client with bitlblee and https://github.com/sm00th/bitlbee-discord
[00:06:36] <Armanelgtron> I have yet to try it though
[00:10:09] <Lucifer_arma> luke-jr: there's an article on Time that just went up saying that Chinese geologists have determined the test site collapsed
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Log from 2018-04-27:
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Log from 2018-04-28:
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[11:26:52] *** Quits: Guest57901823 (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[16:39:37] *** Quits: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[16:39:53] *** Joins: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net)
[18:37:18] *** Joins: Guest57901823 (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net)
[18:38:00] *** Quits: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[22:00:57] *** Z-Man is now known as Guest28723
[22:00:57] *** Joins: zmanuel (~Z-Man@p5B326836.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
[22:00:58] *** Quits: Guest28723 (~Z-Man@p4FE3ED55.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Killed (cherryh.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services)))
[22:00:58] *** zmanuel is now known as Z-Man
[22:39:23] *** Joins: zmanuel (~Z-Man@p5B326810.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
[22:39:24] *** Quits: Z-Man (~Z-Man@p5B326836.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Killed (rajaniemi.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services)))
[22:39:24] *** zmanuel is now known as Z-Man

Log from 2018-04-29:
[02:33:22] *** Joins: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net)
[02:34:04] *** Quits: Guest57901823 (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[13:08:49] *** Quits: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[13:08:59] *** Joins: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net)
[19:48:27] *** Quits: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[19:48:40] *** Joins: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net)
[21:16:12] *** Joins: zmanuel (~Z-Man@p5B32681B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
[21:16:12] *** Quits: Z-Man (~Z-Man@p5B326810.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Killed (barjavel.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services)))
[21:16:12] *** zmanuel is now known as Z-Man

Log from 2018-04-30:
[00:21:57] *** Joins: Guest57901823 (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net)
[00:22:37] *** Quits: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[08:11:41] *** Joins: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net)
[08:11:43] *** Quits: Guest57901823 (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[08:57:50] *** Quits: ljrbot (~supybot-l@unaffiliated/luke-jr/bot/ljrbot) (Disconnected by services)
[08:58:39] *** Joins: ljrbot` (~supybot-l@2001:470:88ff:2e::1)
[08:58:57] *** Quits: ljrbot` (~supybot-l@2001:470:88ff:2e::1) (Excess Flood)
[08:59:54] *** Joins: ljrbot (~supybot-l@unaffiliated/luke-jr/bot/ljrbot)
[11:05:16] *** Quits: Aix_ (Aix@gateway/shell/panicbnc/x-kxwqzkmodapxhnyg) (Quit: PanicBNC - http://PanicBNC.net)
[11:17:14] *** Joins: Aix_ (Aix@gateway/shell/panicbnc/x-dwanohwfqaabdlat)
[12:30:36] *** Quits: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[12:30:46] *** Joins: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net)
[19:07:23] *** Joins: Guest57901823 (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net)
[19:08:33] *** Quits: Long_Shoota (LS@cpc76132-clif11-2-0-cust623.12-4.cable.virginm.net) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[21:04:39] *** Joins: cjg (~cjg@mail.paektu.ee)
[21:15:27] *** Joins: zmanuel (~Z-Man@p5B326A87.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
[21:15:27] *** Z-Man is now known as Guest91288
[21:15:27] *** Quits: Guest91288 (~Z-Man@p5B32681B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Killed (tolkien.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services)))
[21:15:27] *** zmanuel is now known as Z-Man

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Credits

• Website was created by nelg
• Design:
» Layout is loosely based on an old design by Durf.
» Icons on the tools page were originally by Royce, new icons added will try to follow some of the design language.
» Various other icon selections include icons from Crystal, crystalsvg, oxygen, and breeze icon themes.
» Other icons: fontawesome

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About ArmaNelgTron.tk

is a site that has tools, maps, and other various items. It orignally only existed as a server control panel, but I slowly began adding stuff such as a homepage and tools.

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